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Old 02-20-2018, 05:30 PM   #126
CastleFrank13
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by Double Down View Post
No, I think Frank was saying once a player puts a Captcha on another player and the other player doesn't respond to it (presumingly proving that they're a bot), what's the next step in getting rid of them? Does the first player send a report to the security team? If so, then there would be a ton of messages from players, overwhelming the security department (which like totally exists).
ya that's what I meant. its such a dumb idea because it puts even more scrutiny on the security department. after all its not like you press a button and the player is insta banned. they still need time to go through the investigative process before LOCKing up an account. Imagine some rec thinks a player is a bot and presses the button with no response and a week later the same account is still playing. now the rec player is wft I pressed the button so security is not doing their job. kinda like the way things are now but worse.
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Old 02-20-2018, 06:58 PM   #127
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

I recall someone posting about misclicking the captcha and then having their account locked. They had to call customer support.

All this said, it's crucial to reiterate the term "bot" is one-dimensional.

Humans can click buttons at the direction of bots, programs, software, whatever term you want to use, which means bot-like behavior, identical stats, etc.

In more ways than one: humans using assistive software >>> unmanned bots.

Captchas are not good enough.
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Old 02-20-2018, 07:43 PM   #128
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

I have no evidence either way and have posted this before, but I was told by a very high ranking affiliate in the OLP world that WPN was 100% filling the games with their own bots at some point a few years ago.

Take that fwiw, but I have no reason not to believe that to be true and it wouldn't be even a little surprising.
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Old 02-20-2018, 09:10 PM   #129
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

What is OLP?
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Old 02-20-2018, 10:01 PM   #130
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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What is OLP?
Online poker
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Old 02-21-2018, 07:28 PM   #131
c0wbait
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Lol people here can never be pleased with anything the WPN reps post. They could literally post that they're giving away $100 to each of us for no reason and there would be complaints about the way they send the money.

When can we expect this captcha function to be enabled?
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Old 02-21-2018, 07:46 PM   #132
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

You are a fool if you think this has anything to do with WPN wanting to do the right thing. It is simply a diversion from the YouTube videos from Joey Ingram. Personally, I doubt this function will ever be up running.
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Old 02-21-2018, 08:42 PM   #133
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreshThyme View Post
I have no evidence either way and have posted this before, but I was told by a very high ranking affiliate in the OLP world that WPN was 100% filling the games with their own bots at some point a few years ago.

Take that fwiw, but I have no reason not to believe that to be true and it wouldn't be even a little surprising.
Been on the network since 2008? I started as a prop player which they did have back in the day which might be what was being confused as bots through being passed along. I never heard of botting back then. The prop system was one of the first things Phil got rid of when he became CEO.
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Old 02-21-2018, 08:57 PM   #134
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by c0wbait View Post
Lol people here can never be pleased with anything the WPN reps post. They could literally post that they're giving away $100 to each of us for no reason and there would be complaints about the way they send the money.

When can we expect this captcha function to be enabled?
We're not pleased because we can see several problems with this captcha idea from miles away, and with a history of WPN's customer service being grossly incompetent and clueless, we have no doubt that they do not see the problems, and it's not going to fix the problem at all. And then a rep creates a thread for the players to empower themselves, which really translates to the company is not going to do jack ****.

Several posters in this thread have suggested many good ideas, and we haven't heard a ****ing peep from the company of what they think of these ideas. They're clearly not interested in doing anything to work on this problem if it means that THEY have to something. But they're more than fine with players doing something about it. It's all talk, no action.
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Old 02-22-2018, 12:34 AM   #135
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by CastleFrank13 View Post
You are a fool if you think this has anything to do with WPN wanting to do the right thing. It is simply a diversion from the YouTube videos from Joey Ingram. Personally, I doubt this function will ever be up running.
Joey made mistakes himself, on at least some of his 'botting' accusations. Definitely wouldn't take his word as complete truth lol
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Old 02-22-2018, 12:53 AM   #136
hAmThEkIlLeR
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by lotuspod2 View Post
Joey made mistakes himself, on at least some of his 'botting' accusations. Definitely wouldn't take his word as complete truth lol

The difference is that Joey has done something about cheating on WPN, which has prompted Mason Malmuth to conduct a rigorous inquiry about what's been going on here, which is infinitely more than WPN itself has done, lol.
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Old 02-22-2018, 02:29 AM   #137
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by c0wbait View Post
Lol people here can never be pleased with anything the WPN reps post. They could literally post that they're giving away $100 to each of us for no reason and there would be complaints about the way they send the money.

When can we expect this captcha function to be enabled?
Probably because before they give us the money we have to rake $500. There's a reason behind the bitching and moaning, just cuz you can't see the reason........ WPN needs to step their game up pure and simple, this pokersite is straight up amateur hour.
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Old 02-22-2018, 05:22 AM   #138
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by hAmThEkIlLeR View Post
The difference is that Joey has done something about cheating on WPN, which has prompted Mason Malmuth to conduct a rigorous inquiry about what's been going on here, which is infinitely more than WPN itself has done, lol.
He's publicly posting random sharkscope graphs of a legit reg and trying to get the guy banned, probably only spent a few minutes searching leaderboards there for that one.

Meanwhile, thrash and a few others have been posting solid gold here for you all

Captchas have their own drawbacks, it will piss off mass-tablers and it certainly is nowhere near a foolproof solution in the first place anyway.
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Old 02-22-2018, 11:34 AM   #139
p2 dog, p2
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

did that mob boss get to Nagy before Chase Thunder? damn, guess I won't be seeing any refunds
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Old 02-22-2018, 03:53 PM   #140
CastleFrank13
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Since there hasn't been any real discussion from WPNs side time to LOCK this thread up?
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Old 02-22-2018, 05:01 PM   #141
WiCane
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

I just got a message on the client while playing to click a circle to prove I'm a real player. I have been "bot checked" one other time by the site but was a different message.

I'm no computer expert so not sure how effective this is to actually catch BOTs. Webcam for high risk accounts would pretty much end 90% of it.
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Old 02-22-2018, 05:44 PM   #142
PaulyJames200x
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

What format is the safest from these bots? So basically every format has bots but which format has the least amount of bots? I was going to play some sngs here but then someone mentioned sngs are loaded with bots.
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Old 02-22-2018, 07:46 PM   #143
Afterlyfe
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiCane View Post
I just got a message on the client while playing to click a circle to prove I'm a real player. I have been "bot checked" one other time by the site but was a different message.

I'm no computer expert so not sure how effective this is to actually catch BOTs. Webcam for high risk accounts would pretty much end 90% of it.
I don't know who you are so not sure what to think of this post. Can someone else verify that they had to click a circle for anti-bot measures? I don't recall anyone mentioning this in the past.
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Old 02-22-2018, 08:33 PM   #144
Knuckle Puck
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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I don't know who you are so not sure what to think of this post. Can someone else verify that they had to click a circle for anti-bot measures? I don't recall anyone mentioning this in the past.
I had it done to me during the summer.

My memory of it is foggy now. I remember circles and numbers(?).

That said, even though my memory is foggy, I came away surprised by how good it was and how programmatically difficult it'd be to solve. Not to mention, WPN could change it at any moment and unmanned bots would have no answer. Unmanned bots = losing proposition with captchas. But, obviously, humans can solve captchas easily.

So... cyborg bots >>>>> unmanned bots.
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Old 02-22-2018, 10:55 PM   #145
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Bots without people aren't really the big problem it's bots being controlled by people/ people using assistance software. The bot makers can very easily have someone watch a few tables and solve the captcha/chat/play a few hands w/e.
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Old 02-23-2018, 03:01 AM   #146
WiCane
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterlyfe View Post
I don't know who you are so not sure what to think of this post. Can someone else verify that they had to click a circle for anti-bot measures? I don't recall anyone mentioning this in the past.
Ha, why would I make that up. I play a lot so I'm guessing that is why I was chosen. FWIW, there may not be many people around more annoyed by this situation then me. I play vs an account every single day that I know isn't legit (it is pretty obvious) and there is nothing I can do about it.

Like I said, I don't even think this will be that effective but at least it is something. I'll want to play every session on webcam if it means the same for my scumbag Eastern European PLO friends. I'll do anything they want if it cleans up the games.

Last edited by WiCane; 02-23-2018 at 03:09 AM.
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Old 02-23-2018, 03:21 AM   #147
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by WiCane View Post
Like I said, I don't even think this will be that effective but at least it is something. I'll want to play every session on webcam if it means the same for my scumbag Eastern European PLO friends. I'll do anything they want if it cleans up the games.
+2
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Old 02-23-2018, 03:58 AM   #148
hAmThEkIlLeR
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulyJames200x View Post
What format is the safest from these bots? So basically every format has bots but which format has the least amount of bots? I was going to play some sngs here but then someone mentioned sngs are loaded with bots.
HU at the stud table probably.
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Old 02-23-2018, 12:11 PM   #149
CastleFrank13
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

Seriously, how can there be a thread created to discuss " empowering " the players with exactly ZERO participation from a rep? There have been other ideas brought up about how to improve security and not one reply from anyone at WPN. How does a site expect to maintain credibility when they choose to just bury their heads and hope things go away?
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Old 02-23-2018, 01:39 PM   #150
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Re: Empowering Players at Americas Cardroom

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Originally Posted by CastleFrank13 View Post
Seriously, how can there be a thread created to discuss " empowering " the players with exactly ZERO participation from a rep? There have been other ideas brought up about how to improve security and not one reply from anyone at WPN. How does a site expect to maintain credibility when they choose to just bury their heads and hope things go away?
Obviously the company’s culture is poor. I think their employees, particularly in the marketing department, fundamentally misunderstand the client base & give themselves too much credit. There seems to be a real issue concerning lack of aptitude & understanding of standard business practices. Not sure where they’re getting talent from or how much they’re paying. Given the scope of problems & recent publicity it would seem logical to bring in some fresh perspectives.

More importantly, the tone gets set from the top down. As shown in Phil Nagy’s vid from a year ago they have low standards for themselves. When there is no one to compete against it’s easy to be #1 & develop an inflated ego.
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