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Triple Draw pre-draw mayhem

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01-06-2015 , 03:04 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

I decided I'm going to write down interesting pre-draw spots and write about an interesting spot every week in this thread. I'm leaving stakes and player reads out - if that affects your decision just give a general description as to how it would.

Hand 1

6-max cash game

Hero opens BTN with 8743
SB 3-bets
BB calls
Hero ???

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01-06-2015 , 03:23 AM

Vempele

adept

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 841

Cap and draw 1. Your equity is at least 5% better than with 843.

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01-07-2015 , 02:52 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Ok I think I usually do that too (but the times I do break I draw to 743). I would break 87w2 nearly always.

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01-07-2015 , 06:06 AM

phunkphish

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,902

Hmm. In new example. Does SB ever 3b and draw 2? If both draw 2 I think it's an easy d1 for us.

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01-07-2015 , 11:10 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunkphish

Hmm. In new example. Does SB ever 3b and draw 2? If both draw 2 I think it's an easy d1 for us.

I think you are right, and that's something I need to watch for. I would still break x8762 though.

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01-07-2015 , 08:50 PM

Forrest Gump

journeyman

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 229

I rarely think an unknown BB has a decent 1CD there. Also, not only its a chance SB 3b some naked 2CD (At least he can 3b 87w2 that will turn into 7w2), but some weaker 1CD like a worst 87 draw or gutshot. So you have to cap to at least punish BB and draw 1. Your 87 draw is not that bad. Think about 8763, that's really a difficult hand in that spot.

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01-08-2015 , 12:50 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Yeah that would've been a better question. 8763. Based on all the reasons given to cap
8743 I think I would also cap 8763 and not be super happy about it.

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01-08-2015 , 03:43 AM

Journeyman_1

old hand

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,464

I dont remember ever breaking 8743, and I'm never raise/folding otb

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01-19-2015 , 10:39 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Hand 2

6-max cash game

UTG raises
You have KQ222

If you choose to play it, how would you do so, and how would your plan change depending on how the action breaks out behind you?

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01-19-2015 , 11:09 AM

#10

ImOnTheRise

stranger

Join Date: Oct 2014 Posts: 2

yea just cap and draw 1. we have position and bb is usually drawing 2

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01-21-2015 , 03:08 AM

#11

LuckyGyro

enthusiast

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 86

Imontherise... Whats the reason to draw one instead of just patting from the start? Is it that more people put you on a snow when you pat right away?

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01-21-2015 , 11:54 AM

#12

Forrest Gump

journeyman

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 229

dont you see he's responding to hand1?

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01-21-2015 , 05:40 PM

#13

phunkphish

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,902

Quote:

Originally Posted by Small Balls

Hand 2

6-max cash game

UTG raises
You have KQ222

If you choose to play it, how would you do so, and how would your plan change depending on how the action breaks out behind you?

A tight UTG range should always have a 2 or be a made 8. Start from there

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01-21-2015 , 06:05 PM

#14

ILikeRocks

adept

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 949

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunkphish

A tight UTG range should always have a 2 or be a made 8. Start from there

3458 is a not-unreasonable utg 1-draw, but that being said KQ222 is still a fold and it's not close imo.

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02-05-2015 , 04:24 AM

#15

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

On a self-ban at the moment but trying to think of some spots.
Hand 3

UTG opens
HJ calls
CO calls
BTN calls
SB folds
You're BB with xx653.

Too much of a long shot or too good a price?

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02-05-2015 , 05:03 AM

#16

hapunkt

banned

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 6,199

Quote:

Originally Posted by Small Balls

On a self-ban at the moment but trying to think of some spots.
Hand 3

UTG opens
HJ calls
CO calls
BTN calls
SB folds
You're BB with xx653.

Too much of a long shot or too good a price?

I would fold. I don't feel too good about a (rather weak) two-card-draw when I am OOP against 4 opponents, no matter how good or bad these guys are.

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02-09-2015 , 06:12 PM

#17

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Back at it.

Hand 4

6-max cash game

UTG folds
You are in HJ with 76333

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02-09-2015 , 07:10 PM

#18

DeathDonkey

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 12,875

Easy raise

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02-11-2015 , 10:40 PM

#19

RolldUpTrips

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 1,334

Raise, but know you might need your winter jacket!

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02-13-2015 , 10:56 PM

#20

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Also raise 76633 or is it the trip 3s that do it?

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02-26-2015 , 08:11 PM

#21

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Hand 5

6-max cash game

CO opens
BTN folds
You are in the SB with J7643

I usually fold unless I know that CO is loose or bad.

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02-26-2015 , 11:32 PM

#22

Tapirboy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,993

I would tend to raise more if CO is weak-tight in the midrounds. Looser pre doesn't really help you, and bad definitely doesn't help you.

The player you really want here is the one who folds second 2:1 if he's rough or doesn't improve.

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02-28-2015 , 12:42 PM

#23

Rush17

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 5,973

1) Cap/draw 1

2) Fold or Raise. Depends if he's weak/tight enough to fold mid-hand and/or if he sees you to only repop in these spots with really strong hands. I always lean towards folding in these spots, meh.

3) Call

4) Raise

5) Easy call and perhaps even a raise(see post above for why^)

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02-28-2015 , 02:21 PM

#24

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tapirboy

Would you raise as a default against an unknown or do you need a read?

Looseness helps because I have a hand that is easily outdrawn. If they are opening xxx73 I'm in much better shape against their entire range. And bad doesn't always mean spewy - I'm looking for people who are very straightforward, bad at 1-1 river spots, stuff like that. I agree that most kinds of bad won't help me here though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rush17

5) Easy call and perhaps even a raise(see post above for why^)

Do you mean call and draw 2 or call and draw 1? I don't really like either of those options. I think it's gotta be raise or fold.

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02-28-2015 , 11:13 PM

#25

Tapirboy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,993

Quote:

Originally Posted by Small Balls

Would you raise as a default against an unknown or do you need a read?

I'm always hyperaggro against unknowns so I'm really not the right person to ask that question.

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