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Old 06-09-2017, 08:04 PM   #6226
Abbaddabba
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
I don't think I need The Atlantic to interpret the Moynihan report for me.

Even the Brookings Institute (with it's liberal bias) recognizes the three keys to join the middle class - https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/t...-middle-class/

1) Finish High School
2) Get a full time job
3) Wait until you're 21 to get married and have kids.

The point of the Moynihan report was that the 25% out of wedlock rates at the time were a crisis, now it's up to 70% - WITH our ass backward social programs in place. The policies of the Left are only working to keep the Left in power, not helping the people they're designed to help.

If you want to make the case that these programs lead to divorce or encourage single mother family structures you need to be specific. Maybe some do. Most probably have very little impact. There're a lot of other factors that impact rates of births out of wedlock too, like the increased participation rate of women in the work force.

You also have to keep in mind that there's a balance between having compassion for people who're totally ****ed and dissuading others from going down that path. Basic nutrition offered at a soup kitchen is, i guess, on some level an incentive for women to have children out of wedlock since now they're less fearful that their children will starve. On the whole... probably still justifiable.
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Old 06-10-2017, 01:09 AM   #6227
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by 13ball View Post
Do you think Tillerson should step down for supporting slavery? Or do you think it's okay for the Secretary of State to support slavery?
Hrmmm, just not seeing Tillerson supporting slavery:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...493_print.html

"A senior administration official, speaking after Trump’s comments, acknowledged a difference in “tone” with Tillerson. “But I think the policy is consistent,” said the official, "

“Tillerson may initially have had a view, then the president has his view, and obviously the president’s view prevails,” the official said."

"Throughout the week, the Pentagon has emphasized that the dispute has not affected its operations. Asked about Tillerson’s comment regarding hindered operations at Qatar’s Al-Udeid air base, Navy Capt. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon spokesman, said the situation had not changed, but that the Defense Logistics Agency was drawing up contingency plans in case the U.S. military’s use of the Qatar base becomes a problem."

You do know how carrots and sticks work, yes?
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Old 06-10-2017, 02:09 AM   #6228
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
Hrmmm, just not seeing Tillerson supporting slavery:
But you saw me supporting slavery (when I said absolutely nothing of the sort) simply for questioning Trump in this situation. Tillerson is also questioning Trump by taking the complete opposite position as him!

Of course, you don't actually give a **** about slavery or Qatar's human rights record, you just twist your personal logic into whatever pretzels are necessary to support Donald Trump. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Old 06-10-2017, 08:39 AM   #6229
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
Hrmmm, just not seeing Tillerson supporting slavery:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...493_print.html

"A senior administration official, speaking after Trump’s comments, acknowledged a difference in “tone” with Tillerson. “But I think the policy is consistent,” said the official, "

“Tillerson may initially have had a view, then the president has his view, and obviously the president’s view prevails,” the official said."

"Throughout the week, the Pentagon has emphasized that the dispute has not affected its operations. Asked about Tillerson’s comment regarding hindered operations at Qatar’s Al-Udeid air base, Navy Capt. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon spokesman, said the situation had not changed, but that the Defense Logistics Agency was drawing up contingency plans in case the U.S. military’s use of the Qatar base becomes a problem."

You do know how carrots and sticks work, yes?
Hey jiggy, who commits more ofbthevteerorism against the us? Shia or Sunni? You didn't answer above or maybe I missed it
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Old 06-10-2017, 09:20 AM   #6230
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by adios View Post
I know someone who has an "Obama" phone, at least that is what she calls it. Next time I see her I will ask her how she went about getting it if I get a chance. IIRC it had a limited number of minutes and they are supposed to use it for finding a job which she was doing. Pretty bare bones type of cell phone. Doesn't seem like a big deal.
there are tent stands all around the city. they are often outside of govt buildings and welfare buildings and other high traffic areas. usually it is a small tent and a desk and 2 ppl wearing shirts of the cell phone provider.

sign your name and fill out some info and get a phone. pretty sure you can use fake info. pretty sure you can go to every stand in the city and get 8 phones though I would guess you cant get 2 phones from the same provider.

the phones are garbage 10 dollar phones. no internet or touch screen.

its amazing that some ppl get so mad about these cheap phones.
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Old 06-10-2017, 02:16 PM   #6231
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
Hrmmm, just not seeing Tillerson supporting slavery:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...493_print.html

"A senior administration official, speaking after Trump’s comments, acknowledged a difference in “tone” with Tillerson. “But I think the policy is consistent,” said the official, "

“Tillerson may initially have had a view, then the president has his view, and obviously the president’s view prevails,” the official said."

"Throughout the week, the Pentagon has emphasized that the dispute has not affected its operations. Asked about Tillerson’s comment regarding hindered operations at Qatar’s Al-Udeid air base, Navy Capt. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon spokesman, said the situation had not changed, but that the Defense Logistics Agency was drawing up contingency plans in case the U.S. military’s use of the Qatar base becomes a problem."

You do know how carrots and sticks work, yes?
You don't give a horse both of those at the same time, Jiggy.
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Old 06-10-2017, 08:36 PM   #6232
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by samsonh View Post
Hey jiggy, who commits more ofbthevteerorism against the us? Shia or Sunni? You didn't answer above or maybe I missed it
I didn't know there were good terrorists and bad terrorists. If you want to make a case for going after one group, make it yourself.
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Old 06-10-2017, 08:37 PM   #6233
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by FlyWf View Post
You don't give a horse both of those at the same time, Jiggy.
So, you don't know how they work in regards to international diplomacy. I'm glad we've cleared that up.
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Old 06-10-2017, 11:15 PM   #6234
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
I didn't know there were good terrorists and bad terrorists. If you want to make a case for going after one group, make it yourself.
Yeah that wasn't the question. Who makes up the majority of the terrorists attacking us?

Do you understand which countries are which sect of Islam? Does this cause you severe cognitive dissonance?
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Old 06-11-2017, 12:03 AM   #6235
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by samsonh View Post
Yeah that wasn't the question. Who makes up the majority of the terrorists attacking us?

Do you understand which countries are which sect of Islam? Does this cause you severe cognitive dissonance?
If you have point to make, make it.
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Old 06-11-2017, 12:40 AM   #6236
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by microbet View Post
Yeah, lol. Saudi Arabia may indeed be the worst of the worst, including North Korea. Qatar is terrible though. They are both worse than Iran.
Israel is about a tie with Saudi Arabia. Why would you leave out Israel?
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Old 06-11-2017, 12:45 AM   #6237
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by Victor View Post
the phones are garbage 10 dollar phones. no internet or touch screen.

its amazing that some ppl get so mad about these cheap phones.
It's not the value that makes them mad. It's the violation of the principle that the poor exist to be crushed. If the giveaway was a single chocolate chip the outrage level would remain the same.
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Old 06-11-2017, 01:29 AM   #6238
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by Deuces McKracken View Post
Israel is about a tie with Saudi Arabia. Why would you leave out Israel?
No. No one is free in Saudi Arabia - or perhaps just the royal family is. Also Saudi Arabia is working on setting up hundreds of thousands of people to die in Yemen. It's not close.

Israel is probably like the 50th worst country/government. Still, that's pretty bad.
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Old 06-11-2017, 02:04 AM   #6239
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by microbet View Post
No. No one is free in Saudi Arabia - or perhaps just the royal family is. Also Saudi Arabia is working on setting up hundreds of thousands of people to die in Yemen. It's not close.

Israel is probably like the 50th worst country/government. Still, that's pretty bad.
I admit Saudi Arabia is probably worse than Israel, which is not the consensus among people who generally think as I do (Israel being the worst among many leftists).

There are a lot worse things than what you mention about Saudi Arabia. As for Israel, there are millions of people inside who are not free and millions who are now rootless refugees outside. The people who are not free in Israel have it worse, in many ways, than those who are not free in SA.

In an objective evaluation of common measures, Israel is at least an honorable mention if not a medalist here. You're perspective seems to have matured somewhat from a few years ago. If that keeps going you will eventually let go of this sacred cow. So you might as well let it go now. How many times have you criticized Trump's proposed wall? What about the already existing segregation wall in Israel? Have you ever criticized that?
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Old 06-11-2017, 02:18 AM   #6240
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by Deuces McKracken View Post
I admit Saudi Arabia is probably worse than Israel, which is not the consensus among people who generally think as I do (Israel being the worst among many leftists).

There are a lot worse things than what you mention about Saudi Arabia. As for Israel, there are millions of people inside who are not free and millions who are now rootless refugees outside. The people who are not free in Israel have it worse, in many ways, than those who are not free in SA.

In an objective evaluation of common measures, Israel is at least an honorable mention if not a medalist here. You're perspective seems to have matured somewhat from a few years ago. If that keeps going you will eventually let go of this sacred cow. So you might as well let it go now. How many times have you criticized Trump's proposed wall? What about the already existing segregation wall in Israel? Have you ever criticized that?
I've criticized the wall in Israel a lot and specifically cited it as one of the biggest problems in Israel. I haven't significantly changed my position about Israel, which has always been that the occupation in unjust. I just spent a lot of time arguing with people who are wrong on either side and also with a steady stream of antisemites in the I/P thread.

I've argued with people who irrationally blame the United States for too much as well while at the same time often talking about horrible things that the US has done.
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Old 06-11-2017, 09:14 AM   #6241
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
If you have point to make, make it.
We should not be deepening ties with Sunni countries. Iran and other Shia countries would be a natural countries for the us to play against Saudi Arabia, who certainly does not behave like our ally. But I'm not the one playing 4D chess, so who knows. Maybe trump has a grand plan.
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Old 06-11-2017, 10:50 AM   #6242
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by samsonh View Post
We should not be deepening ties with Sunni countries. Iran and other Shia countries would be a natural countries for the us to play against Saudi Arabia, who certainly does not behave like our ally. But I'm not the one playing 4D chess, so who knows. Maybe trump has a grand plan.
Even if that country wants to "wipe Israel off the map"?

Israel is here to stay - the Muslim world needs to understand that.
There is a good point many make - if Muslims stopped taking up arms against Israel, there would be peace. If Israel dropped its arms, it would be destroyed.

Do either sect of Muslims truly want peace? Do I wish we could stop buying oil and simply protect Israel - sure.

Once again Trump makes an excellent point:
"Abbas - somebody in Palestine is going to make peace with Israel. Do you want it to be you or the next guy?"
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Old 06-11-2017, 11:18 AM   #6243
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
Even if that country wants to "wipe Israel off the map"?

Israel is here to stay - the Muslim world needs to understand that.
There is a good point many make - if Muslims stopped taking up arms against Israel, there would be peace. If Israel dropped its arms, it would be destroyed.

Do either sect of Muslims truly want peace? Do I wish we could stop buying oil and simply protect Israel - sure.

Once again Trump makes an excellent point:
"Abbas - somebody in Palestine is going to make peace with Israel. Do you want it to be you or the next guy?"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...=.918bf968fb73

“Wipe off the map,” in other words, has become easy shorthand for expressing revulsion at Iran’s anti-Israeli foreign policy. Certainly attention needs to be focused on that — and Iranian behavior in the region. But we’re going to award a Pinocchio to everyone — including ourselves — who has blithely repeated the phrase without putting it into context."
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Old 06-11-2017, 11:39 AM   #6244
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post

Once again Trump makes an excellent point:
"Abbas - somebody in Palestine is going to make peace with Israel. Do you want it to be you or the next guy?"
Abbas may not want to make peace with Israel lest he end up like Rabin.
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Old 06-11-2017, 12:45 PM   #6245
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by JiggyMac View Post
If you have point to make, make it.
His point was that you don't know which countries are which denomination, and that you also don't know which denomination the majority of terrorist groups are.

And he already made it.
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:33 PM   #6246
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
In which Donald Trump manages to give Iran of all places the moral high ground: Trump administration's backhanded condolences over Tehran terror blames Iran for being the victim of an attack


An impressive feat by an American leader that will surely take decades to be topped.
On the subject of the bolded, turns out it only took a few days:

Quote:
Originally Posted by einbert View Post

https://twitter.com/KaivanShroff/sta...48111683977216
His comments are absolutely amazing:

Quote:
We have recently seen an attack on Iran, and the Iranian government, the mullahs, believe that Sunni forces have attacked them. This may signal a ratcheting up of certain commitments by the United States of America. As far as I’m concerned, I just want to make this point and see what you think, isn’t it a good thing for us to have the United States finally backing up Sunnis who will attack Hezbollah and the Shiite threat to us? Isn’t that a good thing? And if so, maybe this is a Trump — maybe it’s a Trump strategy of actually supporting one group against another, considering that you have two terrorist organizations.
The group he's talking about "backing up" is ****ing ISIS, and he is gleeful about Iran being the victims of a terrorist attack.
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:42 PM   #6247
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by goofyballer View Post
On the subject of the bolded, turns out it only took a few days:



His comments are absolutely amazing:



The group he's talking about "backing up" is ****ing ISIS, and he is gleeful about Iran being the victims of a terrorist attack.
Not into watching videos posted on Twitter. What point(s) are you trying to make here regarding US policy in the Middle East?
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:52 PM   #6248
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Re: President Trump

I posted a text snippet of his comments so that you don't have to watch a video. The point seems pretty clear, GOP politicians are kinda pieces of human garbage when they have to ask themselves about our political relationship with a country before deciding if we should be
- gravely sad (lol, not for Iranians apparently)
- a little sad but also you kinda deserved it (Trump)
- outright ecstatic (Rohrabacher)
that a country was attacked by terrorists.
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:53 PM   #6249
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Re: President Trump

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Originally Posted by samsonh View Post
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...=.918bf968fb73

“Wipe off the map,” in other words, has become easy shorthand for expressing revulsion at Iran’s anti-Israeli foreign policy. Certainly attention needs to be focused on that — and Iranian behavior in the region. But we’re going to award a Pinocchio to everyone — including ourselves — who has blithely repeated the phrase without putting it into context."
Don't have a Washington Post subscription. Oh well.
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:57 PM   #6250
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Re: President Trump

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Not into watching videos posted on Twitter.
While I am 1000% in support of your view about Twitter videos, you do realize this was a video of a member of Congress during a Congressional hearing?
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