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03-27-2023 , 01:24 AM
Hey all, have more spots from various live events.

H1- I open 86dd from mp on a 60k stack (started with 20k) at 600 bb level to 1300. Bb is only one that calls and is a younger guy. He just got to table with starting stack at 20k. Flop is Ad-10d-6s and I cbet 1200 into 3500. He calls. Turn is a 5c. He x again and I bet 4.2k into 5.5k. He raises to 10k. I sigh think about it and just call. River is a blank and I fold to his pile. Do you ever check back turn here? I thought about it after and was like I kinda like going for it bc I donÂ’t expect a lot of A in his range and when he does have it- itÂ’s tough spot to call 3 streets so maybe he folds turn bc IÂ’m setting up what looks like a river pile. His card flicked up and it was an Ax hand. I kinda hate his turn raise- like I would say go all in or just call and let me a young aggro spew on the river when I miss. Is my call of the 10k bad on the turn? I was like this kid is just going to give me the rest of his chips when I bink a diamond or make an odd 2 pair or third 6. I kinda wanted to fold turn but his sizing was so small and we have outs. Idk thoughts? I just wonder if i should ever check back turn- IÂ’m going to guess nah we fold out a lot of his trashier flop call hands.

H2- in the money of a $400 turbo wsop circuit event. Stacks are very shallow. I have 20bb and open 77 to 20k at 10k bb level. Bb defends (we have similar stacks- wanna say heÂ’s on 30bb). HeÂ’s a nice guy that has talked to me and asking me about where I play etc- heÂ’s younger proll in 30s and seems very competent (said he plays on acr etc). Flop 782 (r). I cbet 15k into 55k after he x. He calls, turn 2 he checks and I check back hoping he spazzes. River is a 10 with no flush draw potential on board. He leads 35k into 85k. I think for a bit and make it 125k. He tank folds. Is this ok? Maybe I should just go and bet turn super small again and set up a river pile? I feel x back on turn makes my hand look like two over cards where he can bluff river with **** hands / put him in a tough spot when he has a hand and I raise his river bet. Looking back, maybe I should just bet turn super small as exploit again and find a way to make river a clean pot sized bet all in? Idk I prolly think too hard and x back turn in a spot I donÂ’t need to. Thoughts?

I normally cbet almost 80-90% in these type of spots if flop isnÂ’t type to hit bb defend hard. IÂ’ll normally shut down turn when my cbet is a pure bluff.


H3- odd dynamic here. So context- at my table folks starting commenting on my 2 rings I have from tourny wins. There was no real bad juju for me from anyone it seemed. Not sure on specifics of stack sizes here but let’s say I have 30bb in the money when average stack is 20-25bb. I min open AQdd from utg+1. Folds to bb who is an older 40s-50s guy wearing a wsop hoodie so I assume he travels playing the circuit but doesn’t mean he’s good. He 3 bets from bb to 85k (‘my open was 20k). I take 10-15 seconds and think about pot size and elect to call- I’m
Never folding AQdd here. Wanna say villian had 40bb to start hand. IÂ’ve only been at table for a bit so no real note on anyoneÂ’s play. Flop is 10-10-8 with no diamonds. He open rips. I just lol and fold. I say ha I canÂ’t beat jj. He shows 72o and says he doesnÂ’t like people picking on his blind (lol).

In this spot- did I do anything wrong. From typecast appearance- I just thought the guy was a standard mawg that plays too tight and his 3 bet is prolly hella strong. His open rip on flop is super odd- like I assume heÂ’s never doing it with 10x hands. Looking back I wish I 4bet rip my hand pre but just didnÂ’t have any info on villian to say yea he might be 3! Light here. I think he wanted to make a play against me bc IÂ’m a gaudy kid with 2 circuit rings on and a blingy watch. Idk? I felt kinda meh after hand bc guy owned me on the hand. DidnÂ’t think he was going to show 72. Thought more like a pp or 8x or some hand like a 79 or j9 that wanted to use FE. Like I did nothing wrong here by not ripping pre? I kinda just lold and said in my head I love this table. ItÂ’s funny if I have JJ-AA there or some 10x open hand and he rips into me with 72o and no equity. I was kinda bummed after he showed the hand in a mocking manner but said hey itÂ’s ok this guy might punt his stack so hopefully we can fair catch when he does.

Guy ended up open ripping like this in 2 more spots on flops in spots you should never open rip. I kinda just lold bc heÂ’s punting a solid stack in a stupid spot where heÂ’s trying to level when there is no reason to level. IÂ’m never folding jj+ or 99 and 10x so I just donÂ’t see what open ripping as a donk bet accomplishes? I think it would have been smarter if he x flop and rips over my most likely cbet bc at least you acquire more chips. No idea?
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03-27-2023 , 01:53 AM
H1: looks good, open bigger off 100eff though.

H2: looks good, river sizing could be all-in to get max value when they call off or slightly smaller to let villain have a wider re-raise range.

H3: looks good, 4bet all-in is standard but flatting with MAWG reads seems good. Take the info that he will spaz and get your EV back in the future.
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03-27-2023 , 03:47 AM
H1: My preflop raise would be at least 2.5x with 100 bb's. More folds from the blinds. I like the turn bet (though I probably make it more like 3800 at ~70% pot). You don't block any broadway gutters and you do block 66. So he will fold hands like KQ/QJ/KJ. He might even fold hands like JT. Calling turn small raise is automatic. You are just about getting pot odds on improvement.

H2: If there was a flush draw out there I would always bet the turn probably 25k. I do this because most river cards will either make straights/flushes or potentially give us TPTK/sets and minimize bluffs. So when we get aggressive on the river the implication will be that the river was good for us. As played my river raise would be a std 3x to 105k or a shove. My experience is that making it close to 4x raise on the river gets more folds.

H3: Pre-flop is a very tough choice. His 3-bet is very close to 30% of our stack so I have no problem 4-bet shoving with AQs. He can have KK or JJ/TT. He can also have AK. So I don't mind the call. Wearing the 2 rings though is like being famous and having people bluff you off hands or call your bluffs because they want to feel good about themselves. So I would factor that in moving forward.
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03-27-2023 , 01:30 PM
Hand #1:

Pre-flop: Marginal open pre with 86dd, certainly fine from CO and BTN, probably break-even from HJ. Need to be very cognizant of effective stacks, too, because at this point in the tournament you're going to have a lot of sub-40BB effective stacks that are going to be looking to get money in. And 86dd is not going to play nearly as well vs. someone with 30-40BB as it does against someone with 100BB.

Flop: I think we get to go bigger with most of our range here, because this is a board where we have a huge range and nut advantage. So you could actually bet this pretty big, like 50-75% pot, and be fine, especially with a hand that has tons of equity like ours. Small is fine, too, but in this spot we want to get lots of money when we have a big equity advantage.

Turn: Like your turn sizing a lot. Villian's clickbacks are going to mostly either be flush draws (all of which you almost certainly beat) and 2p+ hands that connected with the 5, of which he has a fair amount if he's defending close to correct. I do think our only option here really is to just call, as we're in a way ahead/way behind spot.

River: Clear fold. The nature of the "blank" might make a tiny bit of difference.

I think we never want to check back this hand on the turn. It's just too strong and we can stack our opponent when we hit the diamond. It also functions nicely to fold out (in theory, at least) some better hands, like a smattering of better 6x and Tx, that may bet river on a brick and which we'll often lose to. I do think we will want some 6x and Tx in our checking range to hero call rivers, but this hand is just too good. It's also way too good to bet/fold, especially when we can make 2 pair or trips on the river (plus a flush).

Last edited by jpgiro; 03-27-2023 at 01:46 PM.
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03-27-2023 , 04:20 PM
Hand #2:

Pre is standard, flop is fine.

Turn is virtually always a check. There's probably some very low-frequency small betting here with 77 even if there's a backdoor flush draw available, but I'd think that when we have the effective nuts that we just don't bet here, especially when stacks are relatively shallow. When we bet, we are almost always betting small on that turn when the board pairs.

As played, I think I'm just piling river. Villain should be calling off with any of their two pair+ hands here (which they should have a fair amount of) and if they're not, this becomes a really sweet bluff when we have low-equity stuff like 9x or Jx that has blockers to straights. Don't think any other size makes that much sense.

Last edited by jpgiro; 03-27-2023 at 04:36 PM.
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03-27-2023 , 06:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpgiro
Hand #2:

Pre is standard, flop is fine.

Turn is virtually always a check. There's probably some very low-frequency small betting here with 77 even if there's a backdoor flush draw available, but I'd think that when we have the effective nuts that we just don't bet here, especially when stacks are relatively shallow. When we bet, we are almost always betting small on that turn when the board pairs.

As played, I think I'm just piling river. Villain should be calling off with any of their two pair+ hands here (which they should have a fair amount of) and if they're not, this becomes a really sweet bluff when we have low-equity stuff like 9x or Jx that has blockers to straights. Don't think any other size makes that much sense.

Thanks. I wondered if the turn check was a mistake bc we let villian kinda skate off cheap potentially. I feel betting turn small to set up a potential river jam is fine or hope for a x raise from villian we can just flat. River prolly should be a jam bc it looks kinda weaker. Thanks for the analysis.

I’m iffy on whether or not to bet turn here but I’m fine with how I played it. Think we get a nice stack if villian gets sticky with a 8 or maybe has 2x. Also think villian can punt stack if he somehow did it with a card he hit like a card over 8 if he binks top pair on river.
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03-27-2023 , 07:56 PM
Hand 1: I think it's fine. I would probably bet a bit smaller on the turn as another player said. But you are definitely calling his raise.

Hand 2: I think I am probably betting the turn. If the player has a 8, you are probably going to get a bit on the turn in. If the player has a 2 you get it all. If you are looking at T9/56 then you can bet enough to let him think he might have fold equity with a shove

Hand 3: I think this is a fold or a shove preflop facing his bet sizing and your stack size. Calling that raise and hoping to hit is the worst choice, IMO. Because even when you do hit something you aren't super happy about it. eg. The flop comes KQ4 and the player bet 1/3 pot, what are you doing? I think I would 4 bet shove this preflop in a $400 tournament without a read and a 30bb stack. If I had more info on the player I might fold it or if the stacks were a bit deeper (if you are both 45BB deep, but then 45BB deep I would lean towards calling this preflop).

Last edited by PhatPots; 03-27-2023 at 08:03 PM.
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03-28-2023 , 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhatPots
Hand 2: I think I am probably betting the turn. If the player has a 8, you are probably going to get a bit on the turn in. If the player has a 2 you get it all. If you are looking at T9/56 then you can bet enough to let him think he might have fold equity with a shove
I don't think betting turn is really bad or anything (we have a set, nothing is going to be really bad other than going HAM and shoving) but if we are betting, we absolutely don't want to bet anything more than 25-33% pot. We also have to feel like our opponent is capable of bluff raising us over a small bet, because if they're just going to call with stuff they should raise with then we're better off checking and then trying to get one additional big street of value on the river.

The one thing that would suck is to bet small on the turn, get called, and then have our opponent fold an 8 on the river.
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03-29-2023 , 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpgiro
I don't think betting turn is really bad or anything (we have a set, nothing is going to be really bad other than going HAM and shoving) but if we are betting, we absolutely don't want to bet anything more than 25-33% pot. We also have to feel like our opponent is capable of bluff raising us over a small bet, because if they're just going to call with stuff they should raise with then we're better off checking and then trying to get one additional big street of value on the river.

The one thing that would suck is to bet small on the turn, get called, and then have our opponent fold an 8 on the river.
How much would you bet on river? I like to set up river jam where bet is under pot if possible on rivers so more likely to get a call (aka I would hate to bet like 1.2-1.5x pot on river and let villian find fold easier).

I checked back turn bc I feel we get river stab a lot and we have the nizzle. If villian somehow had top pair on flop- I feel checking back turn is bad but not sure he finds fold on river. I prolly should just shove river bc it looks a little bit bluffier than sizing I made it bc sizing on river feels like only value. Villian folded after a min of thought- I was really hoping he would make a crying call but the longer it went- I was like ugh he’s going to fold in my head.

I’ll post one more hand. I think sb Vs bb. Bb is an older lady who seems very snug. I have 12 bb and jam AQo bc I felt she’s never raising light if I play a standard limp strat. The orbit before I jammed a Qx or Kx meh hand and she quickly folded and said she had 8’high. The AQ hand she said she folded Ax with weak kicker which I was kinda surprised. In my head- I’m like damn she’s folding way too much in sb Vs bb if she’s folding A high. After she said that and showed an A, I was like I can def exploit super light in these spots against her bc she’s way overfolding to a sb jam of a 10-12 bbjam.

The aq hand ugh I feel she rips if I complete so that kinda stunk but picking up 2bbs on a 12bb stack with no run out is nice also.
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03-30-2023 , 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jkpoker10
How much would you bet on river? I like to set up river jam where bet is under pot if possible on rivers so more likely to get a call (aka I would hate to bet like 1.2-1.5x pot on river and let villian find fold easier).
If it goes check/check turn and opponent bets river, we just stuff. We want to try to get all of his value hands to call, no sense in being cute.

If it goes check/check turn and opponent checks river again, we probably bet something like 2/3, hoping to get called by an 8 or Tx that happens to still be in range.

If we bet turn small and get called, we probably still just stuff river. If we think our opponent is going to fold an 8 to any bet, it's probably just better at that point to try to get value when they have a 2 or rivered a strong hand.

But to your general question about sizing, while we obviously want to sometimes bet sizes that set up logical jams, it's also important to be aware of board textures.

In a spot where we have a significant range advantage (i.e., we still have a lot of good hands) but not a big nut advantage (our opponent has more 87o and 2x than we do), we don't really get to bet 100%. We will do a decent amount of checking here. And when we lack the nut advantage, we often want to size down a little bit.

You could obviously bet bigger on this board with 77 and stack a 2 regardless, but you're going to stack a 2 anyway. A smaller bet functions better to make sure we get called with other parts of our opponent's range, like 7x or 8x or draws. It also allows our opponent to bluff or overvalue turns a decent amount, whereas when you go bigger it becomes harder to get your opponents to do that.

77 is an edge case because it's effectively the nuts, but if we think about all of our hands here, we want to make sure that we protect our betting and checking ranges. The reason we'd mostly want to check or bet small with 77 than just stick it in the 40-60% bucket is that our hand doesn't need protection. Whereas when we have JJ, for example, we're pretty happy betting bigger to get value from worse hands and to get some protection from draws. So while I think our bets here would primarily be somewhat bigger (more like 40-60%), the super nuts might mix into a small bet range where we put some other hands like AhQh where we'd be fine betting small to induce jams (which we can easily call off) or maybe even getting to the river unimproved and winning sometimes.

The general rule I've been taught is that when you have a range advantage, you get to bet more often. If you have a nut advantage, you get to bet bigger. And when the board texture is likely to change (i.e., the nuts are likely to change on the next card to come) you want to lean towards betting bigger as well.

Last edited by jpgiro; 03-30-2023 at 05:34 PM.
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