Anarchy - Page 9 - Politics version 7.0 -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

You're making my point for me.

It's hard to suppress the internet, but some governments are able to do it to a degree. Governments, not businesses. You don't see Apple preventing the people in China from seeing certain things on the internet, it's the Chinese government that does that.

Lol, nice to know you're ignorant of non-politics things as well.

05-27-2013 , 10:48 PM

#202

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by champstark

I was simply refuting the incorrect statement that it is difficult to suppress the Internet, period.

But that's a suppression of people's access, not suppression of the internet. The content is still there, they just are prevented from getting to it.

05-27-2013 , 10:49 PM

#203

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Oh man, this is too much.

The exact same thing can be said of people born into a world where all of the property is owned and people already claim control over it.

I can see why rich kids would be all supportive of ACLand - but I'm guessing kids born into poverty are going to claim that they never agreed to absolute property right axioms of ACLand. At least the social contract comes with some benefits.

This is an argument explaining why taxation is ok?

05-27-2013 , 10:50 PM

#204

rjoefish

Got Out the Vote

Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 31,086

ITT suppression =/= suppression.

05-27-2013 , 10:51 PM

#205

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjoefish

ITT suppression =/= suppression.

I just said it was suppression.

05-27-2013 , 10:53 PM

#206

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

This is an argument explaining why taxation is ok?

No, its explaining to you why:

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

They shouldn't be taxed because their birth was a random happenstance, they didn't choose to be born, and they had no voice in creating the policies they are being taxed to support, and it is completely wrong for individuals to claim the authority to tax other people, simply because they happened to be born on the continent they claim ownership over.

is ******ed. It's just one more example of your double standard towards ACism and the current system.

05-27-2013 , 10:57 PM

#207

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

The exact same thing can be said of people born into a world where all of the property is owned and people already claim control over it.

What makes you think all property would be owned?

Quote:

I can see why rich kids would be all supportive of ACLand - but I'm guessing kids born into poverty are going to claim that they never agreed to absolute property right axioms of ACLand. At least the social contract comes with some benefits.

I'm not rich, and I'm closer to poverty than wealthy. I support Anarchism. If someone doesn't agree to property rights, awesome, they can choose to not own any property.

The social contract is bull****, straight up.

05-27-2013 , 11:21 PM

#208

[Phill]

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 52,717

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Then I'll go rape someone and call it making love. Cool, right?

Are you brain damaged? That is the only possible explanation for making this post in reply to "words have meanings, taxation is tax".

05-27-2013 , 11:23 PM

#209

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

If I force you to give money to me at gun point, what is that called?

05-27-2013 , 11:25 PM

#210

[Phill]

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 52,717

Anarchy.

05-27-2013 , 11:26 PM

#211

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Wrong. Anarchy is the absence of hierarchy.

05-27-2013 , 11:32 PM

#212

[Phill]

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 52,717

AKA legalised criminality.

05-27-2013 , 11:37 PM

#213

MissileDog

a good little dog

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 5,581

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Wrong. Anarchy is the absence of hierarchy.

And capitalism is the ubitquitness of hierarchy.... boss/worker, landlord/renter, loaner/deptor, etc, etc. In fact all relations that revolve around the 'rights' of owners over others are by definition hierachical.

Hense ACism is an oxymoron.

05-27-2013 , 11:39 PM

#214

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Phill]

AKA legalised criminality.

Actually, that's the government.

05-27-2013 , 11:53 PM

#215

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Please explain to me how taxation is not theft.

I'll do it observationally: Everyone exposing that view is a febrile kook, ipso facto baby.

05-27-2013 , 11:57 PM

#216

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Well now you're just giving up.

05-27-2013 , 11:58 PM

#217

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

This is an argument explaining why taxation is ok?

Taxation is ok because as a society we've decided to let our government use our money to do stuff. Not all the stuff is necessarily "good," but most of it is. Not everyone agrees with how the money is spent but they can try to change it through several means. Including moving to a place where they are more in agreement with how the tax money is spent.

05-28-2013 , 12:01 AM

#218

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Well now you're just giving up.

Find a handful of non-kooks who seriously believe that "taxation is theft" and I may change my mind. Probably not though, the stupider the idea the stronger evidence needed for it, and I doubt you can provide that evidence. But really, when your ideas are basically championed by ultra conservative wing nuts you need to start considering the possibility that you're a wing nut too.

05-28-2013 , 12:03 AM

#219

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Taxation is ok because as a society we've decided to let our government use our money to do stuff.

I never agreed to that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Not all the stuff is necessarily "good," but most of it is.

A lot of it is very very terrible and tragic. The kind of stuff people try to criticize Anarchism over, like children being born into slavery, unstoppable murder, unstoppable theft, subjugation. The US government is extremely brutal to some people.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Not everyone agrees with how the money is spent but they can try to change it through several means. Including moving to a place where they are more in agreement with how the tax money is spent.

Agreement is good, but I never actually agreed to anything, so why is it ok to force me into compliance?

05-28-2013 , 12:08 AM

#220

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

Maybe you should stop considering different ideas "kooky" and the people that express them as "wing nuts", and try to have an open minded conversation.

I think Carl Sagan said it better, "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."

05-28-2013 , 12:09 AM

#221

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

I never agreed to that.

You did when you didn't move away and when you went to elementary school and used a hospital or roads or ate toxin free food or drank clean water or watched television or listened to the radio...

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

But mostly they aren't and mostly they try to do the right thing. I am 100% sure though that they weren't trying make the biggest profit when they do anything which will be the complete opposite of an AC world.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Agreement is good, but I never actually agreed to anything, so why is it ok to force me into compliance?

See above. You don't get to use the equipment at the gym then bitch about the price of membership.

05-28-2013 , 12:14 AM

#222

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

Why do you think I don't have an open mind? I have considered the idea that "taxation is theft" and found it lacking. Not every idea deserves respect, especially when the evidence for it is so weak. "Taxation is theft" is intellectually one step above conspiracy theories, and not a big step. Using it in your arguments puts you in the same camp as the pro-gun nuts who instantly threaten violence if any gun control laws are passed, no matter how innocuous.

05-28-2013 , 12:15 AM

#223

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

You did when you didn't move away and when you went to elementary school and used a hospital or roads or ate toxin free food or drank clean water or watched television or listened to the radio...

lol what nonsense. I never agreed to follow any government laws. And I completely disagree with them. Why should I be bound to them? I was forced into this society. I certainly didn't choose to be born.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

The government has to violate human rights to do ANYTHING it does, because theft is a violation of individual's rights.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

See above. You don't get to use the equipment at the gym then bitch about the price of membership.

So it's cool if I impose a service on you and then force you to pay me for it? I'll come wash your car and then I'll make you pay me fifty bucks for it. I'll have my gun too, if you refuse. All good? What's your address?

05-28-2013 , 12:17 AM

#224

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerowo

lol explain how it's not theft.

If I force you to give me money, violently, if need be, and then I use it to buy you some food or some ****, and make you take it, is that theft?

05-28-2013 , 12:18 AM

#225

MissileDog

a good little dog

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 5,581

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

I never agreed to that... Agreement is good, but I never actually agreed to anything, so why is it ok to force me into compliance?

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjshabado

Oh man, this is too much.

The exact same thing can be said of people born into a world where all of the property is owned and people already claim control over it.

I can see why rich kids would be all supportive of ACLand - but I'm guessing kids born into poverty are going to claim that they never agreed to absolute property right axioms of ACLand. At least the social contract comes with some benefits.

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