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Old 02-23-2017, 02:30 PM   #1526
einbert
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Re: President Trump

All of this isn't about being a victim, but rather being aware of what's going on in the world so that we can all activate and work towards creating a better world. That's called active participation in democracy.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:30 PM   #1527
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by wil318466 View Post
We disagree, then. The path you are going down leads to nothing but anger and resentment.

You'll never make things better the way you are approaching it. Period.
Still such wrong. I doubt you know anger and resent much further past your nose and are definitely talking out your ass when it comes to many others about it. So I more than disagree, I defy your view reasonably. I suggest re-considering allies and civil rights.

Telling it like it is- You clearly act bigoted about 'white allies', which may influence further argumentation the matter. You may even be making things worse for helpful allies of people. So I agree that you disagree and I defy your view reasonably on the matter.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:30 PM   #1528
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Re: President Trump

Wil, you said you actually went to college. When asked for citations, did you always do the "my friend told me" in research papers?
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:33 PM   #1529
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by einbert View Post
All of this isn't about being a victim, but rather being aware of what's going on in the world so that we can all activate and work towards creating a better world. That's called active participation in democracy.
Sure it is. Why don't you talk to Hispanics the way you do to blacks?

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Still such wrong. I doubt you know anger and resent much further past your nose and are definitely talking out your ass when it comes to many others about it. So I more than disagree, I defy your view reasonably. I suggest re-considering allies and civil rights.

Telling it like it is- You clearly act bigoted about 'white allies', which may influence further argumentation the matter. You may even be making things worse for helpful allies of people. So I agree that you disagree and I defy your view reasonably on the matter.
Do you think I want "white allies" for my people?
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:34 PM   #1530
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Re: President Trump

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I'm not sure if I exactly understand what you want here. If my response is to the wrong question, let me know and I'll answer again.

My conclusion is that me being a minority in this country is just part of my experience here. I have to accept certain things and overcome them. I will always be treated by some as an outsider. I will always face racism, at least a little bit. I will always be asked "where are you from"?

I have to get over it and live my life. I can't let it consume me and fill me with hate. I can't blame white people for a job I don't get or a cop pulling me over for a BS reason.

Imagine you were me, and all you thought about was racism and how awful white people are all the time. They will discriminate against you regardless and you'll NEVER be treated as equal. Imagine how you would feel, and how angry and crappy your life would be. And trust me, I've met other Koreans who feel EXACTLY that way. They are pussies in my book.

I refuse to let that beat me. I'll do what I do regardless of racism. If you're racist, so be it. I'll still smoke you mfers.
I think your position here is entirely reasonable, but my question is more like, what does it have to do with our discussion? People will be happier if they don't think about the existential gun to their heads all the time - okay, sure, but does that mean the gun isn't there? Does that mean they should ignore it? Can you do anything about the gun if you don't acknowledge its existence?
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:35 PM   #1531
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Re: President Trump

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Sure it is. Why don't you talk to Hispanics the way you do to blacks?
What in the god-blistery hell are you talking about? You're just making stuff up out of thin air again.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:37 PM   #1532
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
I think your position here is entirely reasonable, but my question is more like, what does it have to do with our discussion? People will be happier if they don't think about the existential gun to their heads all the time - okay, sure, but does that mean the gun isn't there? Does that mean they should ignore it? Can you do anything about the gun if you don't acknowledge its existence?
What, exactly, is the difference between me and a black kid who grew up in the same economic class?

When you say "gun to the head", describe, specifically, that gun.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:38 PM   #1533
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Re: President Trump

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What in the god-blistery hell are you talking about? You're just making stuff up out of thin air again.
No, I'm really not. It's why I asked you what race you were. Trust me, I already knew.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:38 PM   #1534
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Re: President Trump

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What in the god-blistery hell are you talking about? You're just making stuff up out of thin air again.
It's called projection. He makes up the point he wants to argue against every single time. It comes across as schizophrenic and off topic, but it's important to realize.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:39 PM   #1535
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Unhappy Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by wil318466 View Post
What, exactly, is the difference between me and a black kid who grew up in the same economic class?

When you say "gun to the head", describe, specifically, that gun.
We would clearly have to know more about your upbringing to comment on this.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:39 PM   #1536
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Re: President Trump

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Old 02-23-2017, 02:42 PM   #1537
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Re: President Trump

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Old 02-23-2017, 02:44 PM   #1538
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by wil318466 View Post
What, exactly, is the difference between me and a black kid who grew up in the same economic class?

When you say "gun to the head", describe, specifically, that gun.
Without knowing more details, I'd imagine a black kid who grew up otherwise the same as you has the odds stacked against him slightly more due to the discrimination/prejudice he'd face from the color of his skin.

The "gun" is a metaphor and its details aren't particularly important, it's whatever you want it to be to describe racial inequality in the US.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:49 PM   #1539
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
Without knowing more details, I'd imagine a black kid who grew up otherwise the same as you has the odds stacked against him slightly more due to the discrimination/prejudice he'd face from the color of his skin.

The "gun" is a metaphor and its details aren't particularly important, it's whatever you want it to be to describe racial inequality in the US.
Slightly more? OK, even if I granted you that as true, then what? Why such a disparity when looking at the numbers? In some ways blacks are more accepted than Asians. What's the main driver between experiences? A little more racism?
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:54 PM   #1540
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by kerowo View Post
Perhaps the reason an area is marked as high crime is because the police are hassling black people there at a higher rate than they are in a predominately white neighborhood?
You think the reason an area is a high crime area is because there is too much police presence. That sounds like a take you would have. Areas don't get marked high crime areas because there are a few more car searches where they come up with a few joints or a few more resisting arrests.

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There needs to be institutional changes made to address systemic racism.
That is what I have been saying for the past 2 days. At least part of the blame that the police gets deserves to be on other parts of our society that are racist.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:56 PM   #1541
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Re: President Trump

Why are you asking all these questions when you still haven't answered mine? I just wanted to know what your point was in bringing up this "happiness" argument.

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
I think your position here is entirely reasonable, but my question is more like, what does it have to do with our discussion? People will be happier if they don't think about the existential gun to their heads all the time - okay, sure, but does that mean the gun isn't there? Does that mean they should ignore it? Can you do anything about the gun if you don't acknowledge its existence?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wil318466 View Post
When you say "gun to the head", describe, specifically, that gun.
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
The "gun" is a metaphor and its details aren't particularly important, it's whatever you want it to be to describe racial inequality in the US.
...
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:04 PM   #1542
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
Why are you asking all these questions when you still haven't answered mine? I just wanted to know what your point was in bringing up this "happiness" argument.
...

Sorry, I missed it. Yes, I think some things should be ignored and people should rise above it. There is responsibility on both sides.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:09 PM   #1543
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Re: President Trump

I don't see the connection to people's happiness. For the people who fought against civil rights, they would have been happier if they could just ignore the inequality and do their best to live a happy fulfilling live without fighting the status quo and getting beaten and jailed and sometimes killed and stuff. That doesn't mean they could or should have done that. That doesn't mean people who would be happier ignoring all the bad things Trump might do as president because it won't affect them should just ignore him and let them do it.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:13 PM   #1544
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Re: President Trump

Goofy, Wil thinks that the people who become activists have wanted this (particularly the attention) all their lives. It is basically nonexistent that an activist went looking for a cause. Just a simple knowledge of history and the two most popular activists (Mandela and MLK) show a complete opposite of his view on people who "make race their whole lives."
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:16 PM   #1545
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
I don't see the connection to people's happiness. For the people who fought against civil rights, they would have been happier if they could just ignore the inequality and do their best to live a happy fulfilling live without fighting the status quo and getting beaten and jailed and sometimes killed and stuff. That doesn't mean they could or should have done that. That doesn't mean people who would be happier ignoring all the bad things Trump might do as president because it won't affect them should just ignore him and let them do it.
It seems we have a disconnect between perception of attitudes between groups.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:27 PM   #1546
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by aoFrantic View Post
Goofy, Wil thinks that the people who become activists have wanted this (particularly the attention) all their lives. It is basically nonexistent that an activist went looking for a cause. Just a simple knowledge of history and the two most popular activists (Mandela and MLK) show a complete opposite of his view on people who "make race their whole lives."
If you'd like to speak for me to goofy, please take it to pm.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:28 PM   #1547
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Re: President Trump

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It seems we have a disconnect between perception of attitudes between groups.
In what way? I didn't think anything in that post was controversial.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:28 PM   #1548
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by wil318466 View Post
Sorry, I missed it. Yes, I think some things should be ignored and people should rise above it. There is responsibility on both sides.
"Those blacks should just accept that they receive fewer callbacks for job interviews." Got it.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:30 PM   #1549
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Re: President Trump

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Do you think I want "white allies" for my people?
Besides the possibility of there being so many of them you'll have many reliable allies? Really, Why does any one want supporters and allies?

As a person who actually investigated what becoming an ally entails with a particular group of people who asked i found stuff out. Part of being helpful is finding out what can help and what doesn't. Learning about people.

I'll try to be helpful in an information sharing way:

It seems a common want and need of people who face oppression and erasure is a want for the whole world to know and remember what isn't stopped. So when you see an ally telling things to know about people, saying what is going- that is what is happening. No self-hate, victimizing, class schemes, or colorful guilt even required. People have a demand for help and people have a supply of privilege and ability to help.
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Old 02-23-2017, 03:34 PM   #1550
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
In what way? I didn't think anything in that post was controversial.
OK, so maybe we are miscommunicating. What did you want me address?

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Originally Posted by Lord_Crispen View Post
"Those blacks should just accept that they receive fewer callbacks for job interviews." Got it.
As opposed to what?

You're a young black guy and didn't get a call back for a job. What are your options?
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