https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

This country has a long and proud tradition of taking up violence against Nazis and fascists. The original anti-fascists:

Antifa do not identify as liberals.

Yeah technically they are anarchists I believe. I don't agree with all of Antifa's actions. But I do believe they have the right do defend themselves against violence, just like anybody else.

I think they are mostly anarchists. Some communists too. Some probably neither. Most were quite anti-Hillary and perhaps a majority were anti-Bernie as well. They're just way more anti-Trumpenfuher.

I don't know the story. I only read that BS southern poverty law article.

I think you are mistaken in your implication that the left is reacting to violence. I think the left is the primary perpetrator of political violence in protests/groups in the United States, at least in the last 30 years or so.



Very funny. (I'm still weighing the value of the "whataboutism" argument.) Regardless of its merits in general, clearly, in this case, the leftist fascist event in February to which the right was responding in April, is clearly relevant.

Do you, at least, agree that the violent protesting committed by the left in Berkeley in February was wrong?

Edit: I was writing this post while the above 3 posts were being posted. - crossed in the ether but still relevant.

They are leftists.

Maybe you don't like them. I hope so, but they are left, not right.

That's true.

I don't like people who take cheap shots like the Antifa guy who pepper sprayed the woman at the Milo rally, but I don't automatically dislike someone because they identify as part of Antifa.

inb4 someone says leftist fascists is a contradiction of terms.

tl;dr:

Anarchists are definitely not totalitarian.

Communists, I'm not sure. Stalinists for sure. Leninist, I guess so. Trotskyists, I don't think so.

We all know there comes a time when it is appropriate to use violence. Example, somebody breaks into your house. If white supremacists are attacking Berkeley from out-of-state, people have a right to defend themselves.

Bert, have you seen more violence from the left or right in all these protests in the past year and a half?

Whoever used the whataboutism term: that is cute, but it goes both ways. I could just as easily say liberals seem to perpetrate more violence but you are okay with it by saying what about trump saying it is okay.

You're joking, right?

Update: Incidents of Hateful Harassment Since Election Day Now Number 701
https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/...now-number-701

Right-wing violence has spiked in record numbers since Trump's victory:

Hate crimes spike in wake of Donald Trump's win with 897 reports recorded in 10 days
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7445916.html

Post-election spate of hate crimes worse than post-9/11, experts say
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...-say/93681294/

First, I agree people have a right to defend themselves.

I haven't read up any more on this, but even from the article from the southern law poverty group, I don't think anyone was attacking Berkeley. Weren't the right wing protestors there to protest against the violations of free speech that occurred in February. They brought helmets and shields cuz they figured Antifa would be there again - starting the violence.

I mean, let's be clear about the February event. It appears that the police did nothing to stop the violence of Antifa, who were attempting to suppress free speech by means of violence.

The free speech supporters show up (including a white supremacist, or so I read), and a fight breaks out between the free speech supporters and the crowd opposing them - presumably the same crowd who suppressed speech with violence in the first place - not sure on that.

Are my facts mistaken some place?

Does it scare you guys that people are starting to realize that taking up violence against white supremacists is something that people are willing and actually eager to do right now.

'

No they brought weapons because they always intended to assault people. Look at the imagery used on their propaganda before the event.

Who did I call a name?

https://twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/8...2Findex45.html

https://twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/853425481970053121

And Maoists, and Pol Pot(ists) and Ho Chi Min(ists)... I'll just stop now. Communism is, as practiced in our world, overwhelmingly totalitarian.

Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG
Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG
Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG
Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG
Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG
Here's the same account, telling other alt-right Trump supporters how to make themselves look like antifa protesters at Berkeley today. pic.twitter.com/VskJQNldLG

"Someone else's babies" guy cannot contain his glee at a DREAMer being deported:



Check that out, pdox!