CBS news poll from 2014 shows about the same split nationally.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cbs-news...ool-bathrooms/

Lol at polling about whether people deserve basic civil rights.

I have the checklist now though

--Taking down the confederate flag on state property? Well, thats an affront to people and their culture, we should be more sensitive, can't do that.
--Ranchers violently seizing government land? Well, they have a point, their welfare payments weren't high enough, the government might have executed the guy pointing a gun at the police, and Clive Bundy was probably right about the lucky duck slaves
--People wanting to use the same bathroom as their identified sex? Suck it up losers.

But, states do have a choice. They can forgo Federal funding and continue to see progressive businesses take jobs out of the states that don't go along. Its the USA. States, in a lot of ways, do have a right to doom themselves to being poor backwaters mooching off the liberal states if they so choose.

So you are saying telling a 14 year old girl that she has to shower with a 14 year old physical male in a locker room because he identifies as a female isn't violating her rights in any way?

Well, two parts.

First, no it doesn't, and we should work to remove the social stigma that makes people think it is somehow a violation of rights to have to shower with a trans person. Its a high school locker room, not Caged Heat 3. If privacy is that important, make it so only private showering and changing is allowed.

Second, the guidance doesn't require that. Once again the people most enraged about this guidance don't even bother to read it.

Do you guys really think there are going to be a lot of tweens who want to be identified as trans just to see some naked tweens?

Exactly.

BTW, sorry to break it to everyone, but the internet exists in 2016. All the 14 years old girls have seen a penis before.

Trump comes from a bunch of confused ignorant ****s just like you. Nobody's wondering about ****. You're a walking, talking explanation.

Then pray tell what the bolded part means to you.

I already posted what the guidelines suggested in this very thread to accommodate all students! Try to avoid another Hage type embarrassment and actually read what is posted. The guidance suggests accommodating all students, and bigoted parents like yourself, in a way that doesn't stigmatize any individual student

I mean, all these guidelines really say is "you can't just tell the trans student to suck it up and use the other locker room. It wouldn't be acceptable to tell any other female/male student they couldn't use the female/male locker room, so find a solution that accommodates everyone".

Again, this is already happening in many states. Somehow the world hasn't ended!

I cut and pasted that right out of the DOJ/DOE letter. Did you actually read the letter, or are you hoping to misdirect people that didn't?

Your scenario ("telling a 14 year old girl that she has to shower with a 14 year old physical male") is not supported by the section you quoted.

What do you do after gym class in the locker room?

Did you miss the part about making "individual-user options available to all students who voluntarily seek additional privacy"?

LASJayhawk is an idiot, but I think his point still stands.

Transgender students must be given the option of using the room of their gender identify. Individual-user options may be offered. There will be cases where a school does not offer individual-user options.

I think pretending like this isn't a complex issue and its not reasonable for people to be concerned about some of the consequences of the guidance is silly. Just like its silly to pretend like its ok to just tell trans students to suck it up.

How complex are shower curtains?

So the concern is a hypothetical scenario where a school implements the guidance, fully supporting trans girls using the female facilities, and at the same time, they absolutely refuse to consider any accommodation to other girls who are not comfortable showering with trans girls?

That would indeed be pretty unreasonable, and I would probably join your protest. I strongly doubt this is, or will be, a common scenario. It reminds me a little of the objection to gay marriage that clergy will be forced to perform gay marriage ceremonies against their will.

On the other hand, being forced to get naked in front of your peers is a time-honored rite of passage for American high school students (and sometimes junior high). In a classic episode of Freaks and Geeks, Sam and the other geeks try everything to get out of showering after PE class, but eventually have to do it. Of course jocks take Sam's towel and push him into the hallway. Hilarity ensues. Without mandatory showering, this kind of character-building would never happen.

Yes? Because one is mandated and one isn't.

I have no idea how common. My high school had one wall with 3 shower heads. It's not like they'd put in stalls. Shower curtains would be possible, but aren't really enough. This all seems rather obvious to me.

It seems like both sides acknowledge one group of people's legitimate discomfort and then just totally marginalize the other group of people's equally legitimate discomfort. It doesn't make sense that you can say "trans people should just suck it up" and at the same time be concerned about the discomfort of others when a trans person comes into their locker room. And it equally doesn't make sense that you can understand the discomfort of trans people but not understand the discomfort of others when a physically opposite gendered person comes in.

I better stop telling my son "Quit acting like a little girl!" I guess it's normal for young boys.

god this tranny **** is annoying, infecting the media, its like who gives a ****?

we are weak and breed weaker every decade.

it's hard for me, but i have a serious question. how many people and females and transgenders use school showers?

when i was in school, decades ago, nobody actually used them. are they using them more these days?

Do we have a rule against this type of post, or these ok? Kerowo?

No one uses them outside of sports teams, and even they try to avoid it.

the context of that makes it 100 percent ok. i guess you're just trying to screw with kerowo, but just in case.

i figured. few people feel comfortable naked around anyone, except for the elders (around 4 minutes).



this whole video is really pretty hilarious if you haven't seen it.

I'd question the assumption that the two discomforts described here are "equally legitimate". Even if the impact is felt equally by the people experiencing them, not all discomforts deserve the same respect or accommodation. I'm sure there are also many girls (and boys) who experience discomfort at being forced to shower with black classmates, obese classmates, disabled classmates, Muslim classmates. I assume schools don't accommodate these discomforts.

I'll grant that the combination of genitals and puberty makes the trans issue, perhaps, categorically different from those examples. I'm not sure what the answer is. But I would be irate if I heard that an obese girl had been told, "Heather and her parents have expressed some discomfort at sharing the locker room with you, so the school has decided to provide her with a private facility so she doesn't have to see you." Is the trans girl's situation so different?