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Old 03-31-2010, 03:39 PM   #776
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Why is calling third standard?
Only standard for aufuuu.
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Old 03-31-2010, 03:46 PM   #777
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

So much content... Where to begin...

Third: Fold. Your hand sucks, the pot is small and you're not going to steal it ever.
Fourth: Check/fold > bet/call > check/raise > check/call
Fifth: Easiest check/raise ever on earth
Sixth: You played this street perfectly
River: You have got to be sh|tting me bet/call a Seven for the love of all things holy.
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Old 03-31-2010, 03:46 PM   #778
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by camz2895 View Post
how is seat 6 drawing to runner runner to beat the J low?
If Hero checks and Seat 6 checks closing the action, he's really hurting. He doesn't need much of a hand to bet when checked to here. Given the previous action, the only way he checks when checked to here is if the 4 paired him, and I expect him to bet even a fair percentage of the time that the 4 paired him...
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:19 PM   #779
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by Joe Tall View Post
Where is Razz Pro?
did u miss me
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:20 PM   #780
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by KenDoG_819 View Post
Busto ldo.
hu4rollz?
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:20 PM   #781
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by Andy B View Post
Being busto does not prevent people from posting. It helps in my case. I mean, some cases.
are u the 1 that changed my pw
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:21 PM   #782
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

how do u multi quote again
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:23 PM   #783
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

i'm gonna go out on a limb and say it probably has something to do with the "multi-quote" button but don't quote me on that, no pun intended
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:40 PM   #784
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by RAZZ PRO A2345 View Post
hu4rollz?
yes please
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:44 PM   #785
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Click the little button to the right of the Quote button on each of the messages that you want to Quote. After you've marked all of the messages that you want to quote in this way, click the Quote button on one of them -- I don't think it matters which.
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:46 PM   #786
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by KenDoG_819 View Post
yes please
k waiting 30 60
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Old 03-31-2010, 04:54 PM   #787
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

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Originally Posted by RAZZ PRO A2345 View Post
k waiting 30 60
Unless you changed your name to mido87, u are a liar.

So if you really want to play, I am sitting $110 or $220 7-Game hu sngs

Not expecting to see you though..

Edit: Seems the only place u are sitting is the $1 Main Event Qualifier which starts in 3 days..Good Luck with that sir

Last edited by KenDoG_819; 03-31-2010 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 03-31-2010, 05:28 PM   #788
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Full Tilt Poker $11 + $0.50 Heads Up Limit Razz Tournament - t120/t240 Limit + t20 - 2 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (): t1052 M = 4.78
Seat 2: t1948 M = 8.85

3rd Street: (0.333 SB)
Hero: 3 8 5___Hero completes
Seat 2: xx xx K____Seat 2 brings in for $40____Seat 2 calls

4th Street: (2.333 SB) (2 players)
Hero: 3 8 5 Q___Hero bets
Seat 2: xx xx K K____Seat 2 calls

5th Street: (2.167 BB) (2 players)
Hero: 3 8 5 Q Q___Hero bets
Seat 2: xx xx K K 9____Seat 2 calls

6th Street: (4.167 BB) (2 players)
Hero: 3 8 5 Q Q 5___Hero raises___Hero calls all in
Seat 2: xx xx K K 9 2____Seat 2 bets____Seat 2 3-bets

7th Street: (8.767 BB) (2 players - 1 is all in)
Hero: 3 8 5 Q Q 5 5
Seat 2: xx xx K K 9 2 xx

Spoiler:



boring/poor/standard bla
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Old 03-31-2010, 05:33 PM   #789
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

welcome to my world sir. Glad I'm not alone.
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Old 03-31-2010, 05:43 PM   #790
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KenDoG_819 View Post
Unless you changed your name to mido87, u are a liar.

So if you really want to play, I am sitting $110 or $220 7-Game hu sngs

Not expecting to see you though..

Edit: Seems the only place u are sitting is the $1 Main Event Qualifier which starts in 3 days..Good Luck with that sir
umm well i was had to go do something real quick and im back and waiting we can do like 4 tables till ur bust
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Old 03-31-2010, 05:46 PM   #791
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Call 6th, fold the river, leaves you with 312 chips. Better than nothing.

No reason to get all-in on 6th when you're likely behind. River fold is safe; if the 2 paired him, your pair of 5s is still a loser.
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Old 03-31-2010, 05:49 PM   #792
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

def what jbrennen said. 312 chips > 0. Lot of ppl's leaks are hands like that on 6th where they just put the guy all in. call and fold gives you your only chance of winning if u brick
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Old 03-31-2010, 06:33 PM   #793
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

thanks, you are right, i see what i did wrong. That's a huge leak in my overall game that i just miss to take in acc it's a tournament and so miss to be cautious with my chips, often even though i'm at least semi-aware of that but just !@#=% myself. Well, i just gonna work on that

Last edited by michaelg5pro; 03-31-2010 at 06:38 PM.
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Old 03-31-2010, 07:04 PM   #794
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

This may be my last post in these forums. It's certainly the end of my following this thread. So... I'll make it a good one with lessons to be learned for all of you that care. There are a few important concepts on this one that I think some are overlooking or unaware of.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aufgeschwemm View Post
3rd Street: (0.5 SB)
Hero: 9 6 3___Hero raises___Hero calls___Hero calls
Seat 5: xx xx 4____Seat 5 3-bets____Seat 5 caps!
Seat 6: xx xx 7____Seat 6 brings in for $10____Seat 6 caps!____Seat 6 calls
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheYellow View Post
Why is calling third standard?

We're almost certainly in last place with two cards dead in a pot with only 3 antes and we're facing two bets cold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by finknik View Post
Only standard for aufuuu.
If we evaluate this hand strictly from an all-in decision on 3rd st, we can solve for whether or not calling would be correct. If the betting doesn't get capped by seat 5, then we must risk $60 to win $225. This gives us 3.75 to 1. We would need 21% equity to make this call. If the betting does get capped behind us, we would be risking $90 to win $285, thus getting 3.16 to 1 and would now require 24% equity to show an immediate profit. For the times that seat 5 doesn't cap we can assume he doesn't have 3 cards below a 7. For the times that he does, we will assume he does. Unfortunately, ProPokerTools' simulator is insufficient for calculating such scenarios, however, using a more advanced Razz calculator, we find that we have ~31.8% equity in this scenario (by giving seat 5 one card between 8-T and the other 7-). In the scenario where it DOES get capped on 3rd st, we can safely assume the following ranges for both villains, yielding us ~21.3% equity.

ProPokerTools Razz Simulation
600,000 trials (Randomized)
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
96321.27% 127,260777
(7-7-4)43.84% 262,1981,678
(8-8-7)34.89% 208,5541,522

So... we can see that this is an easy call if betting doesn't get capped and an easy fold if it does. (31.8% is greater than the required 21% for when it doesn't get capped and 21.3% is less than the required 24% for the times it does.) Doing some quick combo counting, I found the ratio of times seat 5 is able to cap vs not cap to be 540:263. Using this approximation, we can find that we have ~31.8% equity ~32.8% of the time and we have ~21.3% equity ~67.2% of the time.

Now, we need 23.016% equity to show a profit (67.2*0.24 + 32.8*0.21). With 31.8% equity distributed 32.8% of the time and 21.3% equity 67.2% of the time, we find that we have 24.74% equity in this hand. This would make our hand a call (albeit a close one). Now, the real question here is can we profitably continue. If we play well on 4th and 5th street and assume our villain's do not, then this is a pretty easy hand to continue in. If either we do not play optimally on 4th and 5th or villains do play optimally on later streets, then we should fold because of reverse implied odds. I know, I know, everyone here plays optimally of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheYellow View Post
Also is 5th standard?

I know about putting extra money in from the xx4KQ but we don't even have 33% in the pot.
You're calc is off. You made it so that villain showing **774 never pairs the 4. This is an unfair assumption. Put the 7 inside the brackets and take the 4 back out and give him a more reasonable range of 8- in the hole, watch what happens.

ProPokerTools Razz Simulation
600,000 trials (Randomized)
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
9632J35.52% 213,033178
(7-7-4)KQ14.81% 88,514710
(8-8-7)7449.67% 297,663692

Note that we are now assuming seat 5 has a premium starting hand since he did cap 3rd street..

Quote:
5th Street: (9.25 BB) (3 players)
Hero: 9 6 3 J 2___Hero bets___Hero 3-bets___Hero calls
Seat 5: xx xx 4 K Q____Seat 5 calls____Seat 5 calls____Seat 5 calls
Seat 6: xx xx 7 7 4____Seat 6 raises____Seat 6 caps!
With the understanding that we do in fact have >33% here, we can eliminate c/c and b/c from our toolbox if seat 5 hangs around. In a typical situation, I would agree with jbrennan's assessment that we would do well to c/r in order to drive out seat 5. However, this play doesn't quite work as well in this spot. The reason is that we are way behind seat 6 when he hasn't paired and we will end up getting in 3 bets HU against a villain as a huge dog. This is not a desirable result. Now, if we lead out, we have a better chance of trapping seat 5 into making the mistake of calling a cap (remember that by the fundamental theorem of poker, we gain every time we force our opponents into making a mistake) and we also give seat 6 the option to tell us whether he's paired the 4 or not if he flats behind. I actually like aufuu's line here (though probably for different reasons than he chose it for). It's by far the best option imo. (No offense to your response jb, I think you're one of the most solid players in this thread, I just disagree about this spot).

Quote:
Originally Posted by camz2895 View Post
b/f 7th. In this huge pot you will get all sorts of crying calls with worse hands
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrennen View Post
And if you fold 7th, you may get SIWAS'd to the tune of about $1500.
Quote:
Originally Posted by camz2895 View Post
haha meant to say b/c, surely no one b/f's here
Pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. Check it back.
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Old 03-31-2010, 07:05 PM   #795
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Anyhow, it's been fun guys. I'll be around from time to time, you can always PM me if you have specific questions and are interested in my responses, but I'm done trolling these threads. There is too much drama on here and not enough content for it to be worth my while. Far too often, people post their opinions regarding which lines to take and don't even attempt to break it down showing why they've come to their decisions (and frankly, they are just dead wrong way too often). It seems to be a "duh, just do this" line of reasoning. I'm not interested in what players THINK we should be doing based on how they played the hand, I'm interested in what we can gain from crunching the data with the tools we have available to us. I know that some of you appreciate my posts, and to those of you that PM me on occasion, I apologize in advance for not contributing further. You can still PM me or IM me, I'll be happy to give you my input.

Take care everyone,

Rain
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Old 03-31-2010, 07:28 PM   #796
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

hey travis, first thanks for your detailed comment on that hand.
ok, i rarely participated in any discussions here so i'm the last to be able to judge what was goin on heer, but have seen your reactions and what you mean, ... however is all this drama really so rude and annoying to you to stay away? Ok, since you took your decision my question is dumb and it's all fair enough. Considering your primary interest i like your attitude.
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Old 03-31-2010, 07:31 PM   #797
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

rainman i tokk my line on 5th exactly because of the reasons you pointed out, i would play that hand exactly with the same line again. i could explain my thoughts, but i dont want to, you should understand that. ill skype u if u give me ur Sn per Pn pls.
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Old 03-31-2010, 07:56 PM   #798
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KenDoG_819 View Post
Unless you changed your name to mido87, u are a liar.

So if you really want to play, I am sitting $110 or $220 7-Game hu sngs

Not expecting to see you though..

Edit: Seems the only place u are sitting is the $1 Main Event Qualifier which starts in 3 days..Good Luck with that sir
just looooool
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Old 03-31-2010, 08:44 PM   #799
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RAZZ PRO A2345 View Post
just looooool
My thoughts exactly.
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Old 03-31-2010, 08:48 PM   #800
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Re: Can we start March Low Content yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KenDoG_819 View Post
My thoughts exactly.
i offer hu4rollz u accept then say play me in 100 or 200 hu sng 7 game just looooool i just played hu 30 60 for about 3 hours sure u saw so w/e

something more important isildur just revealed himself nvg thread
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