Hi all. I'll be traveling to Argentina in about a week, and Buenos Aires has two big casinos I'll be checking out, Casino Puerto Madero and the Trilenium, playing their 5/10 Peso NL tables (about 1/2NL USD at current exchange rate). My question is which would be better with my bankroll regarding rake, as neither sound particularly pleasing. Madero is 5% uncapped, and Trilenium is 70ARS (equals $13.34) timed rake every two hours. More info on the casinos can be found where I got these numbers from, which was here: http://wizardofodds.com/blog/argentina-casinos/

My gut tells me to steer clear of that 5% uncapped at all cost, but I've never played a timed rake before, and unless Buenos Aires is just donk and/or nit city, I see myself playing pretty darn tight, which timed rakes hurt the most.

Other considerations: I'm a solid player but definitely no pro, so if you guys don't think I can turn a profit with those rakes I may skip the casinos altogether. Also, depending on the exchange rate fluctuations and whether I can get the black market rate instead of the official one, it may really be like a $0.64/$1.29NL game with a $9 timed rake every 2 hours.

Lastly, anyone who has been to BA before and could offer any tips (poker/casino related or not) would be greatly appreciated. Thanks all.

The timed rake seems like a pretty good deal. It probably works out to less than most US casinos. Yes absolutely avoid uncapped like the plague.

sounds like you could play the timed game and never pay rake.

rake at 10 a.m. sit at 10:15. rake at noon, get up at 11:50. move to another table at 12:15 after taking a break, rinse, repeat.

except when you sit at 12:15 you have to pay the noon table charge. Also you have to wait an hour at most casinos between cashing out and sitting down at the same stake again.

when i've sat at time games i didn't pay until the next time rake was dropped.

i'm not recommending this by the way. i was joking.

Haha I'm sure if it were that easy everyone would do it. Not sure how it's enforced though. Maybe you pay a pro-rated fee upon sitting down if it's between rake collections? I don't know. As I said, I've never done timed rake before and definitely have no idea how things are done in Argentina. The system certainly did seem odd though. Also, Trilenium is in a richer part of town so maybe there's more rich fish? I don't know if I'd be benefiting from them at the 5/10 ARS tables though.

And I was just thinking, why does 2+2 not have an international gambling section? I feel like that could be a useful resource for players like me who are traveling to other countries and would like to know where the action is, and could hear from other people's experiences. It could also make for some pretty entertaining anecdotes.

The US casino I play in is 10% with a $5 cap.

5% uncapped is probably not much different for the majority of pots played in the game ie (pots under $100). It's actually better if you are taking down a lot of flops. Obv if you are dragging $600 pots the rake is killing you.

The timed deal is super cheap compared to the $5/half hour I am familiar with. But the devil is in the details I'm guessing.

Since the fish are oblivious to the rake, I'm just guessing finding the juiciest game is still going to be the most EV regardless of which game it is. All things equal though the timed rake is better value.

If you are really considering not playing based on EV then you should also consider the transaction cost of exchanging each way since that is also "rake" on your bankroll.

Agreed, though depending on those black market rates it the exchange cost may be +EV in and of itself. Is that $5/half hour at 1/2NL? If so, does it typically change as you go up the stakes? It seems to me like timed rakes also really hurt those at lower stakes otherwise.

Also, one final consideration: The Puerto Madero may offer electronic Hold'em tables (like the kind on a cruise ship). You play a lot more hands per hour, which although that's irrelevant for rake since Madero is by %, I kind of feel safer about that since it's a foreign country and I don't want my chips stolen by some hothead after a bad beat or something. Not saying I expect that, but I have no idea what security is like in Argentina casinos. Anyone got any input on electronic vs physical live tables?

In my Casino 1/2 and 2/5 are raked 10% / 5 cap + 1 BBJ drop. 5/10 and up are time @ 5/ half hr.

In AC where I sometimes play 1/2 is 10% / 4 cap + 1 BBJ drop. And 2/5 and up are timed 5/half hr. AFAIK the time charge doesn't increase for higher stakes (nor does the rake cap).

Timed rake does sound better. It does depend on your style and the game.

If your running over nits...the time rake is much much better...

If your the nit...then the 5% rake may be better...(but uncaped it might not be even here).

I live near the Puerto Madero Casino and have played there a few times. If they have electronic tables, they're very new. I didn't see any last time I was there, about 3 or 4 months ago.

Lots of fish, for sure. First time I went, I was absolutely amazed at how much money people could throw away in an hour. I left $2000(ARS) up my first visit, playing like an absolute nit, about 5 or 6 hours at 5/10 tables.

The games I like, the casino I don't. It's not like an American casino. It's nice, and it's comfortable, but you get none of the perks. No free drinks or food, you pay for everything. You can't sit out at all. If you leave the table and want to keep your seat, they take blinds off your stack. So you have to time and rush bathroom or smoke breaks if you don't want to lose a few pesos for nothing.

The games are definitely beatable, even with the uncapped rake, but the atmosphere just isn't the same as a US casino.

Trilenium is also fairly close to me, but I've never been there. It's much larger, and from what I hear, much nicer. I don't know how they deal with food/drink and sitting out for a few minutes.

Wow, great information! Is the language barrier difficult? My Spanish is pretty darn shaky so I'm curious how many patrons know English at the casinos in the event of a dispute.

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I couldn't say for sure the level of english, but there are definitely some people there that speak English to some degree. There are quite a lot of people in the city in general who understand at least some english and can communicate on a basic conversational level.

For the poker itself, if you know how to say the numbers in spanish, you should be fine.

I'm originally from the US and went in to play one night with a t-shirt that says "New Jersey" on it. One of the pit bosses came up behind me and asked me, in English, if I was from New Jersey and how I liked Buenos Aires.

If you're good...it's probably too your advantage if you act like oyu don't really understand the spanish at all. The more you look like a dumb tourist, the more they will think they can take advantage of you.

Hey do you know if the casinos take dollars, and more importantly, if you can cash out in dollars? I ask because it's impossible for Americans to exchange excess pesos to dollars, because the rest of the world pretty much views Argentine pesos as monopoly money. I'd rather get paid in a real currency I can actually use once I leave.

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They do have games you can play in dollars, but I'm fairly sure the poker is all in Argentine pesos.

Again, this is at Puerto Madero. It's possible Trilenium has tables in dollars, but I kind of doubt it.

Your best bet is probably going to be to convert any pesos back to dollars at the airport before you leave. I've never tried to convert cash in the casino, but I don't think they will do it, and if they do, I'm sure they will give you a crap exchange rate. They do have ATM machines in the casino where you can take out pesos from your American bank account at the official exchange rate, so you don't need to convert a ton of cash to play before you go.

Yeah the "official" exchange rate is artificially maintained and the real market rate is twice that. Luckily, I can exchange my dollars for pesos on the black market before entering the casino, but if I can't cash out in dollars, there's no point. You can't change pesos back to dollars at the airport or anywhere else, because like I said, the currency is worthless globally. Getting pesos is a strictly one way conversion. Some banks will allow you change your excess pesos to dollars *if* and only if you show them the receipt from your initial exchange with them (at their terrible rate), and even then they'll only give you up to what you originally exchanged. Of course, this totally eliminates anything to be gained from gambling, because the whole point is to leave with more than you came with.

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Ah, I didn't realize they wouldn't convert the money back to dollars at the airports now. It does pretty much screw you as far as getting home with any winnings.

So you can deposit, but never withdraw? Hmm what does that sounds like?

Zynga lol. That's pretty much what gambling in Argentina would be like for me.

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