It must have said the non NWA WCW stuff, so for the sake of this argument lets say that doesn't count, if you don't mind.

I mean I see the WCW name and not NWA. This is less to nitpick than it is to say that I don't exactly know when the NWA thing was dropped completely, so I don't know what the starting year would be for your parameters.

Some Googling says the NWA name had been phased out entirely by early '91. Meltzer gives the '91 and '92 War Games matches five stars. I would need to rewatch those I suppose, though I'm more inclined toward wanting to pick a singles match.

LOL, then I don't know what I read/what I'm talking about.

Maybe something like no 5 star matches since the matches you quotes. Like 93 on. Not a big deal really, sorry about that.

This might be slightly off topic, but is there anyone that Meltzer is obviously partial too?

I just checked and out of 73 matches the lowest rating he has given any Flair match is ***, and they're few and far between with a couple coming in his later days (~2000). I know Flair was incredible, but surely he's wrestled a "bad" match at least once in his career.... no?

Matches that are under 3 stars are not posted on that site.

tragi, try this site. Lots of ****3/4 matches. I'd easily give 5* to Mysterio/Eddie @ Halloween Havoc '97.

Nowadays I think he's partial to Tanahashi and Okada. Back in the 90's partial to Kobashi.

I can't find a list of all of Meltzer's ratings, just those matches that were *** and above. That could be what you're running into.

Also, I totally thought this was a joke post. Decided to youtube this just now expecting maximum lulz. So, go in with lowest possible expectations only to be blown away.

Nice addition.


edit: Ahh. Was using the wrestling observer star ratings list. Looking at it now I see why there are non <***.

Welp.

It was a joke post.

I was worried about that and that I would in turn look like an ass. I thought the match was really good compared to what we get now. Fwiw, the "blown away" thing was probably because I was expecting the worst of the worst. In the end it was an above average Divas match to me...

Maybe I watched the wrong match?

Here is a list of all Meltzer rankings from WWE PPVs. He gives many of the later Flair matches under 3 stars.

Nice thread btw, I'll probably work my way through the list at some point. Flair/Savage at WM8 is worthy of inclusion IMO.

The reference is to one of these Funkadactyl girls when she was on Tough Enough. She got asked by Steve Austin what the greatest match in the history of wrestling and said "Melina vs. Alicia Fox."

This was Austin's reaction:

that was my toughest omission I think. the match is good but i just didn't think it was worth it. i give it ****1/4 fwiw.

I mean if there was a true cutoff of 4.5+ stars on that list I'm sure there's a number I wouldn't rank THAT highly...but I mean who cares, almost everything on that list is at least worth watching.

Except for Rock-Cena, which I don't see as even having particularly significant historical value, especially when they violated "once in a lifetime" by having a rematch.

i put more than 1 that i thought was < ****1/2. idk i just don't find it to be epic or exciting but it is good.

it should've been as historic as Rock/Hogan. granted it wasn't. but still two of the top 4 or 5 top guys ever.

Well Rock/Hogan was Golden Era vs. Attitude Era. Rock/Cena was Attitude Era vs. some down era in wrestling. The crowd didn't care even remotely to the same level as Rock/Hogan and it made all the difference in the world since it was almost purely the crowd carrying that Rock/Hogan match. It also wasn't Rock's first match back, nor was it his last match or his only match with Cena.

Like obviously I know what significance it should have held, but they needed to pull the trigger on Rock vs. Cena the same year that Rocky came back for it to have really maximized the greatness it could have been.

yeah i agree with that last part. by the time the match happened, the allure was all but gone. that's a damn shame to because i remember us chatting in some thread about how it was going to be epic and a 5* match. lol

take it off the list! i'll make a revised list at some point but don't want to make it such a long page.

It all makes sense now.

Ok. Details on this are a bit fuzzy, but here goes.

Anyone remember a WCW vs NWO vs Hogan match from I guess around 2000 or whenever Hogan left? He was Hollywood at the time iirc. I think it MIGHT have been a cage match... maybe battle roayal? Maybe it was at War Games?

Blah. Hopefully someone knows wtf I'm talking about!

HHH vs Ric Flair - Taboo Tuesday 2005

I'll preface this by saying I'm a huge mark for three things here. HHH in gimmick matches, Flair, and personal rivalries.

I thought this match was great. HHH mocking Flair was great. A shame that a lot of the language was edited for the network because that made it a lot more intense. Flair said multiple times "I'll break your mother****ing leg" while he had HHH in the figure four and lots of other ****s were given throughout the course of the match.

Flair playing the old man babyface was great because him getting beat down so much made it hard not to root for him. In his babyface performance he still proved he was the dirtiest player in the game. The telegraphed nutshot was spectacular.

The chair placement really sucked. Surely they could've put it under the apron and he could have Flair trying to dig out of the cage and then find the chair right there.

Throwing **** to this match.

They have a rematch at Survivor Series later that month in a LMS match. It's rated ***3/4 by Meltzer (cage is rated ***1/4) and I've heard good things about that one so going to watch it for the first time.

Adding to list: Matt Hardy vs Edge - cage match @ Unforgiven 2005. Lots of people have this as MOTY. This was the blow off match to the Hardy/Edge/Lita saga I believe. Awesome match.

Didn't really like the LMS match. It's fine but the ending sucked bad.

Adding to list: Cena vs HBK vs Edge vs Randy Orton @ Backlash 2007. I'm shocked I forgot this match. Saw it for the first time in January. I'm comfortable saying this is the best 4 way match ever even nudging out the Fatal Fourway match. Definition of must watch match.

Edge vs Angle - Judgment Day 2002 in a hair vs hair match is an easy ****1/2. Same for Backlash 2002. They also have an awesome cage match on SD! on 5/30/02. WWE made confirming dates on this hard. JD happened 5/19 but network lists it as 5/18 and Backlash happened 4/21 but it's listed on network as 4/20. Is it really hard to see that both of those are Saturday's? I'll just assume a ton off ppvs are like that for some stupid reason.

Just watched the Dave Meltzer 5 star rated WarGames match from 1991 Featuring The Four Horseman vs. Sting, Pillman, and the Steiner brothers.

Holy crap what a botched powerbomb Vicious did on Pillman. He dropped him right on his neck and then gets him up to do another powerbomb. You can tell by Sid's reaction that he was like oh **** after the first one but did the second one. Then Giant Gonzalez comes to the ring to check on Pillman and says the match is over. I can't imagine this was the originally planned finish, as the other wrestlers at this point are just standing around wondering why The Giant was in the ring, or it at least appeared to be the case.

Wondering if LKJ or any of the other resident scholars has any more info on this match.

I'm not really in the rating business, but I find it surprising this was a 5 star match, not that it wasn't fantastic, but because of the apparent (obvious?) botched finish.

I do think I need to figure out what my favorite match is of all-time and then go from there when I'm rating a match. I think it's Hart/Austin, but it would be fun to put some work into it. The match were speaking about here, fantastic, but not sure it would make my top-50. However, in terms of multi man matches, I'd imagine it'd be near the top. I see another WrestleWar match is on here, and hope to take that in tonight.

That botch though, Geebus!

It was definitely a botched finish. Pillman was legitimately hurt and I think unconscious.

yep. he reinjured his shoulder and was knocked out.

This is kind of random, but it popped into my head as I was scanning the thread (great thread, by the way):

Kurt Angle vs. Shane McMahon

I forget which PPV it was ... it was a street fight and it was amazing.