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01-05-2015 , 10:27 PM
Thoughts on play here? Also thoughts on small blind's play? Bovada tourney, blinds 2,500/5k, ante 500



    Poker Stars, $10 Buy-in (2,500/5,000 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #33877411

    Hero (UTG+2): 92,356 (18.5 bb)
    MP1: 123,297 (24.7 bb)
    MP2: 171,870 (34.4 bb)
    MP3: 83,940 (16.8 bb)
    CO: 93,266 (18.7 bb)
    BTN: 77,088 (15.4 bb)
    SB: 103,466 (20.7 bb)
    BB: 78,169 (15.6 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with Q Q
    Hero raises to 15,000, 5 folds, SB calls 12,500, BB calls 10,000

    Spoiler:
    Flop: (45,000) 7 9 5 (3 players)
    SB bets 49,000, BB folds, Hero raises to 76,856, SB folds

    Results: 143,000 pot
    Final Board: 7 9 5
    Hero mucked Q Q and won 147,000 (83,000 net)
    SB mucked AT and lost (-64,000 net)
    BB mucked QT and lost (-15,000 net)



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    QQ Quote
    01-06-2015 , 07:24 AM
    Smaller pre. Flop is nobrainer shove. LOL @ SB:s b/f with AT here.
    QQ Quote
    01-06-2015 , 10:01 AM
    preflop 2x and flop ofc shove
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    01-06-2015 , 11:26 AM
    You should stop 3xing pre when the antes come into play or when you get below 50ish bb.
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    01-06-2015 , 11:53 AM
    Yer as above sed 3x from UTG+2 with 18bb is not good would put a bid red flag out to me if I was villain . Easy shove on flop
    QQ Quote
    01-06-2015 , 05:08 PM
    Id rather shove pre
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 08:17 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BicycleRepairMan
    Id rather shove pre
    Shove if I am shorter, yes, but wanted a chance to bail if I caught a bad flop like AAx, AKx, KKx, etc.

    As for SB, certainly a strange decision to pot-commit then fold.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 08:22 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BicycleRepairMan
    Id rather shove pre
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rzw
    Shove if I am shorter but wanted a chance to bail if I caught a bad flop like AAx, AKx, KKx, etc.
    Don't shove, but your reasoning for not shoving is flawed. The reason we don't shove is that we want lesser hands to call or raise. Obv when we shove some lesser hands still call, but you get the point. Sure we can bail if we get multiple callers and bad flop and face lot of action.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 08:27 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nonsimplesimon
    You should stop 3xing pre when the antes come into play or when you get below 50ish bb.
    I don't want to hijack the thread, but why is that so? Wouldn't antes mean that you need to bet bigger in order to make odds for calling lower for BB?

    If you bet 2xBB then BB has something like 1 to 6 odds to call with antes compared to 1 to 3.5 without antes.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 08:55 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Puzo
    Don't shove, but your reasoning for not shoving is flawed. The reason we don't shove is that we want lesser hands to call or raise. Obv when we shove some lesser hands still call, but you get the point. Sure we can bail if we get multiple callers and bad flop and face lot of action.
    Fair enough, but when I raise pre I like to keep villains guessing. Recently I raised to 3x with JTs in a B&M tourney and doubled up - in level 1, no less - when the flop came down 987 rainbow. I bet 200, villain raised to 600, I raised to 1500, he made it 4k, I shoved.

    Last edited by rzw; 01-07-2015 at 09:00 AM.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 08:58 AM
    @ropecore: minraising with antes gives you better odds to steal pre (also helps with potcontrol post). And people don't adjust their post-ante calling ranges nearly as much as they should.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 10:19 AM
    how do you know what they have? sb is obv ******ed.
    QQ Quote
    01-07-2015 , 01:44 PM
    after 24 hrs you can find out other players hole cards, normal Bovada procedure.
    QQ Quote
    03-01-2015 , 12:50 PM
    Full breakdown on the flop:

    ProPokerTools Hold'em Simulation
    528 trials (Exhaustive)
    board: 7 9 5
    dead cards: 9 6 3 4 3 5 8 2 K 5
    QQ Quote
    03-02-2015 , 01:22 AM
    i might have a flawed perspective on this(And let me know what you think), but....

    as played...raise p/f to 10k-12k. Other than that its WP. Later on in tourneys you don't need to raise 3x. 2-2.25x is fine. So many people 2x it at this stage that 2.2-2.4 might weed out all the hands that you can.

    however. With this many stacks from 15-20bb, and with you in EP...and with you with the mindset that you clearly are going to get this in preflop if it gets to that point unless there are like 5 all ins before hand....then....

    This is one of those times I would probably just limp, shove. Chances are you'll get someone who has a hand worth raising, and you can catch them offguard. From my experience it is really hard to raise/fold with 15-18 bb unless you have a really good read.

    If only callers pre-flop....shove on aceless/kingless flop and hope for the best. Worst case scenario you run into trips, but if someone calls with top pair, you're good, and if they call with 2p you still have several outs. If there are aces/kings/both, you are still in good shape with 17bb. You're in a situation where everyone is pretty much even. I don't really like limp raising on the reg, but if there is a situation for this I like this one...especially if you haven't seen it on your table yet.

    Last edited by SuitedGarbage; 03-02-2015 at 01:33 AM.
    QQ Quote
    03-02-2015 , 01:29 AM
    shoving flop is fine as played.
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    03-02-2015 , 03:12 AM
    why is this a thread
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    03-02-2015 , 01:12 PM
    Quote:
    why is this a thread
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    03-02-2015 , 01:15 PM
    now it's a thread because how did OP know what Vs had?
    Quote:
    after 24 hrs you can find out other players hole cards, normal Bovada procedure
    but then
    Quote:
    Poker Stars, $10 Buy-in (2,500/5,000 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
    QQ Quote
    03-02-2015 , 02:19 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nonsimplesimon
    You should stop 3xing pre when the antes come into play or when you get below 50ish bb.
    ^ don't listen to this OP. keep on 3x'ing.
    QQ Quote
    03-02-2015 , 04:01 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by smokybacon
    ^ don't listen to this OP. keep on 3x'ing.
    really depends on the table composition, stack sizes, etc. imo
    QQ Quote
    03-02-2015 , 04:27 PM
    I think smokybacon is just afraid that all small stake players suddenly start reading 2+2 posts and stop 3x'ing
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