6-handed live 20/40.

Villain is a very experienced regular who is loose at chasing and could be aggressive but definitely not maniac.

On 3rd: 2 brings in. 4 folds, Villain completes with 7 up. Hero 2-bets with J up. 5, J, and 2 fold behind. Only Villain calls.

Villain's board: (XX) 7Q25X
Hero's board: (KK) J3998

On 4th: Villain bets and Hero raises and Villain calls.
On 5th: Hero bets and Villain calls.
On 6th: Hero bets, Villain raises and Hero calls.

On 7th: Villain bets...

Furs coats. You can’t get here and fold.

Personally, I’d smooth fourth and raise 5th

Comrade ninefingershuffle, though often incorrect, has a nice idea with flatting Fourth and raising Fifth. We get an extra bet in when we're ahead, and if we fall out of position (as happened) we will get some folds leading the turn if villain is light but still has equity.

The raise on Six is bad news because the hand villain can raise incorrectly here is Queens up, and that should be rare. I can imagine (Qs7)7s possibly playing the hand this way, but that hand likely raises Fifth. Other potential bad raises like (86)7 with a spade should also be rare hands.

Still, once in a while you'll be shown Queens-up, so you should call the river. You'll lose most of the time but probably not enough to fold.

Agree hero has no choice but to call as played and dislike raise on 4th as well

hand should be flush with queen of spades or queens n 7s. triple queens likely wait until 5th or 6th to raise.

if you are delaying(which is fine) you should be looking be willing to pop 5th with some draws. and jacks too.

if you are calling 6th, calling 7th is automatic. id call down with buried kings up.

how often should we be making that type of play with calling 4th and raising 5th?

imo its not like lhe where we have xyz and flop is abc we delay... board texture is more important than our speicifc holding. so with big hands id like to jam 5th mostly and if 4th breaks too good for my board (like where 5th might check through or check/c) ill just pop 4th.

also important who your playing with. not too many crushers in stud, esp ones who will play back after a big street raise.

This hand is perfect to do it with because your actual hand is hidden, he is almost guaranteed to lead again, he is most likely to be first to bet and if he is not you’ve vastly improved your hand.

Lots of hands (principally one-pair hands with minimal backdoor equity) can be profitable if one raise goes in but not profitable if multiple raises go in, so you play them in a way that you can raise once on the way to showing down. If you raise Fourth, you get less money in the pot, but it can transpire that you fall behind later and then you'll wish you hadn't put in any extra at all. If you have an opportunity to raise Fourth, you would normally have the same opportunity to raise later, and you make a little more if you do, as well as avoiding wasting a raise when your hand gets run down.

As to your question about how often you do it, that depends on how aggressive your opponents are, and how light they will fire at you, because they create the opportunity to do it. When you have a good hand to do it with and the situation presents itself you should consider it. Often you make more by just betting your hand or raising when you can, but if you have a winning but vulnerable hand you should consider all the ways you can make it most profitable.

Thanks for the explanations, guys.

Yeah the reason I ask about frequency is because this is pretty much my tendency on 3rd if I open say KK|8, i get 3b by a Q, and i'll almost always call, call 4th, then c/r or raise 5th. But i don't play nearly enough stud to know how often opponents will catch on that i pretty much am beating their perceived range on 5th and am raising for value. So like, if i do this every time isn't my hand fairly face up? Or should i not really even worry about balance in a spot like this?

It doesn't matter if they think you're doing it for value in stud. If you've made a small two pair you'd raise and the Queens will still call you down, maaaaybe folding the river but whatever, might also raise Queens up because your hole cards are private. You have ambiguity about your precise hand so there is automatic balance with the range of hands you raise here.

More important to balance/vary your Fourth street raises in my opinion. Most raises on Fourth should be to buy free cards, knock out other players or steal the initiative. In some of those cases you will have the best hand, so it would be "for value" as well, but most raises on early streets, in practice, will be functional, and you should train yourself to do it in spots where you won't regret it if the boards break bad, and you can use the initiative to rep your own board.

For example, if you have something like (66)87 and (xx)95 bets into you, you should be inclined not to raise. Your backdoor straight is pretty dead so you won't pick up enough equity on the next street to pay for a raise, but also it's pretty easy for you to fall high with any card higher than a Nine, and then you'd be out of position on the next street and might find yourself betting with initiative and the worst of it.

With the same (66)87 getting bet into by (xx)K3 you should raise pretty often. You don't care if your board falls high, because if it does you can lead Fifth a lot, either because you have made two pair or caught an Ace, and if you retain position your hand is real live and you benefit from a free card, or can rep a straightening board. Much better raise in this spot.

great insight as always. makes a ton of sense.

thanks!

i'm very new to this game so it may be a dumb question
but what do you mean that you don't care if it falls high? a ton of high cards don't give you 2 pair/aren't an ace.
what am i missing?

If you fall high against his K it mean you either paired your board or made an ace overkicker