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Old 07-10-2018, 07:12 PM   #3901
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Today went a loooot better. I wrote kind of a complicated utility program that passed muster and maybe got a little more cred.
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Old 07-10-2018, 07:14 PM   #3902
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Quote:
Originally Posted by lapka View Post
Then that is your argument. If you can add few sentences to why, then use that in the conversation with team. Don't use " the boss said that and we have to do what the boss tells." Not a single thinking person will accept that he/she has to do something she considers stupid only because the boss tells so. You have to convince them to be on your side.
I agree with dids. Don't be extra confrontational. Neither with your boss no with your team. Take the emotion out of it. Are you trying to bring your boss into conversation with team because you are not sure of your authority? And kinda trying to add the authority of your boss to yours. Don't. You are smart enough. And if you think that something is right I am pretty sure it is. Stand as yourself tall. And people will feel it and follow.
My boss is in india. These are decisions that usually fall to him, and my teammate is also constantly emailing him - i want to make sure he is up to date.
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Old 07-10-2018, 07:55 PM   #3903
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

I am realizing that an extremely difficult part of my job is juggling the demands of the product owner vs. what is actually feasible/worth doing and also conveying that to my team. So far I am not doing a good job.

Particularly, I am not so great at when there are N people with N different opinions, how to find a consensus.

I have a weird feeling they are trying to groom me into being something more than my current position - trial by fire kind of thing. Probably just garden variety disorganization though.
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:46 PM   #3904
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

S just tried to pull the same old “lets just have it be like exactly like before but i wont care about you at all and it doesnt mean anything and we just have fun”

Almost verbatim. Then she just shows up at my house with food and i told her to leave and she got pissed and left.

Calls me a little while later to try to talk things out into a scenario where she gets everything she wants and i dont get anything from her again. I told her no, i’m past tha and it’s not fair to me and i deserve better.

I wasnt even looking for anything ****ing serious, she was the one from almost day 1 talking about babies and **** with me. Jfc
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:06 AM   #3905
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

jmakin,

Sounds like you are doing the right things wrt your job.

When you get stressed out, just take a step back. If you were a serious CTO/CEO, would you ever want to have yourself in your current situation at your company? Of course you ****ing wouldn't, not only is the role literally impossible to be successful at, you have essentially no experience, and self admitted dubious current technical skills. Clearly for these people to have you in this role they are themselves failing massively in several ways.

This is also an incredibly, incredibly fortunate situation for you to be in. You get to learn different parts of a the technical sides of a software company very quickly, and are even exposed to the business side. It takes some people 10+ years to gain that kind of exposure. The job I'm leaving has 2 senior architect level engineers (20+ years each) who have literally zero business knowledge, so they stay at a company that is almost certainly a loser because they cannot accurately judge the situation.

Just keep learning and improving yourself and eventually you will be able to go to an exponentially better job, trust me it will happen.
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Old 07-14-2018, 02:59 PM   #3906
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

I have a scenario in which this makes sense -

There’s no new investment coming in, and they’re in full on **** it mode.
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Old 07-15-2018, 04:41 AM   #3907
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

my mental state is really low the last few days. Like I feel so ****ing alone and just kinda hated.

I don't really have any good people in my life except my roommate and he's leaving in a few weeks I guess. He dropped the bomb on me the other night. It's probably my fault - i havent been maintaining the place like I should.

I want to get a new place in January when I get my little windfall. I think I'll try to find a nice $1500/mo apartment, maybe like ~1000 square feet if I can find anything in that price range. And then just pimp it out and go on a playboy-esque rampage.

idk right now though. I just generally feel unwell.
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Old 07-15-2018, 04:42 AM   #3908
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

What I really need is a mechanism to meet people, that does not involve drinking. Right now I'm not sure what that is. Right now all I have is tinder but I'm too embarrassed of this place to bring anyone over.
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Old 07-15-2018, 06:55 AM   #3909
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

You should worry - when I was in your age group I had a small one bedroom semi-basement flat that I let fall into total disrepair because I was out pretty much every night, and a cat that used a litter tray in the bathroom. The whole place stank of damp and cat ****, but frankly when you've copped off with someone you've usually both had enough to drink for those sort of things not to matter until the morning lol.

Anyway...onto the advice. Get someone from one of those cleaning companies around who blitz clean somewhere and hit up the bars a couple of times a week (or tinder I suppose), keeping work your priority.

Last edited by jalfrezi; 07-15-2018 at 06:57 AM. Reason: Disclaimer: is a Brit. We love drinking as anyone who lived in this climate would
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Old 07-15-2018, 09:14 AM   #3910
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

jmakin - while normally I'd say to ignore Larry The Sales Guy when it comes to anything resembling tech career advice, our blind boot camp squirrel seems to have finally found a nut because his last sentence is actually correct. Keep your nose to the grindstone, the anxiety in check, and focus on learning everything useful that you can learn. Most likely scenario here is that you'll be jumping ship in about two years at the latest if the company doesn't go boom or bust before then. Treat them as a paid training ground in the meantime. You will have more options later with a little real world experience under your belt.
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Old 07-15-2018, 09:50 AM   #3911
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Quote:
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What I really need is a mechanism to meet people, that does not involve drinking. Right now I'm not sure what that is. Right now all I have is tinder but I'm too embarrassed of this place to bring anyone over.
Nonsense. From what I read about your housing you have kind of very similar apartment like me. And I am for years professional.

No matter how small/cheap/low level equipment your apartment has, you can always make it so that people feel good there.

- declutter. Don't have any unnecessary **** lay around.
- make your bed. It is huge difference how a room looks like when bed is like your just slept in it or if it is smooth empty surface.
- pick-up. It is again huge difference if your clothing/books/papers fly all around the room or if clothing is in some kind of store system (you don't have to have separate wardrobe room), books on a shelf and papers filed in appropriate files.
- if a girl comes over and starts kinda suggesting something or clean herself, don't get all defensive, but help her instead.


One of my exes did always leave his laundry hanging on such lines in a room. Dryers are very rare in Germany. He left it there for weeks instead of folding together on a shelf. I sooooo could kick his butt. It is something very simple. It costs nothing. But it makes huge difference in how a room looks like and feels.
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Old 07-17-2018, 11:58 AM   #3912
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Iím not sure the backstory here but Larry went from sales to a very lucrative developer position in a matter of months, something probably .01% of the world population could do, if that. He has a promising career ahead of him.
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Old 07-17-2018, 05:56 PM   #3913
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

I'm gonna make a longer post when i get home and back to my computer, but i don't really care if you guys argue in here, it's kind of entertaining to me and i don't have a pony in this race - i respect both of your opinions.

i'm thoroughly, thoroughly confused about what beef you guys have though - to me it seems out of nowhere.
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Old 07-17-2018, 05:58 PM   #3914
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

+1. I like and respect both LL and Chop.
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Old 07-17-2018, 06:03 PM   #3915
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

I do think if chop knew about my work situation to the extent I have posted about it in programming, he would probably be one of the one saying I was full of **** or misunderstanding the situation. These types of responses kind of pissed me off because I know full well the reality of my situation and it is scaring the **** out of me.

The stakes are pretty low for me I guess, the bar for performance here is practically nonexistent and no one ever seems to leave (everyone’s been there since the beginning). I mean our product manager didn’t even know that we had a major press release yesterday about our new product and no one seemed to care lol. I did overhear a few conversations I probably shouldn’t have this week, and I am a little concerned about the company’s runway. I think there are things I am definitely being kept in the dark about. One guy left for Apple this week. Another is leaving for post grad next month. A few people seem really depressed. It could be coincidental though, I don’t know. I really only need to last till next year though.

If this major testing framework I’ve been working on is a success, my boss should come back in a few weeks and everything will be a lot easier to handle.
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Old 07-17-2018, 11:42 PM   #3916
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

jmakin,

I don't have that much experience working for other people, but in my most relevant experience your situation would be more along the lines of "giving you a chance to find your place, figure out what to do, other people to figure out how to use you" than trial by fire that they are looking for you to pass/fail on. Outside of ahole consulting companies and such most people hate firing anyone and close to hate hiring new people.

I guess I'm repeating myself, but for no good reason really I feel like I'm right.

I'm also messy. And my wife and kids are all messy. If/when you go about choosing a wife you'll have to decide between squalor or having someone mad at you for being messy. I used to figure it would all work out by my being rich and having servants, but no such luck so far anyway.

Last edited by microbet; 07-17-2018 at 11:47 PM.
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Old 07-18-2018, 02:19 AM   #3917
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

extremely obvious how this is going to conclude (which sucks, bc itís gonna be really annoying), still may be interesting for a minute or two though.

jmakin, appreciate you letting the drama play out. Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog
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Old 07-18-2018, 03:56 PM   #3918
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Well it was lucky I woke up early or I would have missed everything.
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Old 07-18-2018, 04:15 PM   #3919
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

How Rexx and I feel right now:

Spoiler:
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Old 07-18-2018, 05:51 PM   #3920
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Good lord I had the most humiliating experience at work today.

I've been working on this simple test harness to run a series of tests out of a directory, containing various configuration files.

It wasn't hard to write, but there were a lot of moving pieces.

This started after we discussed it last week - I thought the team was on the same page, despite a few small disagreements about implementation.

The QA/architect guy said he wanted no part of it. The girl on my team wanted no part of it. The rockstar on my team could have coded it, but his energy is better spent elsewhere.

So I said **** it, I can do this, and did it. It works. How robust it is, I don't know - I tested a lot of scenarios, it's working exactly as specified.

Today the older QA guy who i sit next to gave me a verbal beatdown for 45 minutes about how I've been neglecting my responsibilities to work on this program for the last several days and how I was not qualified to be doing this and "why do you think you can program better linux than people who have been doing this for years." I didn't protest much and took it in stride, except for that last statement - I told him I absolutely did not mean to imply I could do this better than anyone else, I just saw something that needed to get done so I threw myself into it. It was an extremely long and public conversation in the bullpen area, I listened and didn't react with emotion - in fact I am happy he was so candid with me, because I am sure the rest of the team is thinking the same thing.

It was super upsetting, because he was right on a lot of levels - I'm not experienced enough to be doing this. But I'm pissed off because I basically implemented the type of system he was specifying, he just seems angry that it wasn't him. I felt like I was set up a little bit, because he was singing a completely different tune all week until he saw that I was actually done with it.

So I went for a walk with the CTO and broke down my concerns, laid out the conversation I had with the QA guy and apologized if I had been lapsing on any of my duties. He did not agree that I had and felt I was doing good work, but I felt the need to check in with someone in case I had gotten distracted.

I told him I need to either be full time project management or full time developer, I can't be doing both roles. He said it's fine if I spend most of my time managing and then work on side projects when it's slow, stuff that's not mission critical. I 100% agree with that. He also wants me to get development experience and I appreciate that a lot.

He spoke very candidly (a lot negative) about the QA guy and expressed displeasure with my boss for taking off suddenly for a month without telling anyone and leaving me/us to pick up the pieces. I did not speak ill of my boss or the QA guy, but said that I felt that my boss's absence is definitely being felt by a lot of us and I wasn't sure how to pick up the slack.

It was a very encouraging conversation but I was extremely cautious in how I phrased things because I do not want to make enemies (I have a habit of doing that). I am upset, but the QA guy had a lot of good points. But, if he had expressed these concerns beforehand, rather than letting me set myself up to take a possible fall, THAT is what I am pissed about and I am putting me, the CTO, and the QA guy in a room tomorrow to battle it out so we can all be on the same page. I feel like none of us are in any disagreement whatsoever - I implemented exactly what the CTO wanted and what the QA guy thinks we should do, but there are clearly large egos involved.

The QA guy thinks I was doing a great job of "moving the conversation forward" and that my personality is perfect for leading the team, and that they just need to be led. When I am programming, he said I am not doing this.

Well, ok, that's fair. But that's why I had the convo with the CTO - I'm basically done programming if I'm gonna get torn apart like this and lose even more respect from my team for it.

I'm pissed off and frustrated because I was put in this position. The CTO told me not to worry too much and just use it as an opportunity to learn, and that I'd be fine. I appreciate him a lot for speaking so candidly to me, I am not used to that from my superiors.

I went home early because I basically didn't sleep working on this for the last few days and I'm gonna get a lot of sleep and come in tomorrow with a clear mind, even emotions, but be firm and strong. I don't want to be talked to that way again publicly.
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:34 PM   #3921
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

I think you handled that situation ideally. Great work.

You should take solace in the fact that the QA guy never will get promoted in your company or elsewhere because he's such an *******. He'd have to be a superstar to overcome that horrible attitude. And if he were a superstar he would have done what was required instead of letting you program and then complaining about you doing too much.
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Old 07-19-2018, 12:33 AM   #3922
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Someone needs to do some QA on the QA guy.
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Old 07-19-2018, 01:38 AM   #3923
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

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extremely obvious how this is going to conclude (which sucks, bc itís gonna be really annoying), still may be interesting for a minute or two though.

Iím not always right, but when I am Iím prone to patting myself on the back.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:34 AM   #3924
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Tomorrowís a big day. I need to come out with my dick swinging in a way that doesnt look like Iím doing that.

I know respect is earned and shouldnt be expected but i absolutely should not be talked to like that in public. I am going to make him express his ideas to both me and the CTO in a meeting - and Iím going to gve him a chance to take this over. If he still refuses, well, ok, he better live with it.

Thereís some disagreements between him and the CTO but honestly theyre very superficial and we all want the same things and i just want to get them into a room and get everyone on the same exact page. Might be futile but Iím sick of this ****.
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Old 07-19-2018, 08:56 PM   #3925
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Re: Jmakinmeangry's debauchery and general idiocy blog

Today went well - I showed and explained my program some more, laid out a path to what I thought we should do next. I guess all the higher ups had a meeting about me this morning to discuss what my responsibilities should be. The CTO took me for a walk after the meeting to discuss that - he thinks I should spend most of my time managing and work on side projects, but only non-mission critical stuff. I completely agree with him.

I am relieved TBH. I think we will need to hire another person - I think they were hoping I could replace the development hole that will be left by our rockstar leaving. I just am in no position to do that. Maybe several months from now I could, but I would have to train someone to replace me. I have in mind someone that could do it and possibly be willing to, but that's far away.

He acknowledged that what I am trying to do is "extremely difficult" and he just wants to make sure I am not overwhelmed. I think they could all tell what kind of stress I was under. Another higher-up said I looked "much more relaxed" today, lol.

I shouldn't have taken so literally the advice I got in /programming. My gut was telling me that I should've just stuck to what I was doing and not tried to meddle in the development process. What I built works and I think will have some short term utility, but I shouldnt be doing this stuff. They have plenty of competent programmers - what they need is leadership and communication and structure. I was aware of this very early.

I am a little hamstrung by my boss in terms of how I am able to implement this, but the CTO said that going forward I will be the "ultimate authority" in how we go about things. Of course I assume I can and will be overruled but I am very relieved.

They just need organization. They really desperately want to be told what to do, it's so bizarre to me. It isn't very fun, or very glamorous, but it comes easily and naturally to me and it isn't stressful. What I tried to do this last two weeks was REALLY stressful.

I like thinking on a high level about things as well, thinking about risks, and potential pitfalls. Things that could stumble us later on, etc. Managing personalities is not very fun. I will probably look to peace out of this place ~8 months or so, unless things change a lot. I want to be in more developer type of a role, but I just can't do that here. There's no structure for me to succeed there.

I am an autodidact so I don't doubt I will pick up a lot that will serve me later on in the meantime.
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