Winning Poker, 7 Stud H/L Limit - $1/$2 ($0.25 ante) - 5 players
Hand delivered by Upswing Poker

Seat 6 (Hero): $36.58 (37 bb)
Seat 8: $36.50 (37 bb)
Seat 1: $69.50 (70 bb)
Seat 2: $26.85 (27 bb)
Seat 4: $63.62 (64 bb)

Third Street: ($1.25) Hero is in Seat 6
Xx Xx 2♠ BI bring-in $0.50____BI folds
2♦ 7♣ 7♦ Hero raises to $1____Hero calls $1
Xx Xx Q♦ MP raises to $2
Xx Xx T♠ CO folds
Xx Xx 8♠ BTN folds

Fourth Street: ($5.75) (2 players)
2♦ 7♣ 7♦ Q♠ Hero checks____Hero calls $1
Xx Xx Q♦ 4♠ MP bets $1

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It is five handed, so in this spot, can I complete on third. Furthermore, how good of a card is that for me on fourth? Can I ever lead? If I check call, am I resigning myself to check calling down unless I spike a seven or two pair? Or hell, should I just have folded at that point.

Two-bets from big cards are generally more honest because it's so hard to get low hands to fold that re-steals are rare. Your two-suit and two-low would have me open and defend my open Third. Fourth, the Queen is not a good card for you. In stud hi it might make it more likely villain has high airbags or a four-flush rather than a pair, but in most stud8 lineups that's not true, and our hand isn't doing great against a four flush anyhow. There is enough in the pot on Fourth that you have to peel with a live pair, but I'd bail Fifth UI most likely.

What electrical said. Peel. Likely abandon ship on 5th

4th is an auto peel, because ur getting 6.75:1

5th is where i'm not sure at all what the right play is. I'd imagine dead cards and backdoor draws are the pivoting indicators on whether to fold or peel.

Say we call 4th and catch an off suit 3 on 5th, villain doesn't improve but leads out, folding here right?

This is spot on in every way. A on 5th ( esp Ad ) vs something like KK or QQ helps us out considerably and is probably the only card I might do something with that doesnt pair our hand on 5th. 3rd is always a complete even with an A behind. Can balance sometimes i guess, but complete is best.

Yeah your hold and cold equity is fine, but everything else sucks

I fold, yeah, but I know some solid winners who will justify calling because they are about breakeven equity vs range and they can squeeze out more value from binks than I can. Unless the villain is someone I can exploit somehow then I generally bail.

OK, I'll assume this hand didn't play out that way, but that can be interesting at higher limits vs good players who don't let off the gas in spots like these.

In this EXACT spot I would fold 5, but if you had caught a liver brick on 4, I would continue. A king is a mandatory continue, 9, T, J much closer

Are you playing 1/2 on WPN? This is so player dependent it's not even funny.

I play that game myself (you would probably recognize my name) and I would NEVER (as the villain) raise with villains upcard without a good pair, even short handed. Some other players might end up with a ten high strait at showdown playing with Q T 7 because they can't control themselves.

Continuing as the villain, NO MATTER WHO YOU ARE, and no matter the card I catch, I am going to bet 4th when you brick out, hoping on a fold of three likely low cards, or if you do call I will bet 5th every time, unless you catch an ace and I don't improve. As noted above, you SHOULD call with your hand getting the odds you are, and if I can get a fold, or set up a fold on 5th, it is win/win.

Back to your hand, there are almost no cards that make your hand playable after 5th, aside from a 7, a (likely) dead queen, or a deuce (Ace I can make a call as it creates deception, king, I probably fold). I still think 4th street is a call, especially if you are pretty sure to get paid off multiple bets when you spike your 7 (implied odds up to appx 14:1).

It would be better if your hand had say a 6, instead of a deuce. In that case, if you catch a 5 on 5th, you can take another card off. Backdoor strait and low is worth more than you would think (in addition to the 7). But as is I don't think you can call 5th.

Also, a HERO, (again) depending on villain, If I caught an ace, I would sometimes lead 5th street; there are players who can make this fold, especially if they didn't really have a pair to start with.

I am curious to see what players think of my line here.

You saying the dead Q door makes this a fold?

Interested as to why you'd want to draw to a potential worse pair vs what we assume is QxQ? Obv not always but I think at these stakes we can lean more equity towards straight forward play.

Also some of the time your example is from the stakes you play, (I'd assume higher) making my argument worse, which is fine.

I agree that a King ball here on 4th and I'd never fold, given dead cards, and Q door for villain.


Side note: OP, I really hope you appreciate who all has responded to this post. Some world class players giving out free help now a days is rare. I'm thankful you posted this hand and we have some good discussion on a stud8 hand.

RolledTrips 9TJ doesnt do much for you event tho its presumably less dead if youre against queens or better. 9TJd is good, K good, Kd is nut brick

Marty your logic sounds good

GGI Very kind of you to recognize and acknowledge that, and thanks for your continued contributions towards keeping the forums alive! Speaking for myself ( if I make that list ) OP is one of my best friends =) A lot of guys in here are very close with him. One of the best guys I know. We're v lucky

You're like a 3:1 dog for the high with the added equity of backdoor low. Especially if you picked up a 3-flush on 5 you just have enough to peel.