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07-23-2017 , 11:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomaddd
I'm sorry, this is just stupid. One, it's not accurate. Two, its inaccurate for the purpose to make someone look bad.


This is not an issue of controlling peoples identities. It's clear who is trying to control something, the left is obviously trying to control and dictate my, and others, interpretation by bullying me, and others into indulging in a delusion, falsehood, myth, or what ever word you want to use to describe something that is not true.
In addition to the fact that he was in the middle of a typical deranged Wil raging tirade, the bolded part is what's stupid. Can you think of an important elected official we currently have in office who does this? An example might be completely making up having viewed thousands of Muslims celebrating 9/11 from NJ rooftops, or retweeting white-supremacist originated memes with fake crime statistics that suggest all white murder victims are killed by blacks.
07-24-2017 , 12:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomaddd
Who is trying to change the definition of man and woman and gender and sex?
No one. Sex-reassignment surgery has been around for almost seven decades. Not new. You've met transgendered people who've transitioned before, I can assure you.
07-24-2017 , 12:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by well named
I would say you don't, but it would take a lot more effort than I'm willing to make right this moment to try to sort you out.

But, cliffs notes is you don't seem to be aware that that it's a natural phenomena that has existed in a lot of different cultures. cf. Hijras in India or Pakistan for example, or Navajo gender categories in North America. It's one thing to say that sex in humans is approximately dimorphic (A large majority of people fit comfortably into one of two sexes/genders), but another thing to say that it's absolutely dimorphic. Transgender doesn't happen just because some people decide -- inexplicably -- that they'd rather just ignore biology. It almost certainly has some biological causes, although they are poorly understood right now. That said, we know that something like 0.5-2% of people are intersex in ways that can be identified easily, and we don't know what kinds of intersex characteristics might be less easily identifiable, i.e. because they impact the brain but not genitalia as directly.

How society should deal with people who feel mismatched to their assigned gender is a difficult subject, but it definitely doesn't reduce to your proclamation that they are just fundamentally wrong.
For all intents and purposes it is absolutely dimoprhic with a very few actual genetic exceptions. Like a correlation of about 0.95. Almost perfectly correlated in other words. And you want all of society to stop being bigoted by assuming genders because of the rare exceptions. Lol.
07-24-2017 , 12:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
For all intents and purposes it is absolutely dimoprhic with a very few actual genetic exceptions. Like a correlation of about 0.95. Almost perfectly correlated in other words. And you want all of society to stop being bigoted by assuming genders because of the rare exceptions. Lol.
What position are you taking, exactly? That the majority of transgender people are lying, misguided, or delusional?
07-24-2017 , 12:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2OutsNoProb
No one. Sex-reassignment surgery has been around for almost seven decades. Not new. You've met transgendered people who've transitioned before, I can assure you.
If I surgically implant chicken feathers, and think I'm a chicken, does not make me a chicken, but you apparently think becasue you cut off a dick, take medicine, and pretend and think you are a woman, you are woman. That is asinine.

Last edited by nomaddd; 07-24-2017 at 01:01 AM.
07-24-2017 , 01:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by legend42
What position are you taking, exactly? That the majority of transgender people are lying, misguided, or delusional?
I'm definitely not on the side that anyone who is skeptical of any idea progressives come up with is a bigot.

That said, there's a couple important considerations when talking about this transgender thing. The first is that objectively speaking, saying you are a woman trapped in a man's body is almost exactly the same as saying you are Napoleon in DoOrDoNots body or Jesus Christ in legend42s body. In other words, just at face value it rings of a delusion.

The second thing is that this precludes that

1. men and women have vastly different brains (which is something feminists dismiss)
2. it's possible for a womans brain to end up in a mans body from a biological view or vice versa and and that this hypothesis is even disprovable from a scientific point of view
3. the agent in question could tell the difference between themselves having a mans brain in a womans body and acute symptoms of psychosis and
4. Gender is a social construct

Now 4 can be discounted quite easily because male and female identity is correlated in the extreme to biological sex as I said before-0.95

As for the other ones, don't you think it's important to ****ing prove this ****, before you trample all over everyone for being skeptical of it, or force by law little girls to change in the same change-rooms as grown-ass dudes who identify as female? Or giving children hormones a decade or more before their brains are even capable of critical thought? Doesn't that seem....rash and irresponsible not to?
07-24-2017 , 01:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomaddd
If I surgically implant chicken feathers, and think I'm a chicken, does not make me a chicken, but you apparently think becasue you cut off a dick, take medicine, and pretend and think you are a woman, you are woman. That is asinine.
To compare species with gender is supremely asinine.
07-24-2017 , 02:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
Jerry Seinfeld was never funny, ever, and he was the least funny person on his own show.
What causes homophobia? What is it that makes a heterosexual man worry? I
think it's because men know that deep down we have weak sales resistance. We're constantly buying shoes that hurt us, pants that don't fit right. Men think, "Obviously I can be talked into anything. What if I accidentally wander into some sort of homosexual store, thinking it's a shoe store, and the salesman
goes, 'Just hold this guy's hand, walk around the store a little bit, see how
you feel. No obligation, no pressure, just try it. Would you like to see him
in a sandal?'"
07-24-2017 , 02:13 AM
So being Hitler is fun. Well, s**t.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
Nah not really, I get my humor needs met not with mainstream media, which is just watered down enough for you to not get offended and have a healthy, non-discriminatory chuckle

If I didn't know what degenerates most of you liberals are I would suspect you water down sex as well. Can't have TOO much fun. Don't want to spontaneously morph into Hitler.
07-24-2017 , 02:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer
Because the posts you write are ****ing stupid and don't make any sense until you have to revise them 4 times after being shown why they're stupid. Your reality: liberals seem like they'd be no fun in bed. Actual reality: your side tries to actively legislate that ****!!!!!
Lol he's one of those.
07-24-2017 , 02:31 AM
Let me stop grunching, here we go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
I've actually never seen any of my black friends sneer at a racist joke as hard as I have seen white liberals sneer at them. After all black people are just a politically expedient class that white liberals use for power leverage, they don't actually care about them. Case in point the entire Democratic party. So no I didn't insinuate FlyWf is any particular race; it doesn't matter if he is a member of the race that leftists exploit or a member of the group that exploits them to me.




I said if it wasn't for their blatant degeneracy, they would water down sex like they water down everything else. The conclusion of this statement is that liberals do not water down sex ---the opposite of which you have accused me of 4 times now.
07-24-2017 , 02:34 AM
Lolz I lied.

Real Racists(tm) in the hizzy!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
Just the fact you think that black people need white liberals to care for them at all shows what a racist piece of **** you are.
07-24-2017 , 03:05 AM
glue and glass time

Quote:
Originally Posted by well named
Or, alternatively, I can cite medical research. Which seems to be more than you are able to do?
07-24-2017 , 03:07 AM
And, like, I haven't even gotten to the wil part yet.
07-24-2017 , 03:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoOrDoNot
As for the other ones, don't you think it's important to ****ing prove this ****, before you trample all over everyone for being skeptical of it, or force by law little girls to change in the same change-rooms as grown-ass dudes who identify as female?
Some people are saying we have a grown ass man as president who went into the Miss Teen USA changing room. And that seems ok...
07-24-2017 , 03:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyWf
The civility and discourse queens over here who cry like babies when somebody uses swears or calls something bigoted are way more chill about pointless rudeness here, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Spoiler:
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
07-24-2017 , 03:55 AM
Let me slip in a High Content post here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomaddd
I can appreciate defects, mental illness, abnormalities or whatever non-stigmatized word you can think of...

As an example, I do not embrace the delusions of schizophrenics, but it does not mean I'm disrespecting them by not buying into their paranoia.



It's the same with TG's. They have abnormal thoughts concerning their biological sex.
Your analogy is poor. The apt analogy is you saying you don't believe schizophrenics, that they're 'pretending' or 'faking it' or what have you. Perhaps, they're even delusional about having psychotic delusions, as paradoxical as that might seem to a thinking person. You see somebody down at the clinic wearing a shirt and tie and polished shoes, and you refuse to believe they feel their brain is infected by devils because they look sane, to you.

When framed this correct way it's obvious how ridiculous your stance is, right?

And see, I think the problem you have with the correct framing is you can't equate TG with mentally ill, not nearly as readily.

Replace schizophrenia with feeling happy. You see a person who lost his job and his house but says, hey, at least I have my health, I'll be fine, and you express disbelief. That optimistic spirit must be pretend as it doesn't square with your limited understanding of manifested realities.

Right?
07-24-2017 , 04:03 AM
I gotta admit, wil just identified as a non-stupid person, so he might be on to something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wil318466
This is a false argument. Words mean something. Calling someone a man or a he actually means something. It's literally the way we describe other human beings. It is not trivial in the least bit.

You are literally saying we can interchange words we use every day dependent on one specific person's sense of reality. Do you call something red that is blue because another person wants you to call it blue?

You sound like a crazy person. Listen to what the **** you're saying. Your argument is "it's not a big deal!". What kind of argument is that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wil318466
No, it's not ****ing true. What is this silly response? You just throw your hands up and say "no", like a baby?

WORDS MEAN SOMETHING. You don't call a 50 year old person a child. You don't call a tree a dog. You don't call a nose an ear. And you sure as hell don't call a man a woman.

We know what men and women are. We know that human sexuality can be complicated and that people have certain mental issues that may cause them to think they identify with another gender. That doesn't make it true.

Even if you transition from a man to a woman and get your penis removed and have a vagina created for you and take hormones and look and talk and act like a woman, you are STILL NOT A WOMAN. You may be called one due to your appearance, and you may be accepted as one due to your behavior and appearance (in society), but you are NOT a woman.

There is no real discussion here. There is no gray area where we can argue back and forth about social constructs or acceptance. A trans MTF can NOT have a baby and does NOT have the female reproductive system.

I'm sorry. I wish there was a way to make it so, so that people can find happiness and peace within their own selves, although I still think that would be an issue. I do not deny them their humanity and I do not wish them any harm, however this issue is really not up for debate. Their hurt feelings doesn't get to dictate how I interact with the world around me. NO one's feelings do. Reality is reality and you are supporting changing that depending on another person's wishes.

It's insanity, and frankly, a topic that makes you and your side look like delusional crackpots. If there is any single topic that makes no sense from the left, it's this one. We can argue about economics or social issues or equality until we turn blue in the face, but you guys arguing that a human being with a dick is actually a woman is just ****ing crazy.
07-24-2017 , 05:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wil318466
No, it's not ****ing true. What is this silly response? You just throw your hands up and say "no", like a baby?

WORDS MEAN SOMETHING. You don't call a 50 year old person a child. You don't call a tree a dog. You don't call a nose an ear. And you sure as hell don't call a man a woman.

We know what men and women are. We know that human sexuality can be complicated and that people have certain mental issues that may cause them to think they identify with another gender. That doesn't make it true.

Even if you transition from a man to a woman and get your penis removed and have a vagina created for you and take hormones and look and talk and act like a woman, you are STILL NOT A WOMAN. You may be called one due to your appearance, and you may be accepted as one due to your behavior and appearance (in society), but you are NOT a woman.

There is no real discussion here. There is no gray area where we can argue back and forth about social constructs or acceptance. A trans MTF can NOT have a baby and does NOT have the female reproductive system.

I'm sorry. I wish there was a way to make it so, so that people can find happiness and peace within their own selves, although I still think that would be an issue. I do not deny them their humanity and I do not wish them any harm, however this issue is really not up for debate. Their hurt feelings doesn't get to dictate how I interact with the world around me. NO one's feelings do. Reality is reality and you are supporting changing that depending on another person's wishes.

It's insanity, and frankly, a topic that makes you and your side look like delusional crackpots. If there is any single topic that makes no sense from the left, it's this one. We can argue about economics or social issues or equality until we turn blue in the face, but you guys arguing that a human being with a dick is actually a woman is just ****ing crazy.
Not to mention the fact that they can identify hundreds of years old corpses as male or female by bone density and hip structure, AND that in every living cell in your body is a chromosome that determines your sex.

Can you pretend to be a woman? **** ya. Modern technology and medical science can do wonders. Does that mean you are a woman? No. Does it mean I have to call you a woman? **** no, and I'll wipe my ass with any legislation that says I do. I'm not playing leftist games.
07-24-2017 , 08:20 AM
Remember, they are refusing to call people who they say they are without even doing a genitalia inspection first. They can't even see any peen, but are acting like they can.
07-24-2017 , 08:23 AM
Based on a mental assumption-what they think a person's genitalia may or may not look like, the DoNots of the world are ready to wipe their butts with the law.
07-24-2017 , 09:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyWf
There is. You can just be a normal decent person and call them by the appropriate gender pronoun.
But it's not appropriate, because it's not accurate. I do not see why you are confusing appropriate with "decent".
Quote:
Homie you were bragging about how you would physically assault them if they tried to piss in public, shut the **** up.
I would not let an obvious man dressed as a woman enter my daughters bathroom. I also would not allow an obvious man dressed as a woman enter any female child's bathroom under my care. If I allowed my sister to care for my daughter one day and I found out she allowed that to happen, I guarantee that's the last time I would allow them to spend time together unsupervised.

Absolutely not.

Quote:
Literally the words you used about them trying to take a ****ing leak were "over my dead body"

What the ****.
That is correct. It's not happening. Arrest me, beat me up, shoot me. I'm fine with that. What I'm not fine with is a man entering my daughters bathroom. I do not care what society deems acceptable or what laws are on the books. I do not want to get into a physical altercation, especially so in front of my family. But I will not allow that to happen in my presence, and I don't care what happens to me because of it. You put a cop in front of me and he tells me to step aside I'm telling him to suck my dick.

You think I'm joking around when it comes to my family? Seriously? Lol, like, you think I give a **** about my own safety or what other people think about me over the safety of children or my duty as a parent? Haha, you've lost your ****ing mind if you think that.

You have a lot to learn about life.

Quote:
Their hurt feelings don't dictate the world, WIL'S hurt feelings dictate the world
My hurt feelings don't dictate anything. We as humans created some ground rules so we can interact with the world around us. I support keeping them in place.
07-24-2017 , 09:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomaddd
It's not bigoted to tell the truth. A man is a man. Get over the fact I do not buy into something that is not true. Only the left would believe it's rude, bigoted not to indulge in the belief of fiction. The left does not want me to treat them like a transgender, they want me to treat a transgender like their prefered sex, i.e. names, etc etc, which is perpetrating a falsehood.
Look how much you care about this when it doesn't affect you in any way at all. I suppose you get really angry when someone calls a tomato a vegetable or a peanut a nut. You don't? Oh, that's because you're a worthless ****ing bigot. Almost forgot.
07-24-2017 , 09:50 AM
Presumably with no statistical basis, wil vastly overestimates the danger of TG using bathrooms. So much so that he is willing to lay his life on the line. Real fear, just like no-go zones and immigration. Real but unfounded fear that has been stoked for profit by unscrupulous media, including many left-leaning (not to imply an equivalency with RWNJ cartoon news).


---


I have to wonder if wil lays his life on the line for situations like Trump walking into young girl's dressing rooms. I believe he would not tolerate that, to be honest.

      
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