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12-04-2015 , 03:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
Yes. Because its 1925 and white-dominated unions with high prevailing wages are common. Oh and random blogger says so.

Great sense of context as usual bahbah, this is why you are a consensus dumbest 1% poster on this site.

Curious...why do you think minorities, you know, vote for politicans that push for higher minimum wages? Are they just dumb or, oh let me guess, brainwashing by the lamestream media that wont tell you the truth that Elephants in the Bluegrass will give to you straight?
It doesn't matter what year it is. It was done then to hurt minority workers who were willing to work for cheap and time hasn't changed the fact that it hurts the least experienced and skilled workers.

I can't generalize a group as large as minority voters. However, I will say that if I was an unskilled worker with little education I would like hearing a party say they want to raise the MW and increase government handouts. To come back to your question, yes, minority voters are just as dumb as majority voters.
12-04-2015 , 04:20 PM
Ummmm....no it matters a whole lot for the purposes of discussing potentially racist minimum wage laws as to whether there are strong unions that exclude minorities.

Quote:
time hasn't changed the fact that it hurts the least experienced and skilled workers
Econometric study citation? Because a wage increase is certainly not hurting the person being paid $9 an hour instead of $4 an hour or w/e. The effects of minimum wage increases is an econometric question where the effects on employed workers, workers displaced because of the wage increase, and business is going to differ based on a number of factors, including the minimum wage level. Your factual assertion is, shockingly, way over simplistic.

Quote:
I can't generalize a group as large as minority voters. However, I will say that if I was an unskilled worker with little education I would like hearing a party say they want to raise the MW and increase government handouts. To come back to your question, yes, minority voters are just as dumb as majority voters.
Oh man, this is funny coming from a confirmed low-information majority voter like bahbah

What do you make of the fact that a large percentage of minorities perceive voter ID laws as racist but, like, virtually no minorities perceive minimum wage laws as racist? Why should we believe you, bahbahmickey, are more qualified to figure out which policies benefit minorities than minorities themselves are?

Last edited by LetsGambool; 12-04-2015 at 04:27 PM.
12-04-2015 , 04:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
Yes. Because its 1925 and white-dominated unions with high prevailing wages are common. Oh and random blogger says so.

Great sense of context as usual bahbah, this is why you are a consensus dumbest 1% poster on this site.

Curious...why do you think minorities, you know, vote for politicans that push for higher minimum wages? Are they just dumb or, oh let me guess, brainwashing by the lamestream media that wont tell you the truth that Elephants in the Bluegrass will give to you straight?
TBF, racist origins are often cited for remnants of the southern strategy, as it's not like people are overtly proclaiming racist intent in 2015 for, say, voter ID.

If you and I might point to 1965 or w/e to discuss racist roots of current legislation, I think it's at least fair to accept the opposition doing so in this case. Don't see it as outright invalid.
12-04-2015 , 04:57 PM
Of course, we don't need someone proclaiming racist intent with voter ID laws for them to be racist, particularly since we have zero evidence of the ID laws actually solving a problem....but we have some anecdotal evidence of letting the mask slip there anyways.

Quote:
In an interview this week with “The Daily Show” correspondent Aasif Mandvi, Yelton said that new voting restrictions imposed in North Carolina in the wake of the Supreme Court striking down a key portion of the Voting Rights Act were going to hurt democrats. “The law is going to kick the Democrats in the butt,” he said. He added that “if it hurts a bunch of lazy blacks that want the government to give them everything, so be it.”
Quote:
One, from a man named Ed Koziol, used racially charged rhetoric to denounce the idea that poor, black voters might lack transportation or other resources necessary to obtain photo ID. If the legislature offered a reward for identification cards, “it would be like a swarm of bees going after a watermelon,” Koziol wrote.

Beeney asked Clemmons how he had replied to this email. Clemmons hesitated a moment before answering, “It was a poorly considered response when I said, ‘Amen, Ed, thank you for your support.’”

Beeney also contended that Clemmons, a Republican, wrote the law to suppress Democratic votes. Blacks in South Carolina typically vote Democratic. Beeney asked Clemmons whether he remembered distributing packets of peanuts with cards that read “Stop Obama’s nutty agenda and support voter ID.”
Quote:
But a GOP consultant who asked to remain anonymous out of fear of retribution said black voters were a concern.

“I know that the cutting out of the Sunday before Election Day was one of their targets only because that’s a big day when the black churches organize themselves,” he said.
12-04-2015 , 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
Ummmm....no it matters a whole lot for the purposes of discussing potentially racist minimum wage laws as to whether there are strong unions that exclude minorities.
I would love for you to use logic to explain why it matters if there are unions at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
Econometric study citation? Because a wage increase is certainly not hurting the person being paid $9 an hour instead of $4 an hour or w/e. The effects of minimum wage increases is an econometric question where the effects on employed workers, workers displaced because of the wage increase, and business is going to differ based on a number of factors, including the minimum wage level. Your factual assertion is, shockingly, way over simplistic.
As a hotdog salesman I know that if I price all my dogs at $2/dog I sell an average of 45 of my 50 dogs that my cart can carry. Even the ones that are overcooked and shriveled are likely to sell on a normal day.

However, what I have found is that if I raise my price to $3 a dog I tend to only sell about 30 dogs a day and the the people buying the dogs always ask for the best looking dogs with the warmest buns. The people that come late to my stand sometimes do what I call a "fly by" to check out the quality of my dogs at this higher price. If they don't see a fresh dog they are walking across the street to larry's lamb to get a gyro.

I know this may be surprising to some, but when my customers buy a dog they want the best possible dog. It is kind of like when I hired Tyler and Shelly to run my two other stands - I interviewed a lot of people, but I choose them because they had the most experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
What do you make of the fact that a large percentage of minorities perceive voter ID laws as racist but, like, virtually no minorities perceive minimum wage laws as racist?
This is a really stupid question that if anyone else asked it I would assume it was a level. I'm not trying to be mean, but don't say things are being over simplified then ask a question like this.

Voter IDs laws are very clear on who is effected and how they are effected. MW laws are not. Not all companies fire someone the day MW goes up and says sorry but the MW went up. They sometimes try to keep running for as long as they can and other companies may not fire anyone, but they may put off hiring at the rate they were. How would someone know if they didn't get hired for a job for an interview they never got to go to because a company was hiring?
12-04-2015 , 05:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
Of course, we don't need someone proclaiming racist intent with voter ID laws for them to be racist, particularly since we have zero evidence of the ID laws actually solving a problem....but we have some anecdotal evidence of letting the mask slip there anyways.
We aren't excepting any anonymous sources around here or I'll start making some more up... I mean finding some more credible anonymous sources. By the way, I need the date for when those things were said because if they are more than a week old I don't think they are credible in this ever changing world we live in. If you disagree with that please give me a date and time when info is still credible and when it isn't.
12-04-2015 , 05:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bahbahmickey
It doesn't matter what year it is. It was done then to hurt minority workers who were willing to work for cheap and time hasn't changed the fact that it hurts the least experienced and skilled workers.
You are making an empirical claim about minimum wage hurting minority workers. Any data to support the claim?
12-04-2015 , 05:26 PM
bahbah, you are calling something dumb in the midst of somehow completely ignoring the first level effect of minimum wage hikes...people who were making the minimum wage make more money. The net effect of minimum wage hikes on all parties is an econometric question but, you cant just simply ignore the fact that people making the minimum wage now make more money. That's what you have done so far with your minimum wage argument.

So lets clear this up...you agree people who hold minimum wage jobs actually make more money when the minimum wage goes up right?

Quote:
As a hotdog salesman I know that if I price all my dogs at $2/dog I sell an average of 45 of my 50 dogs that my cart can carry. Even the ones that are overcooked and shriveled are likely to sell on a normal day.

However, what I have found is that if I raise my price to $3 a dog I tend to only sell about 30 dogs a day and the the people buying the dogs always ask for the best looking dogs with the warmest buns. The people that come late to my stand sometimes do what I call a "fly by" to check out the quality of my dogs at this higher price. If they don't see a fresh dog they are walking across the street to larry's lamb to get a gyro.

I know this may be surprising to some, but when my customers buy a dog they want the best possible dog. It is kind of like when I hired Tyler and Shelly to run my two other stands - I interviewed a lot of people, but I choose them because they had the most experience.
This is literally nonsense. Like yeah, the demand for labor likely goes down at $9/hour vs. $4/hour all else equal. Great. Whether workers are better off is an econometric question that you aren't even trying to answer, apparently because you cant grasp that multiple factors are at play. You also don't understand the idea that just because a worker is getting paid $4 in a non-minimum wage world doesn't mean that the marginal value of their labor is exactly $4 outside of an econ 101 textbook with conditions that aren't automatically met in the real world.

Just don't try to make economics analogies bahbah, you are below remedial level trying to understand anything finance/economics/market related (which makes it hilarious that you consider your profession to be "financial advisor"). Its literally the same level of nonsense as thinking something provided by the government has no cost to society. That's right bahbah, again, you and the duller members of the OWS crowd playing on the same level.

Last edited by LetsGambool; 12-04-2015 at 05:49 PM.
12-04-2015 , 05:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTheMick2
You are making an empirical claim about minimum wage hurting minority workers. Any data to support the claim?
I'll make a guess it some how involves praxeology, but probably not by name.
12-04-2015 , 05:51 PM
I would like to use this thread to say that this whole "racism" drumbeat is out of hand.

I'm a Hispanic living in the heart of the Deep South (Oxford, MS), and I have not experienced ONE SINGLE INSTANCE of discrimination. Quite to the contrary: one time when I was in dire straits, and I spent a very short period of time homeless, people who found out what had happened to me were falling all over themselves to try to help me secure a shelter, or gave me substantial amounts of money.

To the extent that discrimination exists at all in modern America, it's more elitist than really racist (and frankly in a lot of cases justified). People don't look down on you for being black or brown -- they do because you're dressed like a hoodrat and/or have a heavy accent (I've worked really hard to lose my own accent and I'm usually told I sound like I'm from the Northwest). A black man who speaks proper English and dresses in a suit and tie (or even just clean, fitting clothes) will be much better received than one that looks and speaks like ghetto rat.
12-04-2015 , 07:03 PM
How many racist statements did Aleksei just make? 2? 3?
12-04-2015 , 07:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGambool
bahbah, you are calling something dumb in the midst of somehow completely ignoring the first level effect of minimum wage hikes...people who were making the minimum wage make more money. The net effect of minimum wage hikes on all parties is an econometric question but, you cant just simply ignore the fact that people making the minimum wage now make more money. That's what you have done so far with your minimum wage argument.

So lets clear this up...you agree people who hold minimum wage jobs actually make more money when the minimum wage goes up right?



This is literally nonsense. Like yeah, the demand for labor likely goes down at $9/hour vs. $4/hour all else equal. Great. Whether workers are better off is an econometric question that you aren't even trying to answer, apparently because you cant grasp that multiple factors are at play. You also don't understand the idea that just because a worker is getting paid $4 in a non-minimum wage world doesn't mean that the marginal value of their labor is exactly $4 outside of an econ 101 textbook with conditions that aren't automatically met in the real world.

Just don't try to make economics analogies bahbah, you are below remedial level trying to understand anything finance/economics/market related (which makes it hilarious that you consider your profession to be "financial advisor"). Its literally the same level of nonsense as thinking something provided by the government has no cost to society. That's right bahbah, again, you and the duller members of the OWS crowd playing on the same level.
I am not ignoring that some people are better with a MW - I didn't mention it because literally everyone knows some are better off because of it. I was just pointing out that minorities are more likely to be negatively effected by an increase of MW.

For whoever asked me for proof of this: are there a higher % of minorities or whites with college degrees? High school degrees? Also, remember that a lot of liberals love pointing out that some people in this country who hire people are racist against minorities so if there are more people to be unemployed, who's going to be more effected?
12-04-2015 , 07:26 PM
Quote:
I am not ignoring that some people are better with a MW - I didn't mention it because literally everyone knows some are better off because of it. I was just pointing out that minorities are more likely to be negatively effected by an increase of MW.
Right. A statement you have not backed up with any data. Once again, in this sentence that you wrote, you ignore that the underlying assumption driving your assertion also would hold in saying minimum wage workers make more money after a minimum wage hike, so minorities are more likely to be positively effected by an increase in the MW.

Quote:
For whoever asked me for proof of this: are there a higher % of minorities or whites with college degrees? High school degrees? Also, remember that a lot of liberals love pointing out that some people in this country who hire people are racist against minorities so if there are more people to be unemployed, who's going to be more effected?
You are still literally too dumb to understand the econometric question being asked. Nice work as usual.
12-04-2015 , 09:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksei
I would like to use this thread to say that this whole "racism" drumbeat is out of hand.

I'm a Hispanic living in the heart of the Deep South (Oxford, MS), and I have not experienced ONE SINGLE INSTANCE of discrimination. Quite to the contrary: one time when I was in dire straits, and I spent a very short period of time homeless, people who found out what had happened to me were falling all over themselves to try to help me secure a shelter, or gave me substantial amounts of money.

To the extent that discrimination exists at all in modern America, it's more elitist than really racist (and frankly in a lot of cases justified). People don't look down on you for being black or brown -- they do because you're dressed like a hoodrat and/or have a heavy accent (I've worked really hard to lose my own accent and I'm usually told I sound like I'm from the Northwest). A black man who speaks proper English and dresses in a suit and tie (or even just clean, fitting clothes) will be much better received than one that looks and speaks like ghetto rat.

I have anecdotal experiences that totally confirm racism, but that is besides the point. Did you know your post sounds like the beating of the racism denial drum? We have to deal with the fact that racists haven't simply disappeared like there was some weird rapture.
12-05-2015 , 02:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerowo
How many racist statements did Aleksei just make? 2? 3?
Criticizing a culture is not the same as criticizing a race. Culture is something you can choose.

People are not racist against this:



Or this:



They're "racist" against this:



And for that matter, this.



And that makes all the difference in the world. You want to be accepted by society? You don't have to change your race or skin color, you just need to act like decent, contributing members of society are expected to act. Speak clearly. Dress cleanly. Educate yourself.
12-05-2015 , 04:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksei
I would like to use this thread to say that this whole "racism" drumbeat is out of hand.

I'm a Hispanic living in the heart of the Deep South (Oxford, MS), and I have not experienced ONE SINGLE INSTANCE of discrimination. Quite to the contrary: one time when I was in dire straits, and I spent a very short period of time homeless, people who found out what had happened to me were falling all over themselves to try to help me secure a shelter, or gave me substantial amounts of money.

To the extent that discrimination exists at all in modern America, it's more elitist than really racist (and frankly in a lot of cases justified). People don't look down on you for being black or brown -- they do because you're dressed like a hoodrat and/or have a heavy accent (I've worked really hard to lose my own accent and I'm usually told I sound like I'm from the Northwest). A black man who speaks proper English and dresses in a suit and tie (or even just clean, fitting clothes) will be much better received than one that looks and speaks like ghetto rat.
You are an idiot or a liar, or both. I am going to go with both.
12-05-2015 , 04:27 AM
I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.
12-05-2015 , 04:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksei
I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.
That is a response dumbass.
12-05-2015 , 11:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksei
People are not racist against this:

James Bond Author Apologizes For Calling Idris Elba ‘Too Street’ to Play 007
12-05-2015 , 11:52 AM
Doesn't mean he is racist. I can't picture James Bond being black either, though I am interested to see how Idris would do as the character.
12-05-2015 , 01:14 PM
Word on the street is that "street" can be used as a 'code word' or indirect inference to criminality.

"Street" is also a fashion, and a tragic place for a person to sleep.
12-05-2015 , 06:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenPoke
Doesn't mean he is racist. I can't picture James Bond being black either, though I am interested to see how Idris would do as the character.
He'd likely resemble Roger Moore most of all.

I would say he's not optimal for the character not because he's "street", but because that's not the type of character he usually plays -- the closest he's gotten to it is the suave businessman.

He would make an amazing Bond villain. Probably the best one in recent memory.
12-06-2015 , 09:16 PM
He could never be Bond. Watch "No Good Deed". This guy was a giant bitch, a woman physically kicked his ass the whole movie. Beat him with one object after another and he couldn't get off an offensive move, finally she just disarms him and fills him full of lead with his own gun. What a bitch!
12-07-2015 , 06:59 AM
He's an actor, not a character.

You wanna see Idris Elba as an effective hero, watch Luther (one of my favorite series ever, incidentally). Wanna see him as an effective villain, watch Beasts of No Nation.
12-07-2015 , 07:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksei
He's an actor, not a character.

You wanna see Idris Elba as an effective hero, watch Luther (one of my favorite series ever, incidentally). Wanna see him as an effective villain, watch Beasts of No Nation.
I was watching Luther when the talk of him playing Bond was going on and think he could do a terrific Bond. It's obviously a matter of opinion who would be best but you're way off the mark if you think racism doesn't play a part in casting.

      
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