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WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread

04-22-2017 , 06:38 PM
I know next to nothing about TNA, but when I heard about this I couldn't resist...

Spoiler:
Samoa Joe kidnapped by ninjas

It's February 2010. Joe has been in TNA for going on five years at this point, and Vince Russo, who was head writer at the time, wanted to freshen Joe's character, so after a match with Orlando Jordan on Impact, they ran a kidnapping angle where a bunch of masked men jumped Joe and threw him into a van:



This generated some buzz as to how Joe would be brought back -- rumour had it that he would get a complete gimmick makeover. But Joe came back two months later as a mystery partner in an eight-man tag match, and the kidnapping was never mentioned, let alone explained or paid off.

What happened? I'll let Señor Joe explain:

Quote:
"You want me to break the silence on that? I don't like getting in verbal spats with people who I don't think are worth my time or my effort and a dude in particular is Vince Russo. This cat, I don't have a problem with Vince Russo. When he left I just told him, it is what it is. He always had 22 million reasons for making the decisions that he made. But when Hogan and Bischoff came in they said, 'Oh we have this great idea. We are going to do this thing and take you off of TV and re-brand you. Do all this other stuff. We do this kidnapping thing and you come back as a psychopath.' I was cool with it.

I sat at home for 3 months on a b---hing ass vacation. I had one of the best vacations in the history of vacations. Paid vacation. Getting ready so I call them back week after week, 'What do you guys need me to do'. They would say 'We are still coming up with something'. Vince Russo with his infinite ridiculousness just said, we are short on babyfaces. So I get a call saying, 'Joe we need to bring you back to TV.'

So I asked him, how is it that you are going to bring me back. He said, I don't know how just yet but we need to bring you in. So the dude couldn't write his way out of a kidnapping. The only reason why I bring this up is because he has the audacity to blame all of his silliness on other people."
I love how so many of the worst moments in three different promotions can all be traced back to Vince Russo.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 06:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChachiArcola
My second pick is going to be a controversial one. Not because it may or may not qualify, but because there are some here who think I read this whole situation wrong and it really isn't that bad of a moment.
confirmed

Not that I particularly like it or anything, but I wouldn't label it as a bait-and-switch. And to the extent that someone would argue that it was, it only punished people who allowed themselves to care about Hogan vs. Piper in 1996, so functionally it was a victimless crime.

But we've done this conversation before, of course.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKJ

And to the extent that someone would argue that it was, it only punished people who allowed themselves to care about Hogan vs. Piper in 1996, so functionally it was a victimless crime.
This is an easy statement to make today in 2017, but is rather silly to think it applied when it happened 20+ years ago. You had people coming back to watch wrestling by the millions, enjoying a relatively new nWo storyline, which was the hottest thing in pro wrestling in about 10 years. They were also in the midst of their "can do no wrong" phase, so fans would be willing to give them a chance with something like this.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 07:23 PM
I mean, I was watching when it happened, my apathy toward that feud isn't any sort of hindsight thing. The notion of Roddy Piper trying to prove that he was the biggest icon in wrestling was utterly absurd to me after almost a decade of watching him be a part-time character who was never anywhere near the top of the card. Really the thing to pick about Piper vs. Hogan would have been WCW keeping a straight face while trying to put forth the claim that Piper's assertions about being the actual icon of wrestling were anything but a huge joke.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 07:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darO
I really has it all

Bad Idea
Massive amounts of time wasted
Hated by the fans from the get go
Legit Injuries to multiple competitors
Exposing the business as fake amd maing the roster look like a bunch of scrubs
Ensuring an expensive new signee is DOA
Absolutely nothing of value that came from it


Getting caught up on thread and this post had me rolling
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 08:32 PM
btw, regarding samoa joe ninja kidnapping--the week before, he fought for the TNA heavyweight championship on a PPV. He wasn't injured either so they literally took out a star for the company for three months for absolutely no reason and he also was a face at the time. needless to say it's a great value pick at this point in the draft.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-22-2017 , 09:28 PM
Quote:
I sat at home for 3 months on a b---hing ass vacation. I had one of the best vacations in the history of vacations. Paid vacation.
Man, those ninjas must be pretty loaded to give Joe something like that.........
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 04:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKJ
I mean, I was watching when it happened, my apathy toward that feud isn't any sort of hindsight thing. The notion of Roddy Piper trying to prove that he was the biggest icon in wrestling was utterly absurd to me after almost a decade of watching him be a part-time character who was never anywhere near the top of the card. Really the thing to pick about Piper vs. Hogan would have been WCW keeping a straight face while trying to put forth the claim that Piper's assertions about being the actual icon of wrestling were anything but a huge joke.
I was watching and this is exactly how I felt. Not telling people it was non title was bad but no one really cared at the time because no one wanted to see Hogan/Piper in the first place. I had been out of wrestling and thought I must have missed a lot for Piper to be considered a big deal.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 08:25 AM
Looks like Halpert is skipped and eyebooger is up.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 09:01 AM
I'll have my pick in a little bit.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 09:50 AM
This is from a promotion that doesn't get too much play here, but I'll take it here because it was really bad.

I'll pick:
Spoiler:
Sexy Star wins the Lucha Underground championship


Spoiler:


Spoiler:
I like Sexy Star. I really do. The backstory is good, and she had had a few decent matches over the first two seasons, as well as an incredible "No Mas" match with Mariposa. But strapping her with the title was a terrible decision that seemed to be made just to give a woman the belt.

To be fair, they had the sense to do it at Aztec Warfare (LU's answer to the Royal Rumble), but having her pin Mil Muertes clean 1v1 at the end was ****ing absurd. I'm trying to think of an appropriate WWE parallel. Maybe Bayley pinning Bray Wyatt clean?

What's worse is even if they absolutely HAD to shoehorn a women in that spot, Sexy Star wasn't even the best choice. Ivelisse, Mariposa and Taya are all better wrestlers and that's not even counting the Black Lotus Triad.

Just an absolutely stupid decision. At least they had the sense to get the belt on Johnny Mundo one week later.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 10:26 AM
With my tenth pick, I select...

Spoiler:


Spoiler:


Spoiler:
The Worst Ending in WrestleMania History


Spoiler:
Draft:
Fingerpoke of Doom
Giant falls off roof, then immediately wrestles without explanation
Gobbledygooker
Undertaker murders Big Boss Man
Big Boss Man/Big Show feud
The Renegade Bait-and-Switch
Vince Degrades Trish
WWF Spoils Bischoff Shocker
Blackface Roddy Piper
Worst Ending in WrestleMania History
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 11:24 AM
This ones short, but got me riled up.

Spoiler:
CM Punk pours out Paul Bearer's ashes onto Taker

Paul had died THREE WEEKS earlier. Three weeks. So what does the wwe do? Obviously use his death as a storyline where Punk pours out his ashes while Paul Heyman dresses up as him.



How did Bearer's son find the segment?

Quote:
If anyone is wondering, yes WWE did come to us wanting approval for tonight's storyline. The way it was presented to us was ok. Seeing it on screen was a different story. I don't even know what to say.



Spoiler:
Mae Young Hand
Dawn Marie/Al Wilson
Claire Lynch
Lost in Cleveland
Goldberg refuses to follow the script
Kurt Angle gets divorced, wife leaves him for Jarrett, it plays out on tv
SF 49ers match
YAPAPI
Aces and Eights
CM Punk pours out Paul Bearer's ashes
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 12:11 PM
Damn, I let WM9 go one round too many
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 12:22 PM
i still maintain that Savage would've been the perfect pick if Vince was deadset on running with this angle. Plus a Savage/Bret title match at Summerslam would've been fantastic.

This is getting me riled up just thinking about it.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 12:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKJ
With my tenth pick, I select...

Spoiler:


Spoiler:


Spoiler:
The Worst Ending in WrestleMania History


Spoiler:
Draft:
Fingerpoke of Doom
Giant falls off roof, then immediately wrestles without explanation
Gobbledygooker
Undertaker murders Big Boss Man
Big Boss Man/Big Show feud
The Renegade Bait-and-Switch
Vince Degrades Trish
WWF Spoils Bischoff Shocker
Blackface Roddy Piper
Worst Ending in WrestleMania History
And there it is finally...
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 01:52 PM
Still waiting for my big one to go, really surprised it hasn't yet.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 07:37 PM
Mat is skipped; Dylan is up for two.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 08:08 PM
Whoops. Sorry. I'll take

Spoiler:
No Holds Barred: The Movie: The Wrestling Match


Spoiler:
So Hulk Hogan made a lot of terrible movies while trying to become a movie star. That's not so bad. And as bad movies starring wrestlers go, No Holds Barred isn't particularly notable.

Except that Tiny Lister, who played the protagonist, Zeus, in the movie, decided for reasons that he, not Hogan was actually the star of the movie, and made a few appearances on WWF TV, to challenge Hogan. This eventually led to a tag team match on PPV featuring Hogan and Brutus Beefcake against Zeus and Randy Savage.

I still have trouble wrapping my mind around which levels of reality this match is supposed to inhabit. An actor is angry about his billing in a movie, so the fictional character he plays challenges another actor from the movie (who is, of course, just a character played by Terry Bollea) to a wrestling match. To add to the confusion, Jesse Ventura, Mean Gene, and Howard Finkel play themselves in the movie.

The match itself isn't really that bad, as Tiny Lister is a pretty good athlete. I couldn't find a great video of it, but here's one.

WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 08:21 PM
I'm assuming it's off the table now, but there was a December PPV called No Holds Barred: The Match/The Movie featuring a steel cage match between those four that actually was pretty terrible. And you had to sit through the movie, which is punishment enough.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 08:37 PM
I recently watched that movie for the first time. It was bad, but it was comically bad so I enjoyed it a little. Not enough to ever watch it again, but I didn't hate it
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 08:48 PM
It worked for me as a kid. I find it totally absurd today, but it worked for me back then.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-23-2017 , 11:05 PM
Sorry for lack of writeup, still at Poker Night in America (lol Hashtag King.) I'll take the Joker Sting gimmick and Bootista winning the Royal Rumble.
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-24-2017 , 10:27 AM
I'm surprised this is still available.

Spoiler:
Glacier, Mortis, and Wrath


Spoiler:
In April of of 1996, WCW started airing promos for the debut of a new wrestler who would eventually be named Glacier. He was obviously a bad ripoff of the Mortal Kombat character Subzero. We would have to wait until September for his debut. In the interim, a little something called the nWo got its start.

Anyway, his entrance was one of the most elaborate and expensive of all time, with estimates of it costing close to half a million dollars. His debut was met with, shall we say, a bit of indifference and mockery by the fans. The cartoon era of wrestling was over, and the attitude era was just getting started, and Glacier was obsolete on arrival.



Of course, that didn't stop Bischoff, who introduced two more Mortal Kombat inspired wrestlers, the appropriately named Mortis, and later Wrath. Glacier had no problem dealing with his long time enemies with a complex shared backstory that I'm sure they would have told us about if they ever cared enough to think of one. He actually went undefeated for over a year, but didn't get a title opportunity in that time, because of the challenges in integrating such a silly character with the rest of the WCW roster.

Eventually, even Bischoff got bored with the gimmick, and Glacier became a jobber. He got hurt for a few months, came back and kept jobbing. Finally, in typical WCW fashion, Glacier revealed he wasn't actually a highly trained ninja, he was just a guy playing a character, and he sold the character to Ernest "The Cat" Miller and Kaz Hayashi. Miller actually came out as Glacier a few times, before even that was dropped.


Spoiler:
Katie Vick
Death of Mr. McMahon
Winter Roofies Angelina Love
Undertaker Murders Paul Bearer
Fake Diesel and Razor
Three Minute Warning Destroy HLA
Jenna Morasca vs. Sharmell
The Reviving Elbow
The White Castle of Fear
No Holds Barred: The Match
Glacier, Mortis, and Wrath
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote
04-24-2017 , 04:58 PM
With my eleventh pick, I select...

Spoiler:
The 2016 Shane McMahon vs. Undertaker Feud


Spoiler:
I was expecting this one to be gone a while ago, and I was perched and ready to call it recency bias, but then you bastards never gave me the chance. Anyway, this has to be pretty solid value in the 11th round.

Shane McMahon returns to Raw, causing a big markout moment. He runs down the state of the current product, and then attempts to blackmail his father on the basis of a secret that seems to leave Vince shook to the core. Rather than simply leverage his way into a position of power with this blackmail, he has to compete in a match. Vince puts him in the ring with The Undertaker. Why does Undertaker just willingly take on this task for Vince? Nobody knows.

Anyway, Shane loses the match, so he has to go away. Except, instead of going away, Vince just gives him control of one of his shows anyway, basically giving him exactly what he was wrestling for at Mania for no particular reason. Also, whatever the blackmail material was has been forgotten.

This was storytelling at its very worst. Just absolute nonsense cobbled together to justify Shane jumping off the top of Hell in a Cell.


Spoiler:
Draft:
Fingerpoke of Doom
Giant falls off roof, then immediately wrestles without explanation
Gobbledygooker
Undertaker murders Big Boss Man
Big Boss Man/Big Show feud
The Renegade Bait-and-Switch
Vince Degrades Trish
WWF Spoils Bischoff Shocker
Blackface Roddy Piper
Worst Ending in WrestleMania History
Shane vs. Taker Feud
WOAT Angles/Moments Draft Thread Quote

      
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