Observed hand from the same pro:

HJ opens, Respected pro flats from CO and draws 2.

Standard?

No.


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Did it go heads up ? We're binds supposed to tag along ? Is hj a spot ? Prone to folding, or other huge errors. Does he not shown down enough... too much..... It's not as simple as saying hi jack opens I have a10 should i 3 bet or flat.

What did h.j. do ?

I assume we are talking about badugi and not some weird variant I’ve never heard of?

AT?

If it is badugi and the HJ opens any two card hand is a fold for me outside of BB

If button is tight I'm never folding A2/A3 here.

Don’t like the flat, pulls people in and more than likely the pot will be 3-4 handed. It’s a good HU hand against wide ranges as it has a lot of outs to at least a good tri. But multiway someone usually makes a badugi and you are handicapped drawing two

I saw this respected player on numerous occasions flat CO, BTN, SB and draw 2. He also opened HJ and drew 2, so I don't think it was particularly opponent based.

It makes me think 2 card hands are better than people realize. If opponents are very straight forward, I can see that being the case. I think it's better in Badugi than in Badacey/Badeucy.

I think they are overrated in Badugi and I wrote a lot about it in this article:

https://www.twoplustwo.com/magazine/...ugi-part-3.php

Of course I'm not stating I'm definitely correct because I wrote an article, it just saves me a ton of time in typing out my opinion.

I actually think they are better hands in Badacey/Badeucey due to drawing more cards and dual nature of the game. But I'll be doing more work on those games in future.

Anyhow, if it is a mistake and everyone is making the same mistake then by the principle of swapping mistakes it is neutral. If respected dude encourages people to start drawing lots of cards all over the place (to copy him) when they would had not otherwise then it's a net positive I guess because he will get away more often postdraw in marginal situations that two card draws will often place you

Ace 10 =a10 . The gist is hold em is much more simple to say this is right or wrong.

Ok I gotcha, Holdem is obviously different as you have complete information hiding but no hiding in Badugi when you draw two.

What math did you use to decide that you should open 39% on the button? That is excessively tight to me.

I mentioned in another thread that it is a slightly tight range and I typically open abit wider say down to 45 which puts me around 44% or something

But actually 39% is not excessively tight. In limit Hold’em I think Stox standards suggest 40% and in limit Hold’em you can obviously more easily hide your weakness.

Stox standards turned out to be ludicrously tight though. The real number for ideal button opens in LHE ended up being more like 65%.

Not to say that you can necessarily do that in draw games, because LHE tends to have a pretty consistent dropoff in hand value while draw games have cliffs.

Lol no.


Re: Scotch opening Badugi ranges:

I think you are highly overvaluing bad tris. You have button opening any 9tri. I'd rather open 2 cards under 5 than 987.

Any 9 tri is loose no doubt even though I end up snowing most of them after taking one shot at a badugi. And if you don’t snow you can often get yourself a free turn card and realize equity. Then maybe bluff the river, mix it up. I tend to like them more than others.

Cutting back on them and adding more two cards is definitely reasonable. Just depends on your philosophy and how your opponents play.