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BIG; regs thought process BIG; regs thought process

12-30-2012 , 07:01 PM
So I was playing ~ 21/18 with 8% 3bet or so when I get QQ and want to get some $$.
I flatted a small 3b IP from EP vs SB who 3betted a lot also with QTs ( ~36bb ES also( and went to showdown maybe this factors in any of his decion

Villains opens from HJ and was playing 21/19 with 16/7% 3bet over ~90hands

First of all:
Sizing?Induce? And what range do you want to GII against him

Second of all: Do you think his play was spewy, or is this 'normal' in MTTs reg vs reg ( im not a 100% MTT reg, but i play the BIGs etc daily)

What repush range do you like here, versus 4b/f range

So to sum it up

1) 3b Sizing, induce?
2) What is a legit range from him to min4b/f, is this ~35ES spewy HJ vs BB?
3) What should my calling range be TT AQs AK vs him or lighter?
4) His openship vs a 4b/f

Oh and also yea fml, but I want to get more info on whats legit here

Poker Stars, $20 Buy-in (800/1,600 blinds, 200 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 9 Players

BTN: 33,682 (21.1 bb)
SB: 23,296 (14.6 bb)
Hero (BB): 58,833 (36.8 bb)
UTG+1: 37,472 (23.4 bb)
UTG+2: 59,252 (37 bb)
MP1: 29,303 (18.3 bb)
MP2: 25,226 (15.8 bb)
MP3: 56,008 (35 bb)
CO: 24,139 (15.1 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q Q
4 folds, MP3 raises to 3,200, 3 folds, Hero raises to 7,100, MP3 raises to 55,808 and is all-in, Hero calls 48,708

Flop: (114,216) 2 4 4 (2 players, 1 is all-in)
Turn: (114,216) 9 (2 players, 1 is all-in)
River: (114,216) A (2 players, 1 is all-in)

Spoiler:
Results: 114,216 pot
Final Board: 2 4 4 9 A
Hero showed Q Q and lost (-56,008 net)
MP3 showed J A and won 114,216 (58,208 net)
[/hand_history]



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BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-30-2012 , 11:21 PM
If he thinks you are capable of folding everything except AK, QQ, KK, AA to his shove it's not too bad a move on his part (didn't do the math but this feels about right).

I think I 3b a little bigger, around 8k, although looks like your sizing did induce so not bad.

Definitely gii QQ+, AQs, AK with no real read other than he's a reg. Now that you know he's capable of shoving light you can call a little lighter.

I don't know that he would even have a 4b/f range in this spot if he's shoving light. Maybe 99-TT?
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 06:25 AM
a) slightly bigger, 7654
b) i dont think he has a range in that samplesize but rather goes with recent dynamics
c) as a default you should not turn hands like AQ in a 3b/f bluff, so flat or 3b/c them
d) see b), if he can ~15k/f because of dynamics he'd prolly not jam the top of his range to balance
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 10:50 AM
bigger sizing cuz we are OOP? I liked the 2,4x of his raise as opposed to bigger

+ I still think with 36bb ES he should be able to create a 4b/f range

Anyway whats most regs pushing idea here? Go with Ax that has x as blockers to premium pairs, or maybe even A2s? Prolly totally dynamic dependant?
( I did not 3b him once at this table so far)
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 10:55 AM
3b sth like 99+ AQ+ given positions. Might go as wide as 77 88 AJ with dynamic. And 3bet bigger. 8125 or sth
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 10:58 AM
Why are pl so fond or 3betting bigger, when regs dont flat and mostly 4b wide when they have room for it?

3,2 -> 8k look way stronger than 3,2 -> 7,1k

Only point i can com up with, is that my sizing is viable for setmining still as opposed when he has to add 4.8k it becomes very marginal.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:44 PM
I know you said that you're 3b 8%, but alot of times people 3b more from the blinds. So if your 3b is higher from sb, bb I'm fine with jamming AJ there.

Also I like your 3bet sizing if It was to induce the 4b. Against sticky Villains that might call your 3b and see three I would 3b bigger.

Im prob calling like 99+ AQo+ after I 3bet
BIG; regs thought process Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:48 PM
I wouldnt go too big on my 3b either bc it prevents him from 4b light more
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 08:47 AM
7444/gii
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 10:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Stro_Sho
I wouldnt go too big on my 3b either bc it prevents him from 4b light more
as played this sizing is also bad. doubt you would induce many light 4balls 3betting from bb.

Pkrart is very loose guy, Id 3b/c TT/AK for sure vs spazzy, would flat AQ and unsure about 99.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 11:57 AM
Bra it's HJ vs BB. Not EP vs BB. Ur range is too tight. Ya I flat 77 88 AJ close to 90% of da time, but 3b/c AQ+ 99+ is def fine this deep reg vs reg nbet dynamic these days. Also, he might 14555/f then we jam over him pick up loads of dead monies.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 12:26 PM
So whats an optimal sizing OOP @ this stack depths for 3b. Is this really to small considering villains image? in game I liked it and could see him spazz very widely. Once again my sizing does give him possibilities for setmining IF he thinks im mostly nutted here, so that might be a reason to 3b bigger.

Am I wrong considering 2,25 IP and 2,4 or so OOP? Or more based on stackdepths?

Also not sure if we should like flatting AJ after a 3b, unless we know reg 3bets very widely in which case a 4b/f might also have merits.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 12:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pkratitsbest
Bra it's HJ vs BB. Not EP vs BB. Ur range is too tight. Ya I flat 77 88 AJ close to 90% of da time, but 3b/c AQ+ 99+ is def fine this deep reg vs reg nbet dynamic these days. Also, he might 14555/f then we jam over him pick up loads of dead monies.
also 2 resteal stacks between hero and vil are worth mentioning, I thought he's smth like MP1 though. Might go with 99 as well then.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 01:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elephants_pride
as played this sizing is also bad. doubt you would induce many light 4balls 3betting from bb.

Pkrart is very loose guy, Id 3b/c TT/AK for sure vs spazzy, would flat AQ and unsure about 99.
why wouldnt we induce light 4b, 3b from the bb? The blinds 3bet more than any other positions. they can easily just think we are trying to resteal.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 02:49 PM
Im talking about sizing
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 03:03 PM
Quote:
Im talking about sizing
Quote:
So whats an optimal sizing OOP @ this stack depths for 3b. Is this really to small considering villains image? in game I liked it and could see him spazz very widely. Once again my sizing does give him possibilities for setmining IF he thinks im mostly nutted here, so that might be a reason to 3b bigger.

Am I wrong considering 2,25 IP and 2,4 or so OOP? Or more based on stackdepths?

Also not sure if we should like flatting AJ after a 3b, unless we know reg 3bets very widely in which case a 4b/f might also have merits.
?
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 03:40 PM
generally getting better price to call some playable hands from Bb you dont have that wide 3betting range .
At the same time vs active guys yoy can 3bet wider to avoid playing some hands oop, which are flopping badly and it also means you size 3bets bigger not to allow active guy to have wide 3bet calling range ip.
So when you 3bet small you either a bit clueless or for some reason you dont want him to fold.

Generally 3bet sizing is a function of stack depth and villains tendency to flatcall 3bets, but still smth like 2.7x is std for these stacks.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 06:05 PM
3betting 3,2k to 8.7k ( ~2,7x) looks super strong imo
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-01-2013 , 06:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elephants_pride
generally getting better price to call some playable hands from Bb you dont have that wide 3betting range .
At the same time vs active guys yoy can 3bet wider to avoid playing some hands oop, which are flopping badly and it also means you size 3bets bigger not to allow active guy to have wide 3bet calling range ip.
So when you 3bet small you either a bit clueless or for some reason you dont want him to fold.

Generally 3bet sizing is a function of stack depth and villains tendency to flatcall 3bets, but still smth like 2.7x is std for these stacks.
or you leave room for him to 4bet light.
BIG; regs thought process Quote
01-02-2013 , 03:07 AM
he still can 4bet light if we're consistent with our sizing.
BIG; regs thought process Quote

      
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