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Old 07-14-2015, 01:13 PM   #226
AlexTheOwl
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by Winning_TD View Post
If you did that would it not defeat the object of having shorter tournaments.
To some extent, yes. You'd want the buy-in closer to $20 than to $5, if you follow the principle that longer tourneys need bigger prizes.

But it would still be shorter than the current three hour late reg tournaments that use that structure. It's a flavor that WPN doesn't offer now, and one that I think many would find appealing.
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Old 07-14-2015, 01:59 PM   #227
bef99hwk
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by AlexTheOwl View Post
To some extent, yes. You'd want the buy-in closer to $20 than to $5, if you follow the principle that longer tourneys need bigger prizes.

But it would still be shorter than the current three hour late reg tournaments that use that structure. It's a flavor that WPN doesn't offer now, and one that I think many would find appealing.
agree. If everything turns into a super turbo fest, I'm glad the rec players love it, but they will just experience more variance and win a lot less. Not sure what it takes, but 3k SS+15 min levels shouldn't take all that long with these fields, should it? Stars allowed for plenty of play late with their structure and still reached money 3-4hrs with 2k+ fields. Any ding dong rec should be fine with playing a 5 hr mtt if it isn't a turbo. I was/am just annoyed with 3 hr late reg and taking 4 hrs to reach itm of a 100 person field. Hell, copy the $4/180 structure of PS...those were the most awesome things ever for recs
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Old 07-14-2015, 03:11 PM   #228
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

If you look at the structure of the on demands you will find they are very similar to that structure of the 180 man sngs.

If i were to do that the guarantee would have to start off alot smaller. Unfortunately right now we are averaging around 30 individuals in these tournaments with, for obvious reasons not so many re entries. A deeper structure would only be less re entries and i dont think anymore individuals. I do however need to get rid of this $1500 GTD sooner rather than later so again any suggestions are welcomed, if not i will choose something i think could work.
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Old 07-14-2015, 03:37 PM   #229
AlexTheOwl
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by Winning_TD View Post
If you look at the structure of the on demands you will find they are very similar to that structure of the 180 man sngs.

If i were to do that the guarantee would have to start off alot smaller. Unfortunately right now we are averaging around 30 individuals in these tournaments with, for obvious reasons not so many re entries. A deeper structure would only be less re entries and i dont think anymore individuals. I do however need to get rid of this $1500 GTD sooner rather than later so again any suggestions are welcomed, if not i will choose something i think could work.
$18 entry $500 GTD GI60M 3k SS 15 min levels in prime time, with a promise to raise the GTD if warranted?

I've read so many comments on here asking WPN to reduce the late reg on existing tournaments with that kind of structure. The answer is always that the late reg is needed to support the GTD amounts. You're tired of giving that answer, and players are tired of hearing it.

You're probably right. You'd know better than I would.

But if you put this one on the schedule, people asking for this kind of MTT will have no excuses for not playing it.

If it succeeds, great.

If not, next time you have to give that answer, link back to this conversation.
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Old 07-14-2015, 03:45 PM   #230
Winning_TD
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

Ok so if put that at 8.15pm and replace the $500 we have no because that is also not doing very well.

I have promised to up the guarantee if it crushes. Nothing crushes atm (sad face)

Still need to replace the 8.45pm.. or make that 8.45pm and make the 8,15 something different.
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Old 07-14-2015, 03:56 PM   #231
AlexTheOwl
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

8:15 or 8:45, sounds good to me. I'll leave it to others to suggest what belongs in the other time slot.

Maybe put whichever tourney is likely to be shorter in the later slot?
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Old 07-14-2015, 04:44 PM   #232
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

Why wont you add more lower buyins g160s under $10. The lower buyins are hitting the guarantees.
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Old 07-14-2015, 05:31 PM   #233
trade2win
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

TD can you leave the 1500 in for a couple more weeks. WSOP just ended people that grind in the US (your customers) are going to be back online. Give it a chance before pulling the plug.
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Old 07-17-2015, 08:19 PM   #234
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by idun215 View Post
Why wont you add more lower buyins g160s under $10. The lower buyins are hitting the guarantees.
totally agree''

il be honest, I played acr today but I primeraly do full flush now

I got sick of acr hand feeding grinders, regs, pros.. everything about the site is geared for them. no respect for recs.. I feel like a fool depositing even though I made one today. leaves a bad taste..

u know how in the 180 late the average rentry is over 2x. even a real good player will probably have do do that often.
well, the bottom 3rd of cashouts barely covers the first entry..A REC HAS NO CHANCE..

the gi60 has a much steeper payout. like 37 entries only 4 cash spots. just occurred to me once again there spoon feeding the pro, the grinder and regs..

even the way the bonus works is totally geared 4 them..

they just pretended they were doing something for us. there is definatly a mathematical equation there using to benefit and spoon feed only the top, top players. its like they configure things only for the best players or there own "pizans"

before u guys call me a donk and ****, there is something to what I said.

THEY DO HAVE AN OVERWHELMING BIAS TO THERE OWN STABLE OF PLAYERS. the structures one way or another show it.

even though I enjoyed playing here there was always something under my skin about how they structure things that I never got from other sites..

I get it know, they proactively! !spoon feed the nits, regs, pros to the point of nausium

if your a rec player. your a sucker if u play here

Last edited by thesparten1; 07-17-2015 at 08:26 PM.
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Old 07-17-2015, 08:39 PM   #235
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

I would have to say that your comments are incorrect.
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:04 PM   #236
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

the GI60M 1500GTD, 50 bucks tournament is very good, and the schedule is very good.
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:29 PM   #237
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

Ya I haven't had many chances to play, but info hope the 1500 gtd stays. I unserstand if it can't but it's a great structure and is at a good time spot IMO.
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Old 07-18-2015, 03:06 AM   #238
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

THE 180 LATE AVERAGES OVER 2X ENTRY AND A 1/3 OF THE CASH SPOTS DONT EVEN COVER YOUR INVESTMENT. UNLESS ITS A MEGA TOURNY, PLAYING THOSE DAILY IS A SUCKER GAME.

THE ON DEMANDS ARE ALL THE SAME PLAYERS WORKING IN TANDOM TO BONUS WHORE. NO PROOF BUT LETS JUST SAY THERE COMMUNICATING WELL AMONGST EACH OTHER.

THEY EVEN ADMITED TO WORKING TOGETHER TO BONUS WHORE THE SIT N CRUSH. THATS JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBURG.

ITS JUST A LITTLE TOO COZY A RLATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE REGS AND ACR, RECS ARE A TOLERATED OUTCAST.
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Old 07-18-2015, 11:19 AM   #239
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by trade2win View Post
TD can you leave the 1500 in for a couple more weeks. WSOP just ended people that grind in the US (your customers) are going to be back online. Give it a chance before pulling the plug.
I assume TD is being told to remove it because they are getting smashed on the gtd?

Maybe the could lower the gtd for a few weeks and leave it in?
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Old 07-18-2015, 01:57 PM   #240
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

if its not a 3 hour late were the bottom 3rd cashes doesn't even break even or j.p they do not care..

there stuck in a pre b.f. leftover mentality with a pre bush/Obama economy.

keep on feeding the same grinders who think there entitled to the same income as above.

they cant even put a reload bonus because all those same pathetic people will whore it out.

good luck increasing traffic..

how come full flush is full of recs and few grinders. the way its all contrieved is for the rec. acr exactly the opposite. I was watching the ceo of acr on youtube. he does have an everyman appeal but definatly a poker elitist who dismisses much about rec,s... good luck with that.

las vegas was built by recs with 25cents. not whales. when vegas got too expensive and forgot about the rec, that's when **** whent down hill.

Last edited by thesparten1; 07-18-2015 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:19 PM   #241
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

Maybe I'm missing something but I think prize structure is totally effed up. If the point of the 60 min tourneys was to make shorter tourneys for those who don't want to grind 4-5 hours before even making the money, then why do you have to play on a similar scale (though less total time) for these stupid tourneys?

37-45 people and only 5 get payed? Are you ****ting me? I cashed in one of them but it took so damn long, I think it took 3 hours and 10 or so minutes to finally burst the money bubble from start, which is about when I joined. It seems like there's a rough proportion of 1.5x-2.5x amount of time of late reg. time is how long you'll be playing during running time to get to the money. So, one hour late reg, another hour and a half to two and a half hours until you get the money. When a 60 minute late reg tourney is closing in on four hours to cash because so few players are payed, it doesn't seem like such a short tourney any more.

If it's going to take that long I might as well just spend another hour or two and play in a tourney with a bigger guarantee, I'm already in for over 3 hours to money, 4 hours bare minimum to completion, what's a couple more?

Someone explain to me, if the prize pool is not top heavy, will the games not guarantee or something? For the record, my tournament I am referring to did guarantee, but only barely (two entrants over the min to guarantee). The final table bubble was an hour alone. The money bubble, another and change. If they money came sooner people would play looser and the tourney would go faster.

Are people really not going to play tourneys (and help them guarantee) if the prize is diluted just a bit? Do 1st and 2nd place alone really need to account for over 2/3rds of the entire pot? In OD tourneys, for the same amount of people who registered the entire final table gets payed, sure everybody takes a hit but the profit is proportionate to the entry fee. Are people really that concerned with making nearly 20x their entry fee as opposed to just 10x for first place? Do they need to nearly triple their entry fee for just the minimum cash place? If you want more money, pony up and pay a higher buy-in.

I can't be the only one who takes all this **** into consideration. If I am or I'm a donkey or I'm missing something obvious then somebody point it out to me and call me out on it, because I don't get it. Excuse the rant but these tourneys seem pointless as such because they still take a long-ass time to even make money let alone finish and with SNGs being dead, ODs being here and there and no 50/50s on the horizon, it's getting harder to make money without sinking a lot of time.

Last edited by ccisbeast; 07-18-2015 at 02:31 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:39 PM   #242
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

I was saying the same thing a post ago.

f..k the 180 barley covers the entry in the bottom 3rd of spots. the gi60,s are very very top handed.. wtf..

the gi60 is soo top heavy. there has to be more to it.. some inside baseball stuff were not figuring out. they just cater to the grinders or something.

why is it so difficult to make a normal tourney w 1 hour late. why are people playing the 180late. if your not an online pro. no chance!

in the 180late, even if u limp to mid cash you didn't make anything and if you rentered just once (in a 180 late!), u probably lost money.


I know my posts are horrible to read. I suck at expressing myslelf in the written word.. nits will make fun of me because there nits.

what im saying makes sense. someone please translate more effectively and efficiantly

Last edited by thesparten1; 07-18-2015 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:55 PM   #243
trade2win
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

Yea a 50 man tourney shouldn't be paying more then 6 spots, ever. I know its shocking to you donkeys. Wish they'd move along and implement the new payout structures across the board. Big money on top is what attracts players not min cashing for less then your buyin.
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Old 07-18-2015, 03:01 PM   #244
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

the 500gtd for 3$ has 255 entries and its still in the late. its headed to have an average of 2.1x entries per original players..

if just half of those people played the gi60. they would be better off. probably make greater profit per investment, even with a lowerer gtd. most of tth 180 late players will cash and lose money. lol

now the gi60 is very very top heavy. I swear there playing tricks on us manipulating the mathematics. keeping profit to the pro and grinder and maximizing there end or whatever. don't know exactly.

something just aint right.

Last edited by thesparten1; 07-18-2015 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:24 PM   #245
ccisbeast
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by trade2win View Post
Big money on top is what attracts players
Is this really the case? Do people not realize how unlikely they are to make it into such an exclusive club, payout be damned? People really need 20x their buy-in for first place, 10x isn't good enough even if it guarantees you more security?

And obviously nobody wants to play a tourney where it takes too long to get to the money and they don't even make back their entry fee. Bottom pay should be no less than double your money, 1.5x your fee at the very bare minimum and that would have to be when the tourney is really filling up.

Again, enlighten me, "I'm a donkey."
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:37 PM   #246
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

I just spent some time looking at all the micro/low finished games..

the 500gtd for 3$ is a waste of time and a sucker bet, as stated above.

the 2k for 2$ and 5 hour late has 415 original players and 830 entries. most cashout spots you either lost money and half way up its 4.20$

why are these games crushing????

the gi60 is extremely top heavy, whats wrong with a normal 1 hour late.. with a payout structure just a little more generouse but not worthless like those 180 late gtd. you can cash everyday and lose money..

and the gi60 so heavily favored to the top and the long late tourney are imposible to make money, even if u do cash every day..... something is funny boys and girls..

u either get it or u don't...

its like those carnivals with a couple of gambling tents. aint nobody leaving with money its tweeked and mathamaticaly geared that way. except for a chosen few.

its like there geared so you cant grind mtt,s and make a profit unless your bonus whoring the on demands. good luck with that one. there is also a select few who have those locked down.

the way the long late and payout is structured or the gi60 and the very top heavy is structured. you will not be able to grind them and make profit even if your competent. its geared that way..

Last edited by thesparten1; 07-18-2015 at 04:47 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:56 PM   #247
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

I got it and I wont rant...

its set up so you cant grind mtt,s and make a profit. the occasional score yes(good luck chasing it).

the 180+ late. you could cash everday and lose money..

the gi60.. so top fk heavy..

yup that's it. grind all day chasing your first hit. its set up to make it very difficult to make profit even if your above average.

in both cases they go out of there way to make it unatanable for the score or to grind profit.......

acr set it up that way with intent..case closed!!!. no other logical reasoning..
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Old 07-18-2015, 08:42 PM   #248
TwitchySeal
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by thesparten1 View Post
its set up to make it very difficult to make profit even if your above average.

Most above average players are not winning players.
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Old 07-18-2015, 09:33 PM   #249
thesparten1
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

your picking on one thing...

the way they make the structures of both tournies doesn't smell kosher
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Old 07-18-2015, 09:41 PM   #250
trade2win
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Re: 60 min LR MTT;s

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Originally Posted by ccisbeast View Post
Is this really the case? Do people not realize how unlikely they are to make it into such an exclusive club, payout be damned? People really need 20x their buy-in for first place, 10x isn't good enough even if it guarantees you more security?

And obviously nobody wants to play a tourney where it takes too long to get to the money and they don't even make back their entry fee. Bottom pay should be no less than double your money, 1.5x your fee at the very bare minimum and that would have to be when the tourney is really filling up.

Again, enlighten me, "I'm a donkey."
Yes it's really the case. Not only that but if you are a winning player you are more then willing to take on a little more variance in exchange for a higher ROI when you make deep runs.
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