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ULTIMATEPOKER.COM SPONSORED SUPPORT FORUM |
12-22-2013, 02:50 AM
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#1
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grinder
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Big Yellow Joint
Posts: 655
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Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Hello, my screen name is 'Money Beets' on Ultimate Poker.
Until now, my experience on Ultimate has been excellent. After playing on various international sites, Ultimate was a haven of convenience and reliability; I was excited to finally play on a poker site that seemed trustworthy.
That excitement is gone.
On December 18th, sponsored Ultimate pro William Reynolds AKA ReynoldsXO advised another player in chat not to play me heads-up. That player sat out, and, having no one else to play, I sat ReynoldsXO.
He proceeded to repeatedly sit in and out, only playing when he drew the button, and then immediately sitting out again. The end result was that he played the button every hand, leaving me to only play the big blind each hand. He even went so far as to tell me in chat "I only play buttons vs u headsup".
Normally, I would say this is just part of starting tables; people often angleshoot and get out of line in chat. However, for a sponsored player to do this is completely different, sending the message that not only is this conduct acceptable, but encouraged.
I am perturbed that Ultimate is willing to pay its sponsored players to abuse software exploits and I hope this issue is addressed.
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12-22-2013, 05:47 AM
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#2
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veteran
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 3,335
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
That is shady and you should be compensated regardless of how your outcome was. That player should have his sponsorship revoked because it obviously is sending a horrible message.
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12-22-2013, 07:20 AM
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#3
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journeyman
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 213
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Wow, that's crazy. That's wrong for anyone............sponsored pro or not.
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12-22-2013, 12:43 PM
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#4
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adept
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 716
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Williegb
He proceeded to repeatedly sit in and out, only playing when he drew the button, and then immediately sitting out again. The end result was that he played the button every hand, leaving me to only play the big blind each hand. He even went so far as to tell me in chat "I only play buttons vs u headsup".
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Why did you repeatedly keep posting your blind, even after he went as far to tell you in chat he would only play button vs you?
Was it so you could make this thread and ruin him?
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12-22-2013, 02:32 PM
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#5
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newbie
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 29
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Hopefully UP will finally update their software to fix this. You have to go through stuff like this all the time to even get games started (esp at the 6max tables), so I can understand your frustration OP.
I hope you continue to play on UP MoneyBeets, I play smaller limits but enjoy railing you in the bigger games. GL.
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12-22-2013, 02:50 PM
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#6
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grinder
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 588
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoopmonkey
Why did you repeatedly keep posting your blind, even after he went as far to tell you in chat he would only play button vs you?
Was it so you could make this thread and ruin him?
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Anyone who does that deserves to be ruined, especially a sponsored pro.
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12-22-2013, 06:02 PM
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#7
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grinder
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Big Yellow Joint
Posts: 655
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoopmonkey
Why did you repeatedly keep posting your blind, even after he went as far to tell you in chat he would only play button vs you?
Was it so you could make this thread and ruin him?
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Just to correct any misconceptions, I only posted a few times in a row before I sat out, there wasn't any big session. I wanted to play and get games running, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt. As soon as he outright said he'd only play the button I sat out.
The monetary amount isn't large, and I'm not looking for compensation. It just upset me to see a sponsored player act like this, and I wanted people to know.
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12-22-2013, 07:15 PM
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#8
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: calling a spade a spade
Posts: 11,231
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebighit89
Anyone who does that deserves to be ruined, especially a sponsored pro.
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+1
I really find this story hard to believe... not that I'm doubting OP's story. But I find it hard to believe a sponsored player would do this... and even more amazed that he'd openly admit to it.
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12-22-2013, 07:39 PM
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#9
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veteran
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 3,335
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sect7G
+1
I really find this story hard to believe... not that I'm doubting OP's story. But I find it hard to believe a sponsored player would do this... and even more amazed that he'd openly admit to it.
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Not the first time a sponsored pro has done something that would not be considered proper.
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12-22-2013, 08:43 PM
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#10
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,472
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
While we're on the subject...do these sponsored pros nobody has heard of really bring traffic to the site? Esfandiari, Daniel, Ivey, Isildur, etc. I can understand but these D level pros...
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12-22-2013, 09:28 PM
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#11
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adept
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 752
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
I have played heads up against him and never saw anything other than honest play. I really don't believe any of the accusations that you have made against him.
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12-22-2013, 09:39 PM
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#12
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old hand
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,546
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Not that its really necessary for me to post this but "money beets" has always been a class act, i highly doubt he is making this up.
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12-22-2013, 09:47 PM
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#13
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grinder
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Big Yellow Joint
Posts: 655
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamastud
I have played heads up against him and never saw anything other than honest play. I really don't believe any of the accusations that you have made against him.
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I have video of it. I record my sessions.
It has personal information onscreen, so I'd prefer not to post it publicly, but I'd be fine with a mod looking at it to confirm.
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12-22-2013, 09:56 PM
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#14
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old hand
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,986
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
It is the software that is making this angle shoot possible. And it is the software that needs to be fixed to eliminate this angle shoot. Come on UP, this fix should have already been in one of the update !!!
I was playing someone heads up and thought they were having disconnection problems before I quickly caught on they were trying to angle shoot button me. Angle shooters gonna angle shoot. That is why it is critical that the software is angle shoot free.
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12-22-2013, 10:18 PM
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#15
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veteran
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Email hell
Posts: 3,466
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Please email the video to me - syeates@UltimateGaming.com
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12-23-2013, 12:06 AM
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#16
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stranger
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 3
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Hello,
This is William Reynolds.
If you have played on Ultimate Poker you have probably seen me play under "ReynoldsXO"
Money Beets and I have been playing on Ultimate Poker for 4-5months 3-5days a week. We have played heads up on many occasions to start games over this time period. Nearly all of our volume has been 2/4-5/10.
Earlier this week I was playing someone heads up and got beat up for 2kish at 2/4. Money Beets sat in the game to make it 3 handed. I sat out of the game within an orbit or two deeming the session hopeless. This chat began after I sat out
ReynoldsXO: stuey
ReynoldsXO: ur an idiot
ReynoldsXO: dont lose ur money to money beets
Stuey Stinks: ty
Stuey Stinks: ok
Money Beets: I can't believe they pay you for this reynolds
I left the table immediately and began closing my tables to go to lunch when Money Beets began sitting tables with me. I left all games he sat with me except a 1/2 full ring 50bb max.
I sat in and money beets got the button. I sat out. I sat in and got the button and moved all in for $100 w 8x off. Money Beets folded and I sat out.
I sat in and Money Beets drew the button again. I sat out. I sat in and got button. I moved all in w J8? off suite. Money Beets folded and I sat out. I showed my hands both times after he folded.
ReynoldsXO: i only play buttons vs u heads up
Money Beets: so you're admiting you angle shoot?
Money Beets: as a paid pro
Money Beets: lol
ReynoldsXO: you can play me heads up if u want
ReynoldsXO: but i only play buttons
ReynoldsXO: my buttons
ReynoldsXO: my buttons
ReynoldsXO: my shiny shiny buttons
Money Beets: new new hieghts
Money Beets: hope you're proud
ReynoldsXO: relaxxx
ReynoldsXO: take it ezzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Money Beets: is that a joke, you just killed my action with another player, and abuse the system to cheat at HU
Money Beets: nice try cheater
At this point it was clear Money Beets was not amused with what just happened so I sat in and got the button. I sat out. I sat in and got the big blind and was dealt Q6o. Money Beets min raised and I folded. I sat out.
ReynoldsXO: i ony play heads up out of position
I sat in and got the button. I sat out. I sat in and got the big blind and Money Beets proceeded to sit out on the button.
Money Beets: not doing this over and over, hope my 2$ was worth it
ReynoldsXO: u no want shiny button ?
Money Beets: no, I want you, a paid pro of the site, to stop angle shooting and ruining acion
Money Beets: you wouldn't think it would be that hard, but I guess that's too much to ask
ReynoldsXO: ooo000ooo
ReynoldsXO: u no likey $2 looks at cally all in
ReynoldsXO: that good action
Money Beets: I don't care, I care about you telling people not to play me, and abusing the button draw
ReynoldsXO: u got the EV when it came to the button
ReynoldsXO: gave u 2 looks
ReynoldsXO: and tried to give buttons back
ReynoldsXO: u got 1 back
ReynoldsXO: denied the other
Money Beets: not the point, yyou are a site pro, and this isn't even close to an appropriate standard of conduct
ReynoldsXO: please forgive me money beets
Money Beets: can't unring a bell
ReynoldsXO: lol
All said and done Money Beets and I played 3 hands of 1/2 $100max heads up. 2 of which I won after obtaining the button to move all in with any two cards. The other I was big blind and folded to a min raise. I attempted to give him a second button but he declined.
Money Beets I commend you for doing what you think was right and holding me accountable. The poker community now knows that if I draw the button heads up and move all in for a 50x pot over bet jam any two will do.
Final thoughts:
I should have just asked Money Beets if he wanted to flip instead of moving all in with any 2 while allowing him to fold/call properly. This would have made it neutral EV while avoiding skeptical behavior to facilitate unnecessary gambling.
I've probably started more games via heads up at ring tables than anyone on UP. This was an isolated incident with an end result of $2 changing hands. I was not maliciously abusing the system to gain an edge. I was moving all in with 8 high.
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12-23-2013, 12:27 AM
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#17
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old hand
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,546
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
lolwilliamreynoldsamants
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12-23-2013, 12:27 AM
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#18
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,472
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Killing another player's HU action might not be against the rules but is completely scummy behavior and reflects poorly on UP. Aren't sponsored pros supposed to bring action to the site, not remove action from the site?
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12-23-2013, 12:27 AM
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#19
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stranger
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 3
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Williegb
Just to correct any misconceptions, I only posted a few times in a row before I sat out, there wasn't any big session. I wanted to play and get games running, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt. As soon as he outright said he'd only play the button I sat out.
The monetary amount isn't large, and I'm not looking for compensation. It just upset me to see a sponsored player act like this, and I wanted people to know.
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You actually sat out when I said "I only play heads up out of position"
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12-23-2013, 01:28 AM
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#20
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grinder
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Big Yellow Joint
Posts: 655
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReynoldsXO
You actually sat out when I said "I only play heads up out of position"
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This is correct. I misspoke in my previous post. Your account of events is accurate.
Thank you for posting the chat log.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottyy
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Email sent. Thank you.
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12-23-2013, 07:22 AM
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#21
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journeyman
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 213
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
The killing of the action is even worse than the button thing.......which seems like it was kind of an all-in joke fest. I'm pretty shocked Reynolds came out and admitted everything. That conversation with Stuey Stinks is not okay. Having grown up playing pool for money..........that sort of thing gets you beat up in the real world. I guess since Reynolds is hiding behind his shiny computer, he feels it's okay.
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12-23-2013, 10:40 AM
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#22
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adept
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 752
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
These sights need to be squeaky clean and more importantly appear to be squeaky clean given all that had gone on in the online world and given how little the number of players on this site is.
Given this incident and the negative shadow that it casts over this site, it is suggested that Mr. Reynolds resign his position on this site or perhaps even better that UP resign it for him. His attitude seems inappropriate to be a sponsored player, given the dialogue he provided. I am disappointed in him. His role as Pro is to enhance the site; not try to cripple it as his downside swings occur.
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12-23-2013, 11:40 AM
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#23
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veteran
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Leeds
Posts: 2,481
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
hope you lose your UP deal
DoucheXO
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12-23-2013, 12:20 PM
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#24
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veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Online Poker Hell
Posts: 3,358
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
I wonder if this should be posted in NVG?
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12-23-2013, 01:13 PM
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#25
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enthusiast
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 69
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Re: Ultimate Sponsored Pro ReynoldsXO Angleshooting BN Draw
It has always been common in the Brick and Mortar poker rooms in town to allow the poker employees to "play on the clock" in order to build and maintain games. They are always held to a higher standard than the guest. I have seen situations where the poker employee gets out of line lead to suspension of playing privileges and in some cases back in the day termination.
Reynolds posting the text admitting what he had done and then somehow attempting to justify his actions is what I find troublesome. There is no justification for his actions.
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