What is bullying? - Page 4 - Politics version 7.0 -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

Whatever you say Kerowo. When you think this was even a vaguely sensible question, let alone one worth repeating and getting excited about then there's not much more to say.

Chez, you were the other side of the conversation. If I'm misrepresenting your position please straighten me out. I stand by my assertion that calling someone names in PU, even if after every post they make, is not bullying. Your position seems to include the number of people involved.

03-12-2016 , 09:52 PM

#77

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

On the off chance you're serious I will have another go kerowo. You will recall you didn't like the aggegation answer because you wanted bullying to be contained with a single post (or not) so I responded with:

One person calling a person a name in PU is not bullying.
Ten people following someone around calling them names every single time they post would quite possibly be bullying.

If you want to then get into discussions about heap paradoxes or similar then we're probably not going to get anywhere.

03-12-2016 , 10:03 PM

#78

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

One person calling a person a name in PU is not bullying.

Then what are you going on about with LG?

03-12-2016 , 10:08 PM

#79

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

maybe I needed an extra word for you. It was in the original.

One person calling a person a name once in PU is not bullying.
Ten people following someone around calling them names every single time they post would quite possibly be bullying.

If you want to then get into discussions about heap paradoxes or similar then we're probably not going to get anywhere.

03-12-2016 , 10:31 PM

#80

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

The reason we're not going anywhere is because you are wrong. What LG was doing with Bahbah in PU wasn't bullying. If 10 people were calling bahbah names in PU it still wouldn't be bullying. You've yet to make a case of what behavior in PU rises to the level of bullying and you won't if you remain stedfast in your attempts to tie it to LG's behavior.

03-12-2016 , 10:38 PM

#81

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

No it's because you can't follow the pretty simple answer to your question about aggregates before leaping ahead to the defense of LG that you are so intent upon.

If you're denying that 10 people following someone around PU calling them names every time they posted would quite possibly be bullying then we will just disagree.

03-12-2016 , 10:44 PM

#82

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

LOL

03-12-2016 , 10:47 PM

#83

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Laugh away what you can't explain I guess?

03-13-2016 , 12:13 AM

#84

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

The reason we're not going anywhere is because you are wrong. What LG was doing with Bahbah in PU wasn't bullying. If 10 people were calling bahbah names in PU it still wouldn't be bullying. You've yet to make a case of what behavior in PU rises to the level of bullying and you won't if you remain stedfast in your attempts to tie it to LG's behavior.

Still waiting.

03-13-2016 , 12:36 AM

#85

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Still waiting.

Waiting for what?

Nothing will stop you insisting that nothing amounts to bullying in PU. Not sure what else is to be expected from you.

03-13-2016 , 07:16 AM

#86

LetsGambool

banned

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 26,568

There was bullying in politics. Chez sided with the bully. The end.

03-13-2016 , 08:32 AM

#87

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

There's your bullying LG. Somehow I doubt that has ended.

03-13-2016 , 11:31 AM

#88

LetsGambool

banned

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 26,568

Your moral arbiter schtick falls flat chez. We had a mod threaten to ban posters in another sub forum and threaten users via pm. By any definition of bullying, this is worse than what a non mod can do.

You sided with the bully.

Your concern about bullying isn't genuine. It's a partisan move because you don't like I've called out your tone policing, BBC chez.

03-13-2016 , 11:40 AM

#89

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Your posts will always remind us what an obsessive weirdo you are as well LG.

03-13-2016 , 12:03 PM

#90

Shame Trolly !!!1!

Neo-Gorean

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 4,839

At the risk of translating English to English, here's what I see going on ITT...

First, kerowo fully understands the concept of doing something slightly disruptive a whole damn lot != the slight sum of each individual disruption. That's the exact underlying concept used when he, correctly IMO, showing Teh Jabber-Wookie the door. So... can we get past this derail ITT ??
Nobody is 'following someone around', if that phrase means something like posts regarding the target being made in multiple forums. That's not happening... AFAIK nobody is posting about bahbahmickey in SE, or Teh Jabber-Wookie in SMP. Also, there's hardly 10 regular posters in Baja to begin with, never mind 10 targeting another poster. So... I feel this alleged example isn't helping the conversation at all.
As I've pointed out, using the overloaded prerogative term 'bullying' to describe behavior that is, by universal agreement, (a) not Cyberbullying, and (b) perfectly acceptable behavior ITF, is a really, really, poor choice of terms... if we are at all interested in having a meaningful conversation.
Here is where I feel we are going to run into the same old brick wall. To have a meaningful conversation of a particular pattern of behavior, we really need (a) some general way of objectively describing and recognizing that pattern, and (b) some actual examples we can look at and work through.

However, we've seen the exact same situation unfold with the alleged 'yelling and screaming', and 'shouting down', regarding the use (or misuse) of the R-word. What happens is that the whiners refuse... flat out refuse regardless of any and all circumstances... to provide either (a) nor (b) above.
And finally, we keep hearing about how this, so far unspecified pattern of behavior, is somehow 'bad'. We haven't heard a peep about why anyone should consider it 'bad' or 'good' or whatever, not at all, not so far. Again... this is exactly what happens regarding the R-Word.

03-13-2016 , 12:09 PM

#91

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

All I'm trying to do is get Chez to give us a definition of behavior that would rise to the level of bullying in PU. He hasn't done it. He has already said LG calling BB names isn't bullying so we can mark that off the list.

03-13-2016 , 12:27 PM

#92

Shame Trolly !!!1!

Neo-Gorean

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 4,839

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

All I'm trying to do is get Chez to give us a definition of behavior that would rise to the level...

Exactly. Like I said, we're at the same point of the conversation where we always hit the brick wall regarding the R-word.

And just to clarify... nobody is asking for some bright-line rule that definably separates out this alleged pattern of behavior. Obviously, there isn't going to be any such a line. What's being looked for is a heuristic that can be used to sort candidate examples of patterns of behavior into, say, these four categories: 'yes', 'no', 'maybe', and 'n/a'. Where, in addition, a few in the 'yes' category are specified.

03-13-2016 , 12:38 PM

#93

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

All I'm trying to do is get Chez to give us a definition of behavior that would rise to the level of bullying in PU. He hasn't done it.

You don't recognise anything as bullying so there' no way to progress that. What LG does easily amount to bullying.

Quote:

He has already said LG calling BB names isn't bullying so we can mark that off the list.

Untrue. Are you really that confused despite "once" being in bold?

03-13-2016 , 12:41 PM

#94

TheDuker

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 1,388

But guys, Chez has already declared that what he's witnessed in this forum "can reasonably be called bullying". All arguments to the contrary are just "semantics".

03-13-2016 , 12:47 PM

#95

Shame Trolly !!!1!

Neo-Gorean

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 4,839

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

You don't recognise anything as bullying so there' no way to progress that...

No, that's not fair.

Remember, what you're referring to using the term 'bully' here is, by universal agreement, both not Cyberbullying, and a perfectly acceptable pattern of behavior here in Baja. So... if you wanna talk about any such particular pattern of behavior, it's 100% on you to spit out what that might be. Until you do that... how can anyone else guess if that category is an empty set or not?

03-13-2016 , 12:48 PM

#96

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

You don't recognise anything as bullying so there' no way to progress that. What LG does easily amount to bullying.

Why do you think it is bullying? How can you change my mind when you won't provide any examples?

03-13-2016 , 01:00 PM

#97

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shame Trolly !!!1!

It is fair.

Cyberbullying is using the internet/etc to bully people in real life. It's a red herring when talking about bullying in general

Personal attacks are allowed in PU but we don't change the name. Allowability is not the issue.

Bullying behavior is a standard concept and special demands on it's use or definitions are silly.

03-13-2016 , 01:02 PM

#98

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Why do you think it is bullying? How can you change my mind when you won't provide any examples?

I don't expect to change your mind kerowo. You don't even think 10 people following someone around calling them names every time they post is bullying.

Then again you've changed your views on expelling from PU so there's always hope that you think about things.

03-13-2016 , 01:20 PM

#99

Shame Trolly !!!1!

Neo-Gorean

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 4,839

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

... Bullying behavior is a standard concept and special demands on it's use or definitions are silly.

This is just as stupid as saying "'Shouting Down' is a standard concept and special demands on it's use or definitions are silly". To review... there allegedly is a pattern of behavior that you feel is remarkable. Remarkable enough to keep remarking on it, at least.

Are you at all capable of describing this pattern of behavior? Note: I asked 'describe', not 'label'. If I went through LetsGambool's last 250 posts, and excerpted those addressed at bahbahmickey, would I have isolated an example of this pattern of behavior?

03-13-2016 , 01:32 PM

#100

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 46,913

Bullying is the description of the type of behavior.

If you want to describe it differently then feel free. I'm happy to consider other descriptions. Go through LG's last year or so of posts in relation to bahbah if you're not familiar enough.

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