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Should I have called on the river? Should I have called on the river?

06-26-2022 , 06:33 PM
Should I have called on the river? Quote
06-29-2022 , 10:55 PM
Raise preflop, fold turn
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-12-2022 , 10:06 AM
the check pre is good, there's a strong chance if you iso here OOP you'll get action and post flop in a bloated pot out of position will be awkward. As far as post flop goes, our hand is a bluff catcher on the river. What is worst hand he bets for value? Im not even sure a7 takes this line turn + river, so im inclined to think its AJ+ (which is hard since he'd raise AJ AQ AK) so suddenly its unlikely vilain has an Ace for value and is going to be very T+ value laden. Next id ask what bluffs they might have- missed draws are first place I look, so perhaps they turned diamonds and missed river (unlikely) or maybe a missed straight draw, problem is there arent a ton of naked J's they can have (KJ is it cause QJ gets there on river)

I dig your fold quite a bit, struggling to find what bluffs they might have and they'll likely show up with JT+ a lot here. To prior comment, turn fold feels bit tight with the small price and draw heavy board but I get their sentiment that even if the river is a brick, we aren't wild about calling off! Always trying to think two streets ahead is very advantageous for us.
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-13-2022 , 11:59 AM
Thanks so much for this. Your thought process was really helpful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Dean221
the check pre is good, there's a strong chance if you iso here OOP you'll get action and post flop in a bloated pot out of position will be awkward. As far as post flop goes, our hand is a bluff catcher on the river. What is worst hand he bets for value? Im not even sure a7 takes this line turn + river, so im inclined to think its AJ+ (which is hard since he'd raise AJ AQ AK) so suddenly its unlikely vilain has an Ace for value and is going to be very T+ value laden. Next id ask what bluffs they might have- missed draws are first place I look, so perhaps they turned diamonds and missed river (unlikely) or maybe a missed straight draw, problem is there arent a ton of naked J's they can have (KJ is it cause QJ gets there on river)

I dig your fold quite a bit, struggling to find what bluffs they might have and they'll likely show up with JT+ a lot here. To prior comment, turn fold feels bit tight with the small price and draw heavy board but I get their sentiment that even if the river is a brick, we aren't wild about calling off! Always trying to think two streets ahead is very advantageous for us.
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-13-2022 , 12:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chayet
Thanks so much for this. Your thought process was really helpful.
You're very welcome! A thought practice I like implementing- any time you find yourself between two sub-optimal decision points, then that typically means we made a mistake at the prior decision juncture (I don't however think that's the case here seeing as there's no way we can fold to that small turn bet and raising would be nonsensical) Same logic goes for the flop and preflop, don't see any way you avoid this situation so I think your process up to river was good and couldn't fault you for going either way really.
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-13-2022 , 05:32 PM
Awesome!
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-19-2022 , 07:13 AM
Preflop
No reason to isolate against three limpers with this hand, when two of them have position on us, so I would also take a free flop.

Flop
You flopped a marginal top pair, and my preferred play is to bet out and take control of the hand. It does not need to be very large, something like, what he bet, is completely fine. Yes someone could have you outkicked, but since its a limped pot, I will discount strong aces like AJ-AK quite a bit and also 99-TT, because I think, those hands would mostly be raised preflop. And if someone have A4-A8, the board will often counterfeit their kicker, so that you end up chopping.

So because its a limped pot, the value of a rag ace goes up quite a bit, and I think, you can bet here for value and equity denial. And also a little bit for information, because when you bet, you are asking the other players a question, and depending on the answer, you can sometimes get out cheap. Like if for instance there are two calls, and then SB comes in for a big check-raise. Or if everyone fold, the hand is over, which is also a totally fine outcome. I just think, betting out yourself makes the hand easier to play, so that would be my preferred line rather than check and usually end up playing a guessing game out of position.

Turn
As played I dont see any other option than calling again, especially when he bet so small.

River
8s is not a total brick, since it bring in the QJ straightdraw, and J8/87 are now paired up, which mean they are probably more likely to take a free showdown than continue bluffing. So if you call, you are hoping to see some completely random bluff or chop against A2-A9. Its a tough spot, because you kind of underrepped your hand and showed weakness the whole time, so it feels like, you should bluffcatch this river. But all in all I think, its an ok fold.
Should I have called on the river? Quote
07-19-2022 , 02:18 PM
Betting first post flop definitely sounds like a better strategy here. I appreciate you breaking it down for me. And yeah I also agree that I look pretty weak by the river as I was more passive than I could have been. Thanks a lot!
Should I have called on the river? Quote

      
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