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Originally Posted by zadignose
I'm not an expert by any means, I have only a tiny bit of experience to draw on, so I'll just share my intuition regarding Crazy Pineapple High-Only, and see if the more experienced players agree.
It seems to me that "Coordinated Hand = Good, Uncoordinated Hand = Bad", as far as starting hands are concerned.
KKQ with the Queen suited seems like a nice hand, as you would likely play KQs or KK in any hold'em situation... in this case, if you miss the trips, you've got a fair shot of picking up a nice draw.
But what about KK4 unsuited. Looks bad!
Looks
good to me. I occasionally play CP-8 semi-seriously at the Bike and just for fun in our weekly friendly dealer's choice game. (Nobody I know likes the high-only version much, and I've never seen it offered in a casino). But low in CP-8 is not what it is in Omaha-8! (There's no counterfeit protection). And that pair of kings is
very strong, much stronger than KKYZ in Omaha-8. The danger of losing with an unimproved set (to a flush or straight) is greatly reduced going from Omaha-8 to CP-8. And even the unimproved pair of kings has a good chance. Of course, depending, you probably fold the kings to a bet after a flop with an ace but no king.
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There are three different ways you could discard after the flop... but really, when are you ever going to throw away anything but the 4.
I'd guess you only keep the four when there are two or three fours on the flop or maybe when you somehow get a four card open-ended straight sequence using the four as a middle card, 2345, 3456, or a four-card straight flush sequence. So maybe ~700/18424 you're breaking the kings and keeping a four. It probably amounts to roughly one time in twenty five.
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So you're playing a hold'em hand against a field of Crazy Pineapple hands.
Yeah, but it's a pair of kings!! It's strong in the high/low game, and if that's so, it has to be even better in the high only game.
Yeah, a bit.
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After the flop, like Omaha, I reckon you want to be holding the nuts or drawing to the nuts quite often.
Of course you
want the nuts, but in truth you don't always
need the nuts.
Even in Omaha-8, the high is not usually won by the nuts. (Depends a bit on what the nuts are. Some nuts are more likely than others.) Keep track the next time you play a session of Omaha-8. I think you'll find that the high is won more often without the nuts than with the nuts. When I have played and kept track, I have won high more often with two pairs than straights or flushes or higher. And two pairs is
never the nuts.
If that's true in Omaha-8 (and it is) then it's even truer in CP-8, and I presume crazy-pineapple-high, and even more so in pineapple-high.
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Maybe holding middle set or top two pair. Just from a very little experience, I found it shocking how, at least in a loose game, that extra card everyone gets turns the game into clash of the titan hands... quads beat quads, straight flushes come around more often than seems possible. Drawing to the idiot end of a straight is disaster. I'm not saying there's a monster every hand, but I think most inexperienced players are way off base in thinking it will play like minor variation on hold'em.
I do agree with you about having the extra coordinated card. You do like three coordinated cards in the high-only game (and even in the high/low version). I do, of course, much prefer the four in KK4 to be suited to a king. I do, of course, much prefer AKKu, KKQu, KKJu, KKTu, or KK9u to KK4u.
I probably play the game of CP-8 looser than you do, and I haven't ever played CP-high in a casino (or even seen it offered). I'm still tighter than most players in any CP-8 game in which I'd play. But you can't play too tightly for three reasons. (1) To win money from someone who is playing too loosely, you have to be in the hand with the loose player. If you play too tightly in a casino, (2) aside from being very boring, (3) you don't get much action when you do decide to play a hand.
Just my opinion.
Buzz