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09-10-2011 , 01:14 PM

fivetypes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,058

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $50(BB) Replayer
SB ($10,025)
BB ($10,000)
Hero ($10,000)
UTG+1 ($10,425)
UTG+2 ($10,000)
MP1 ($10,000)
MP2 ($9,575)
CO ($9,900)
BTN ($10,075)

Dealt to Hero K

Hero raises to $150, fold, fold, fold, MP2 raises to $1,000, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $2,650, MP2 raises to $9,575 (AI), Hero calls $6,925

Villain is Russian. 2k games at $8 abi. -$5k

50fo

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09-10-2011 , 01:18 PM

sunnydunerz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 6,319

wowzers. fold pre m8

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09-10-2011 , 01:21 PM

fivetypes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,058

Even though spazzes gonna spazz?

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09-10-2011 , 01:35 PM

Henjon

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 469

Quote:

Originally Posted by fivetypes

Even though spazzes gonna spazz?

You have AK man. Even if he has some bizarre 98s hand you won't be much of a favourite. This play only benefits the other players in the tournament, since you'll leek equity to them. Getting it in here 200bb deep is nothing but bad for you.

At most I might call his 3-bet and basically play fit-or-fold OTF. But the best play is to fold. You only lost 3bb and will have plenty of time to get better reads on this player and seek a better spot to play back if he continues to make moves like this one.

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09-10-2011 , 01:44 PM

fivetypes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,058

Yeah I know how AK plays v certain hands/ranges. I just thought this guy was gonna show up with some pretty wide funky stuff, and such a big field it was ok?

Dont get me wrong, I normally fold, but the fact hes lost 10bb already somehow, and makes this ridiculous 3bet, then coupled with his results convinced me.

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09-10-2011 , 02:04 PM

furo

deviation of equilibrium

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 29,639

unfoldable vs russian without more info. either that or flat and play it OOP.

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09-10-2011 , 03:14 PM

phos77

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 5,496

spew

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09-10-2011 , 04:53 PM

ssnyc

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 38,129

Freaking math-o-nits...did you forget that poker is a gamblers game. I wouldn't do it everytime but sometimes we can just get em in

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09-10-2011 , 06:34 PM

Henjon

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 469

Must be a dream to be a real god LAG-player on Pokerstars if you're from Russia. It seems people believe they're all spewing all the time, so tons of value to gain from tilted Europeans and Americans who call waaaaaay to light :-)

(Russians are NOT Europeans in my book and as a Swede I have a history based gut instinct to mistrust this country so this is absolutely not a defense speech for Russian poker lagtards :-) )

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09-10-2011 , 06:55 PM

#10

phos77

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 5,496

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssnyc

Freaking math-o-nits...did you forget that poker is a gamblers game.

stellar analysis ssnyc

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09-10-2011 , 06:56 PM

#11

Sven2812

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1,401

Quote:

Originally Posted by fivetypes

Villain is Russian. 2k games at $8 abi. -$5k

C'mon ppl we have to get it in here.

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09-11-2011 , 10:11 AM

#12

gregz41

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Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 8,609

Pokers made me develop an unaturally strong hatred for russians. but yeah get it in.

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09-11-2011 , 06:40 PM

#13

BC62

adept

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,081

lol and call

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09-11-2011 , 07:06 PM

#14

unrealzeal

banned

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 13,990

sick

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09-11-2011 , 07:41 PM

#15

Chuck Bass

World's Most Interesting Procrastinator

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 9,485

That looks really awful, i'm not getting that in readless in a million years unless it's like $5

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09-12-2011 , 02:12 AM

#16

CaliStyle

See my staking thread

Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 4,356

Do you have stats on him from previous play? If not just fold to the 3-bet. Although I don't think getting it in is terrible just seems unnecessary for you to get it in here with your edge over the field.

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09-12-2011 , 11:30 AM

#17

Texas Chuck

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Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 6,237

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssnyc

Freaking math-o-nits...did you forget that poker is a gamblers game. I wouldn't do it everytime but sometimes we can just get em in

Ill take it a step further and say this guy is going to donate all his chips and hes going to do it fast. Here I am being offered a great chance to get em and so Im willing to grab em. I doubt we are a dog to his range but even if we are Im not folding.

Last edited by Texas Chuck; 09-12-2011 at 11:32 AM. Reason: and this mentality is part of my "edge"

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09-12-2011 , 11:39 AM

#18

The_Stro_Sho

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 4,444

Even against 99+ all suited broadways and AQo we have 54.5% equity. Pretty lol how ppl itt talk themselves into it being sth other than horrible. Im assuming its the 215 or 109 WCOOP and villain has an 8$ ABI.

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09-12-2011 , 12:10 PM

#19

Texas Chuck

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Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 6,237

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Stro_Sho

I think its more like this--its pretty much impossible to give him a range where AK doesnt have around 50/50 equity. Now take the fact that we have a 50%+ chance of winning 200bbs or we can fold and now have a 12.5% chance of getting a big portion of his chips. Blah blah u cant win a tournament on the first hand but you can lose it blah blah blah. A massive stack in the hands of an agressive skilled player is worth quite a bit. Now if after doubling I was still going to play ABC poker waiting for the antes to kick in then yeah folding is probably better.

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09-12-2011 , 01:08 PM

#20

fivetypes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,058

I actually think its pretty bad too, but I made a bad decision. I thought his get it in range will be pretty wide (enough for it not to be a mistake without taking the rest of the mtt into account) and that these sorts of players will flat their AX hands and often fold the flop if they miss. Which happens often.

Anyway he had tens and hit quads, so that showed me.

Spoiler:

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09-12-2011 , 01:11 PM

#21

ssnyc

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 38,129

Quote:

Originally Posted by fivetypes

Spoiler:

standard stupid forum question but if we win the race vs 10s do we still think it is spew?

Also if he is wide enough to have 1010 for that many BB what range can we now assign him IYO?

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09-12-2011 , 01:22 PM

#22

fivetypes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,058

Yes I think its spew regardless just because of structure/stack depth/field softicity

I knew it was bad, but wanted to post it cos these sorts of threads are always funny eye-opening with peoples differing views

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09-12-2011 , 01:27 PM

#23

Dr. Doomswitch

adept

Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 882

*Grunch
4bet/fold would be ridiculous. AP call.

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09-12-2011 , 01:37 PM

#24

ssnyc

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 38,129

Quote:

Originally Posted by fivetypes

ok but based on results do you agree that his range is wider than we would expect?

if so we are back to deciding what edge is worth passing up in an MTT...

I also kind of agree with Chuck in that if you are the type of player to utilize a huge stack well then there are merits to taking an early chance to get one. If having those extra BB will not change your style of play then the spot is less of a consideration

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09-12-2011 , 01:46 PM

#25

ssnyc

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 38,129

also...does everyone want to just fold to the initial ludicrous 3 bet?

doubt we can flat it and 4 bet fold 25% of our stack with AK at this stage seems dumb...

After we 4 bet don't we have correct odds vs his range?

so what line do people prefer here?

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