Not sure what section to post this in so i'll write it in here and if there's a better place for it then I'd appreciate it if a mod could move it.

This happened about a week ago in a $300 mtt during the Borgata WPT poker open series. There were ~40 people left and 52k up top. This guy had been moved two to my left about 2 orbits ago and we had been talking a little and he was a pretty cool dude. We joked about me knowing he was experienced and a limit pro by the way he handled his chips. He confirmed he played a lot of poker and was by no means a novice.

There was a limp from mp, I ripped ~17bb over it. Person in question tanked for a little and mucked. Every one else folded and since I was pretty confident the tanker had an ace or small pp as a level I pushed my cards towards the middle and showed an ace. As I was raking in the pot the guy in question says he folded an ace and wants to see the other card. I laugh and while my hands are busy stacking my newly acquired chips this person takes a deep breathe and blows not once but three times at my turned down card until the last attempt finally revealed the other card. Normally I do not try to make enemies at the table but I took a huge exception to this as I thought this other person was better than that and quickly demanded the floor over. The floor came over and I explained what happened and requested this person be given a one round penalty. Obv in this super fast structure a one round penalty would be deadly. The floor was about to concede and come down with the penalty when the guy demanded the floor ask Tab. A few seconds later the floor guy came back and ruled that the person would just receive a warning and nothing else. I decided to let it go but then the guy had the nerve to say that "it didn't really change anything" and I still somehow managed to laugh it off.

Cliffs: guy wants to see my other mucked card. Intentionally blows it over. Floor was about to rule a penalty. He asked tab who said it was just a warning.

My question is is that the correct ruling. Should this guy have gotten some sort of punishment. Does the ruling change since we're super deep in an mtt with a super fast structure. Thanks in advance for anyone's input.

who or what is a tab? why does the floorman need it? should have been 1 round

Just assumed everyone knew who tab was for some reason. He is the TD at the borgata and has last say on all things rulings.

OMG who cares.

You opened the door and piqued his curiosity, now you're upset that he pushed the door fully open? And you want to punish him for it? Just play poker, dude. Don't worry about this kind of thing. Why did you show the Ace in the first place?

Here's what you can do to avoid this: When you win a pot and the dealer has pushed you the chips, toss your cards face-down towards the muck. You say this was a turbo tournament, yet you're wasting everybody's time with all of this?

Since he tried two times unsuccessfully to blow your card over, and you saw that yet took no effort to stop him, either by telling him to stop or putting a hand on your card, it's your fault for not protecting your card at that point. Trying to get a guy a round penalty for that is lame, IMO. A warning was fine, given the description you gave of how the events unfolded.

House rules. I assume the TD knows the house rules at the Borgata. Many rooms have a rule 1, which states that the decision maker can make a decision a certain way, even if it is against the rules if he thinks it is fair.

That said, there's probably more to this story. Dealers are trained to muck cards and reshuffle after pushing a pot. In a turbo, they would normally not leave cards laying on the table long enough for someone to take 3 deep breathes and blow. A player that eager to see a card wouldn't waste his time blowing, he'd just reach over and turn the card. It amounts to the same thing.

Without the backstory, I can't tell if the decision was good or not. TDs in general are loath to make rulings that effectively knock someone out of a tourny, so it is no surprise that he ruled it should be a warning. The reality is that you put yourself in this situation. As others said, if you don't want to be in this situation, don't try to be a TV player and quadruple think your opponents.

PFap's response is perfect. This is meaningless and irrelevant information anyway, since you likely will never see these players again. Who cares what he did? Why let it bother you and why waste people's time with it?

It's also a bit silly to assume everyone knows who Tournament Director X is at a certain casino. 99% of people are recreational players who don't give a **** about poker room personnel, and you've got people on this forum from all over the world posting who may know nothing about the Borgata period.

Wow this is the last time i post in Mortar and Brick. Holy Sh*t and I thought NVG was bad.

I stopped reading your post after the bolded sentence.

This whole post has to be a troll, either that or you were the guy that did it.

The post was not a troll. I was at a table when it happened (in seat 1). Granted, I did find the whole incident quite funny.

Also, to those who are saying not to worry about it cauz it was a Turbo. Well, in this tourn it was like 50K uptop.

Wait I'm confused... Are you saying you we're at this specific table when it happened? Are you saying you we're in the one seat?

Wow, I can't believe the responses on here. I mean, sure, it's not the worst thing that can happen at a table, but since when is it a players responsibility to protect a mucked hand?

Ya, OP could have done more to prevent it, but that's just silly. It's basically the equivalent of you tossing your hand towards the muck, then me reaching over and looking at it.


Like it's only HALF of that, but logically, it's the same thing. That guy should have been penalized, but if it was super apparent he was a recreational or new player, I understand the decision to give him a warning. If I was a TD, and new the player plays poker a decent amount, he's getting a penalty. If it's apparent he's a noob, fine I'd give him a warning, but given no information on if he's a noob or not, I'd give him a penalty and try to explain to him why he's getting it.


There's probably more to the story, but given the story as the OP puts it, yes, he should be pissed off.

warning seems fair, i actually had someone pick up my hole cards off the felt, and look at them while 3 handed. i didnt care because i was already called by 2 all in w/nut str8 but the other player in the hand who had several hun was pissed, he called floor and no penalty was given, (had to show him my hand) so i think the floor super has flexibilty in regards to MINOR breech of stipulations

Yep, I was in 1 and the two of you were in like 6 and 8 seats (as far as I remember) respectively :-)

I actually found that hand mildly amusing and remembered it in detail cauz I chose to fold A8ss from UTG that very hand (with only like 12-13 BB or so)

But he had already shown the important card. Why did he do that? What does it matter what the other card is?

My point is that you need to keep a cool head at poker. No, the other guy shouldn't have done it, but it also wouldn't have happened if the OP hadn't exposed part of his hand. But what's done is done, and getting upset over it only hurts your game.

This is impossible. I was in the 1 seat and the guy who blew my card over was the 3 seat. Unless you're looking at the table wrong. Unless you were in the 10 seat. Tell me your bust out hand so i can confirm if you are who i think you are.

How can someone with 20k posts write literally the most insanely wrong and incompetent post I have ever read in my life? This has to be a troll. So if what is your saying is true if some one takes out their wallet and shows you they have a lot of money, you think it's ok to rob them. The rule is I can expose what ever cards I choose and I chose to show an ace for a reason in order to tilt seat 3 and you know what it worked so damn well that he had to knowingly cheat to see my other card and my play of showing an ace should have gotten him a one round penalty. If this happened level 4 would I make a big deal about it, probably not but we are 40 people away from 52k and he clearly exposed info that could hurt my image.

Thank you Boney. Someone who understand tournament poker and how important exposing another players cards are. It's that simple. Maybe I posted in the wrong thread but I'm not looking for coaching people. All I want to know is should it be a penalty or not.

OP why start the thread?

It seems pretty clear from your responses ITT that you have already decided to be pissed.

The difference is that if you reach in and grab the card ..... I have no doubt in my mind what your intention was.

When you say .... Hey I want to see that and start blowing at it ..... I'm thinking its 90% your just kidding around and you don;t really expect that the card is going to get exposed.

And that is the difference between a warning and a penalty. Now if you have a history of doing this and have been warned .... now you don;t get the benefit of the doubt anymore,.

Simply not true. I didn't make this thread for people to tell me how to play poker. For people to come in here and say that it's my fault because i mucked my cards is just preposterous. All I was looking for was help and advice as far as the ruling is concerned and if people thought villain should receive a penalty or not.

Does everyone in here think this was my first mtt ever and that im some incompetent idiot that doesn't know the difference between playing around and someone blowing at my card. I just don't get it. The kid clearly blew at my card multiple times in order to expose it so he could see if he made a good fold or not. You just shouldn't be allowed to expose another person's cards intentionally and if you asked the dealer or the other players at the table then they will tell you it was an intentional act. I'm about to end this thread because I can't take this ignorance.

Op, it seems in the heat of the moment that you came up with your 1 orbit penalty. Now you start a thread and want agreements from everybody or your going to shutdown the thread or whatever.

Do you really feel it is fair to punish this guy monetarily for an incident that does not change the outcome of a hand? Do we want td's handing out 1 orbit penalties all over the place in tournaments and creating more disharmony among players?

Ok yeah, i see your point too, but is it kick in the nutz penalty worthy?

Also you should chill on everybody posting here, this is the refugee camp from b & m.

Sorry if u came off as a di*k but what I fail to understand is how people say it doesn't change the outcome or it doesn't affect anything. It just changes everything. My mind is blown at how few people realize how much damage he could do to me by exposing the down card. Anyway I'm done with the thread because no one seems to want to help me with my actual question.