I feel tremendous pressure to come up with the perfect thing to say to make you want to watch it as many times as it takes to soak it into your bones.

I do always think they should have done more to punctuate the fact that Sonny pretty much singlehandedly got his father shot - and in doing so basically launched the entire trilogy - by speaking out of turn in the Sollozzo meeting. Just work it into another line or two from Tom Hagen during one of those Sonny/Tom blow-ups after the fact. It took until I read the book to really get what a disastrous misstep that was on Sonny's part.

Eight Men Out! Ah ok. Yeah I didn't pick up on that stuff. I was doing my damnedest to pay close attention, which is often a struggle for me. I watch everything (not live stuff) with subtitles so I can focus on and process the dialog.

Yeah, I do the subtitles thing too on any programming worth paying attention to (currently using them with The Sopranos).

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But yes, basically:

We see the private meeting where Vito gathers opinions. Sonny says "there's a lot of money in that white powder." Tom advocates for it as well.

Then, during that Sollozzo meeting, Vito says no. Sollozzo counters by making an offer to sweeten the deal. Sonny says, "Wait, you're telling me the Tattaglias would GUARANTEE our investment?!" Vito cuts him off and tries to play it down. "I spoil my children. They talk when they should listen." There's a pan around the room at this point where Clemenza and Tom shift uncomfortably in their seats at what just happened. They know that was a massive and possibly consequential faux pas. This is the thing the movie fell short at bringing across, though it does show it subtly.

Meeting ends. Vito demands that Sonny stay behind, and scolds him. Vito gets shot shortly thereafter. And Sollozzo's guys kidnap Tom. Says "Sonny was hot for my deal, wasn't he? And you knew it was the right thing to do." He puzzled out that if you just knock off the patriarch, the oldest son will take over the family, and he would be able to eventually cut a deal since that son idiotically showed his hand instead of keeping his mouth shut. Obviously it doesn't go to plan for Sollozzo from there, but it's definitely the impetus for Vito getting shot.

Honestly, it’s hard to fault Sollozzo in his play. It’s the same kind of risky maneuver that Vito himself used to establish his own dominance as a younger up-and-comer. Sollozzo covered all of his bases quite well. He simply couldn’t have predicted Michael’s involvement.

As pointed out, Sonny’s blunder was all the proof that Sollozzo (and the other top dogs) needed to feel confident in making a move on Vito.

Edit: slowpony, but yeah.

No, it was a very reasonable move. It's made clear that Vito was outright monopolizing the necessary resources, and it was also clear that he was not going to budge in his resolve not to make the deal, so Sollozzo's only other choice would have been to give up a huge business venture.

Appreciate the insights

Godfather did not feature one ho train

Like I said, I'm not at all a keen observer myself of these things, and if there wasn't a book there's every chance I still wouldn't have put that together.

Funny trivia fact, since you saw some of Godfather Part II: that Frankie Pentangeli character was just supposed to be Clemenza, but the actor made a ridiculous demand that to return for the second movie, his girlfriend would have to be able to write all of his lines. Studio obviously responded with, "LOL, or we could just say you died between movies and give your entire meaty plot to some dude we make up."

Frankie was a great character, but I do still wish that Clemenza had been in that role as originally planned. Can't even remotely blame the studio for rebuffing that silly demand though.

I've got that actor who played Captain McCluskey as a real weak point in Godfather casting. "Why you little punk" is the worst delivery of a line in the trilogy until every ****ing time Sofia Coppola talks in Part III.

I say this believing deniro should have gotten credited as leading actor but cazale not winning an Oscar for best supporting actor in 2 is some bullshit. The fact that he wasn’t even nominated is insane. Him screaming I’m smart with genuine heartbreak in his voice was the best delivered line in the series

I liked Boardwalk Empire more than the Sopranos.

Yeah, Lee Strasberg getting nominated for Part II and John Cazale getting snubbed is pretty insane. That was a great line delivery, and Cazale was tremendous in each of his scenes. I'd have to think more about best line delivery in the series, but that's a worthy choice.

Definitely on my to-watch list.

Incidentally, though I very much like Steve Buscemi, I didn't love seeing him crop up on The Sopranos. It felt like stunt casting to me. I can lose myself in every other actor's character, but I kept just seeing him as Steve Buscemi.

The only one I think I’d put up against it was Brando’s ‘I never wanted this for you’ just how defeated he was that the one thing in his life that was supposed to be pure was corrupted

But behind Brando I think I put cazale as the best performance in the trilogy

If I had to rank:
1. Brando
2. Cazale
3. Deniro
4. Dude who played Frank
5. Duvall
6. Pacino
7. Caan (he was fine but seriously overrated)

BE turned into the most depressing show ever in such a hurry

Lolll, true!

Yeah, pretty tough to separate that Brando line from the unspoken reaction to, "It was Michael who killed Sollozzo." Which was delivered with full knowledge that it was going to break his heart.

De Niro was great, but I still don't have him up that high in the rankings. Respect for ****ing moving to Sicily for a year to immerse himself and ready himself for the role, but I do have Pacino's Godfather work higher (and I'm more of a De Niro guy in general). I thought Pacino was absolutely incredible, especially in Part II. The climactic scene with Kay was just an acting clinic.

Well, they were pacing along perfectly and then decided they had to finish up in a hurry because they wanted to go do another show that lasted a single damn season. I thought it was the perfect show up until that happened.

IRM posting in wrasslin? whatyearisit.gif

It was interesting to see what they did once the budget dropped dramatically, though. It was forced became a much more personal, existential exploration of the story. No more massive dolly shots of the boardwalk-- just the tight, claustrophobic framing of the characters battling with their demons. All in all, I was surprised at how much I liked the later seasons.

Has anyone watched Dr. Death on Peacock? I just watched the first episode and am intrigued to see where it goes.

I got to see The Father yesterday since it was available as an in-flight movie. Felt like I was setting myself up for awkwardness by ordering up a tearjerker to watch in public, but it wasn’t too bad in that regard.

Was a good movie, though it took some digestion afterward to better appreciate it. Hopkins obviously killed it.

I intend to watch it when I can. So far has only been available for purchase!

Yeah, I wasn't going to pay the ransom it's currently going for, so I figured I had to pull the trigger when it was an option on the plane.

They also had A Quiet Place Part II available. Will probably hit that up if it's an option on the way back.