As I said, there is a problem between 3 hour late reg and 20% payouts. But it's not as major as you claim, IMO, and I doubt it reduces ROI of a winning player.

Literally nobody is arguing that all tournaments should have 3 hour late registration and 15 minute levels. I have no idea why you're implying that I think that should be the only option.

Oops meant 30 big blinds with 500 blinds at end of a rebuy with a 15k stack after 3 hour rebuy defeats the concept of well structured tourney .I mistakenly said 15 big blinds. I didn't get the impression that other options besides a 3 hour late registration would be considered sorry if I put you in that category.

watching a 5 dollar big 10 300 registered 120 left ninty1 paid people still late regin with 5 big blinds lolz. I mean really? People really consider this good tourney structure and payouts?

20% payouts definitely reduces the ROI of a winning player, that's beyond obv.

this is a good thing.. if you have a big stack and people just start shoving QT. you're acting as if pokerstars doesn't have rebuys that late either..

also the structure BCP spreads is great, i find myself getting to final tables with 50-70bb. room for actual poker.

Are you serious? That's not what he said at all.

Do you WPN apologists read anything you respond to? Pay attention Heisenberg.......

I said that Pokerstars tournaments with the 1500/15 are better structures with less variance because the blind levels aren't as steep, and they don't have insane late reg times.

Not saying that every tournament should be exactly like that, but my point is that despite wpn tournaments having 5k starting stacks and 15 minute blinds, they are not well structured at all.

^^ Say my name?

It's been a rough month for me. I admit I've been a bit all over the map in some comments I've made recently. I'm not an apologist, but I can see where I've been incorrect in a few areas with the basis of my arguments. Or where it could seem I was going off a bit half-cocked. I'll endeavor to do better. Very un-Heisenberg like, though.

Obviously. I meant that I'm not convinced 3 hour late reg reduces ROI of a winning player, but my wording was off.


There are some problems w/ WPNs blind jumps but I'm usually at the FT with 20-50 BB. So I think that's pretty good. Yesterday's 100K went heads up with both players being more than 100BB deep. Seems like a solid structure to me, even if it's not perfect.

Every FT I made this in like 30 I had more than 20BB for most of the time, with the exception of turbos.

Poker Stars doesn't offer reentries at all except for specific, special tournaments that they run every so often. They also don't have 3 hour long late reg except in a few select tournaments like the Sunday Million.

95% (or more) of their tournaments have 1 hour late reg and 99% don't have reentries. With that said, I don't expect WPN to go down to 1 hour for anything but Turbo's and rebuys (and don't think they should either), but 3 hours is absurd. 2 hour late reg is working very well on Bovada and Merge and they also offer tournaments with less (like rebuys and turbos). There is a reason Merge went from 3 45 minute late reg to 2 20 mins. Bovada doesn't even have reentries and the tournaments are still doing very well. The $162 $200K was $236K with $38K to first on Sunday. Meanwhile a $215 reentry on WPN couldn't even get to $100K. (though it did get close)

On another note, have you guys seen the $1,000,000 GTD $540 WPN is putting on? No idea what they're think lol. I'm guessing this will be the last tournament they ever offer after they bleed $500K+. Honestly I'm more sketched out about it than I am excited. Will be playing none the less.

lot of people at final table have 20 big blinds this is indeed not good structure, people buy in with 5 big blinds en mass on last rebuy level. Player has 15 big blinds this is aids. Playing six hours to bingo shove after last rebuy level? Yes that is awesome structure.

Only one plo mtt running they allow rebuys at 1k blinds which is 5 big blinds total donk shove fest of a tournament. Why not offer 1 hour rebuys instead of across the board 3 plus hours? Someone mentioned pokerstars has late rebuys but they offer other mtts then 3 hour plus late reg which is all that is on the menu here.

Well that just isn't my experience. Obviously you have to build a stack to play any deep post flop poker, but most players don't stay short stacked long. They either give up their chips or gain them.

As an example today in the 10K GTD, almost all of my play was 30-50 BB deep. Lots of post flop play. Obviously it started with me winning a couple pots, but that's poker. The only really glaringly obvious problem blind jump is 500/1000 to 750/1500 which should probably go 500/1000, 600/1200, 800/1600, 1000/2000.



Ya we all agree. I like 3 hour late reg with slow structure on some of the bigger tournaments. There should be other options, too, though.

Ya sounds crazy. 2000 players is ambitious.

Not really sure what to think of it, I bet who knows maybe it'll attact new players.

I posted this in the thread the TD made for the tournament, but I'm guessing they assume overlay is going to happen but plan to recoup the loss through increased traffic. Theoretically that's a solid idea, but they have to gain the traffic. Hopefully they makes some changes to the MTT offerings based on some of the good ideas in this thread. Many different people have offered up some really good ideas and they'd be really dumb to not try to incorporate some of them. They are getting cheap customer feed back, they just have to use it. This tournament alone, as awesome as it's going to be won't solve the problems. They have 5 months of free promotion just from word of mouth (which will be huge) and they damn well better do something to capitalize on it.

No one in their right mind can think this thing is getting anywhere near $1 milly, but if it gets more people on the site and they start raking it doesn't really need to. I just hope they have plans in place to pay the person who wins it if they're American. I guess for $200K you can just go out of the country but that is very hard for some people. It'd take a year and a half to withdraw if you couldn't leave.. They have up to $3240 from me guaranteed unless I run it up before I get there!!

When is the 1,000,000 540 scheduled for I haven't heard of it? I bet if they had a 3 day tournament with late registration into day 3 they could meet the guarantee though.

For sure, they're going to have to make some changes.


Yep, it better increase traffic a lot - they're taking a big gamble themselves on this one.

^^ Sunday, December 14th, at 3pm.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say it reaches the mark. It's rare for a series or event to have satellites/ability to register so far in advance (starts Wednesday). LOADS of work to go, obviously. Call me crazy, but I don't think it's impossible to see 2,000 players in this event with this much notice.

^Just for anyone else who sees that I edited out of my post a part where I said I think they'll make it close to 1 million when considering all the satellite rake.

I took it out cuz I'm not so sure, but I doubt they'll lose a lot to get it going. It's a ballsy move for sure.

Talked with Dan, said he'd add the blinds into the $1 million tournament (600/1200, 800/1600). Now if they'd do it for all of the tournaments, that would be something.

Any links to this 1mill tournament please?

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/21...014-a-1459427/

There's one in the announcement OP...another since only one site seems to be reporting on this currently (can't post it, obv).

http://www.americascardroom.eu/poker...ning-millions/

That's nice and all, but what about every single tournament between now and December? If this is going to have the desired effect they are after they need to fix small things like this along with the glaring holes in the schedule and tweak some other things.

I saw it in beginning of forum ty hopefully dan can come into this thread and address doing something about only offering 3 hour late reg tournaments.

Let's hope, this thread and the subject has been ignored for a long time.