Open completing from the bring-in - Stud8 - Stud Poker

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Open completing from the bring-in - Stud8

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03-24-2018 , 04:52 AM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Everyone is doing it! Bad players are doing it, good players are doing it, 2+2ers are doing it.

Ok so probably 2/3 players are doing it at least some of the time. Usually they are hands like 542, A73.

The stakes I play are $0.04/$0.08, $0.01 ante and $0.02 bring so that should explain most of it. The games usually play pretty loose passive and quite often there is no completion by anyone on 3rd street.

Are there certain spots I should be doing this as well?

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03-24-2018 , 12:01 PM

electrical

Loaded for bear

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,280

Generally speaking it's a bad idea to bring in full. There are some rare tournament spots or when you're trying to exploit someone who will habitually isolate such bets, but in a vacuum you don't do anything good for your hands or your ranges by open completing the bring-in.

Thread about it here: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/2.../#post45357104

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03-24-2018 , 09:53 PM

Small Balls

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 491

Thanks!

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03-25-2018 , 02:29 AM

Dynasty

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 25,941

I'll open-complete when playing short-handed against weak opponent doorcards.

So, if I've got (7

and my opponents have doorcards of Q

, T

, and 8

I'll open-complete.

In my game (30-60), the bring-in is $10. So, I'm raising another $20 to win the $30 in the pot already (four $5 antes and the $10 bring-in).

More importantly, I'll make the same open-complete with something like (4,9)2 against weak opponent doorcards.

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03-25-2018 , 04:22 AM

electrical

Loaded for bear

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,280

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dynasty

I'll open-complete when playing short-handed against weak opponent doorcards.

So, if I've got (7

and my opponents have doorcards of Q

, T

, and 8

I think it's bad for all the reasons mentioned in the thread. Your precise open-complete range does poorly against any high hand, and your opponents should pick up on it and play back at you often enough to make it lose money. The immediate odds you're getting to steal are even money, but if you lose extra when your opponents play back at you the play is a loser on aggregate even if you steal successfully half the time.

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03-26-2018 , 07:55 AM

JiveDef

grinder

Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 471

Quote:

Originally Posted by electrical

^^ This, also a 2 is worse than an 8 so its a bad card not a good card

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03-26-2018 , 03:35 PM

browni3141

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2015 Posts: 5,678

Quote:

Originally Posted by electrical

We shouldn't assume we're going to play badly. If we can steal >50% of the time we should do it with rags. We can't lose extra money when opponents play back at us when we can just fold when the steal fails.

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03-27-2018 , 01:22 AM

ChipsAhoya

2011 $10k Stud8 Champion

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 6,890

i love open completing in s/8; i just can't do it very often.

other than in weird short stack tournament situations where you don't want people to steal with wide ranges because you'll be all in, I basically only do it if I'm looking at duplicated high cards like TTQQK and I probably have to be the only low card.

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03-27-2018 , 01:43 AM

electrical

Loaded for bear

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,280

Quote:

Originally Posted by browni3141

The open-completing range described includes hands that shouldn't fold to a raise, but will often bust out. Those are precisely hands that should try to accrue equity with a subsequent card as inexpensively as possible.

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03-31-2018 , 02:18 AM

#10

Joe Tall

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 16,925

Pretty much no hand you should bring in for full that you cannot re-raise with when it's back to you.

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