I guess I would be a regular at Del Sol. People there likely know me from the baseball caps that I wear (usually "Two Scoops" or "NYU"). I play mostly 1/2 NL and tournaments. Never been to the Diamond. Anyone else play in Tucson? It's pretty hard being profitable against these short stacked, 75+ year olds but there are enough action players to make up for it.

I'm guessing .... maybe a week from now this thread will get a response.

lol sorry you grind in Tucson bro

It sucks. But not as bad as living in Phoenix.

To be fair I used to live in Phoenix and I'd go play at Casino Arizona pretty often. I used to crush the 3/6 limit game there. Yes, you can make money playing limit.

They only have 2/4 LHE at Del Sol. and that game is not at all worth playing. You might as well be playing black jack. Everyone chases everything. I have some sick stories. Even in NL.

Here's a good one. 1/2 NL.

Young Asian kid comes to the table, buys in for $200. Very first hand, he goes all in. Drunk, who has like $260 calls, Old Man, who has like $250 calls.

Flop comes, I don't remember exactly what it was, but there were 2 spades. Drunk moves all his chips across the line and then pulls em back, and Old Man starts yelling, "He put those across the line! He hasta leave those in there!" and of course calls and shows A3 of spades. Nut flush draw. Asian kid turns over JJ and the drunk mucks on the river, when the spade hits. And this was the funniest part. The Old Man yelled, "Ship It!" and then dragged the $700 pot. I was cracking up.

No money left to be made in Tucson. Everybody's solid.

The regs at Del Sol are pretty solid. There are a couple little old ladies in that place, that can play cards. DO NOT judge a book by it's cover. I got taken out the other night in a tournament by a little old lady.

But there are some people there, you can get in a big pot with. Particularly recently, there is some new blood since the DOJ came down, and some of these kids are good, but some are playing live for the first time, and are super easy to read. I saw a kid the other day, hesitate for a split second as he was throwing in his bet ... and I just raised him and he folded. I had nothing, but I knew he would fold to a big enough raise.

Also, I should note that Del Sol is doing a remodel right now of the poker room.

Yeah, but you wised up and got the hell out of there.

Desert Diamond has a really nice looking room, but no action. I was there on a Saturday afternoon, and there were two tables going. One 3/6 LHE (I think) and one 1/2 NL.

Sounds like a fun time.

Desert Diamond is my preferred spot because of its proximity to where I work, and it's not all that dead. If you go on one of the nights when they run their NLHE tournaments, there's tons of action to be had.

I have a feeling that the Del Sol remodel/expansion may kill that action for a while though, since everybody always flocks to the newer room. And that new room does look like it will be pretty nice.

I used to go to Del Sol to play 1/2 PLO8, but since they stopped running it, I've stopped making the effort to drive an extra 20 minutes. And when they got rid of the pizza place, that just sealed the deal.

I play regularly at Del Sol and know the op. Del Sol closes during Easter so I played at the Diamond. The 1-2 spread limit game (for those who don't know Arizona poker there is not any no limit technically because the maximum bet is $500, but the lower spread games play like no limit) was pretty good but they were just running it just because people came over from Del Sol. The structure is better than the one at Del Sol. At Del Sol the minimum buy-in is $40 and the max is $200. That results in a lot of short stackers playing. The Diamond spreads it with a minimum of $60 and a maximum of $300. It is a much better game that way.

I suggested that the Diamond run a 2-3 game with a $100 minimum and $500 max buy-in. I've made that suggestion at Del Sol as well but neither Casino will do that. So I'll have to go to Casino Arizona for that type of game.

As I've said before on this forum Del Sol is better if you like no limit. The Diamond is better if you like limit.

I agree that closing Slices and removing the pizza option was not a good thing. Tonight will be my first night in the temporarily smaller room as setup for construction. I'll say hi to the op if he's there and report on the new arrangement.

I too am a regular at Del Sol. While diamond has a nice room, their managements are horrible and they recently cancelled most of their regular tournaments (only one left is Tuesday 7pm). And if you want no/spread limit you're out of luck. The one time you saw the game there is perhaps the only time of year they can spread the game, when Del Sol is on Easter break.

You're however right about the short stackers at Del Sol. They can be annoying, and I have been refusing to give action to short stackers. (e.g. muck JJ from the BB when they pfr with 30% of their stack.) And well, while most older players are short stackers, not all short stackers are older players. There are surprisingly many younger short stackers, just embarrassing to watch.

Actions are always good unless you're there on a weekday afternoon. Even then it's not always bad.

And Del Sol gives $1/hr comp. Diamond is somewhere like 1-5 cents/hr. So I guess that makes Del Sol 20-100 times better in that area. Oh and when you order food from diamond poker room, they give you half price (yay!) Guess where the discount comes from? The jackpot fund. I'm annoyed but I guess not everybody care about that.

I became incredibly bored with HE a few years ago, so my experience is limited when it comes to those games. But I consistently see at least two or three tables of 3/6-4/8 LHE and, more often than not, one game of 8/16 running at the Diamond. I can't really speak to the quality of the LHE play nowadays, because I only see it from my seat at the Omaha game.

I played in the 8/16 LHE game for a couple of years before I grew bored with it, and it was so full of regs that it was pretty beatable if you knew who to pick on. (Note: In my experience, regs are only good about half the time, the other half are people with money to burn who enjoy the social aspect of the game and play very predictably.)

I do know that the omaha/stud mix at Del Sol became something of a rock garden right before I stopped playing it regularly (~summer 2008), and it was almost impossible to get a game going until around 11 every night. Our only hope for action was to chat up some of the drunks who had busted out of the NLHE tournaments and get them to sit down and play a few hands.

I played Del Sol last night for the first time since they have reconfigured it during the construction. There are six tables. They are very close together. It is cramped, and hot. However, the biggest problem for me is the noise. Because the room is so small the noise bounces off the walls and reverberates. It dissipated in the old room. I had to wear headphones and listen to music to cope with it, and I seldom do that in a poker room.

This is supposed to take 12 weeks and may take longer. Then they will move into the larger half of the room which will have been renovated.

I'm guessing ...... Ray.

Bad guess. But you know that already op.

Room update--they brought in some fans so the heat situation is better. The noise is still a problem. The crowding is a major problem. A dealer hit me in the head with an elbow while he was trying to clean up some spilled popcorn at an adjacent table. It is far worse to play at the back tables from all perspectives. The noise and heat are far worse back there.

Wolf Tickets--I sent you a p.m.

Hey Ray ...

With the reduced tables, small cramped room, less dealers on shift, even if people do show up ... how does that reduce the chance of the BBJ hitting?

Or more importantly, how much does it go up when the new room is done if it hasn't hit?

I'm going to cite wizard of odds on this. http://wizardofodds.com/holdem/badbeat.html, it assumes a ten-handed table and nobody ever fold a qualifying hand (so obviously false assumptions). Both (slighting false) assumptions (probably only slightly) overestimate the chance of hitting BBJ for a given hand. Every hand is independent, with qualifer AAAJJ or better beat and type 3 criteria, chance of hitting BBJ on any given hand , according to the table, is no higher than .0000204. So about one in 49000.

1. If the question is how does that reduce the chance of the BBJ hitting In the Poker Room, less tables reduce the chance proportionally. That is because less tables means less hands.

2. If the question is how does that reduce the chance of the BBJ hitting at your table. Then the answer is it does not.

3. As for maximizing the chance to hit, the table should, a. not fold a qualifying hand and b. play fast.

Hope it helps.

So ... it has a lesser chance of hitting, until there are more active tables. Lesser chance of at least a room share .... per $ you are paying into it. Right?

And if it doesn't hit, when the new room opens, traffic should increase ... and there is a greater chance, of at least a room share, because more tables means more chances it gets dealt vs. time.

I understand that the chance, at your table, to actually hit it never changes, but the math beyond that is for Phd students.

But I am right, that less active tables reduces the chance that it hits pretty significantly. Right? Less hands, less chance it hits. Of course, less players, the bigger the share, as well.

Im currently stuck in tucson til Aug 1st. Also, I know of and have been playing in a really well run home game that runs Sun, Mon, Tues, and Weds. They run everything depending on the day, tournies, cash, omaha, limit or NL. In addition there NL games are way better than del sol, as probably half the hands are straddled (mississippi straddles are allowed). Really good action. PM me if your interested.

Also, Diamond has run 2/5 to 500 recently a couple times on Fridays kinda after the 15/30 starts to slow up. If anyone ever wants people to start a 2/5 game at either casino I am down.

Are these the only two casinos in the Tucson area with a live poker room? Do either/both have a PLO game? If so, what limit?

Thanks,
OD

These are the only two casino poker rooms. I've never seen a PLO high game in the last five years. Del Sol used to get a 1-2 or 2-3 PLO8 game regularly, but now those people play a 4-8 mix that is O8 and Stud8 only.

I'm not sure you can actually spread PLO in Arizona under the pseudo-NL current rules.

(Even if it were spread-limit and pot-betting capped...)

Is the "cap" on the NL enforced on each street - or the most you can put it into the pot (like the CAP tables online)? How come there is no pure no limit? Silly state

The cap is enforced with each bet. Games are generally 5-250 or 5-500 - as the state has mandated how many games of how many limits one room can have. If you bet $500, one could raise to $1000, and it could be re-raised all the way to $2000 - each street - with the standard bet and three raises limits here.