63 for yesterday's 5k guarantee, pretty decent turnout. Was fun tournament and staff run it well. Also got 08 and bigo to run. Bigo played full from about 11 to 4am. Great time and can't beat 4 buck max rake and no Bbj drop. Noticed a lot of new dealers last night.

How many did the deepstack get today?

62

Planning to go down for the black chip bounty tournament tomorrow. How many runners does it get and what kind of field is it? Structure? Also, I am assuming I'll need a player's card to sign up, correct?

I'd say ballpark between 50-70 runners. Field will be predominantly soft, structure is kinda fast so you got splash around and try to accumulate and yes you'll need a card and id.

Thank you for the info. It'll be my first time at Sands. Looking forward to it!

They haven't break over 60 in the last 5 sunday when the tournament run.

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What time has the Sunday tournament been finishing around?

I would said around 10 p.m. The last time I FT it bust out and went to play 1/2 @ 8 and the runner up join me about 2 hour later.

It's a good tournament, but when the field contracted there's just less black chip for me to collected. I'll come back again when the field get to 70 or higher.

I mean yeah we are when it ends up taking like $20-$30/hour off the table along with the bbj just being -ev.

Davey,

Just had a few thoughts I wanted to talk about in this thread and hopefully you read them. I play at Sands pretty much everyday, mostly in all the bigger games and I've definitely noticed a decline in number of players. When 5/5 isn't getting off on a Sat night till 6pm there's definitely some work that needs to be done to improve traffic in the room. I've seen some suggestions in this thread but most of them I dont think are gonna work.

People aren't gonna start showing up if we start adding assy mixed games or running sngs, withered tournaments etc. Recreational players are drawn most by things like the BBJ and promotions. I think it would be a good idea to try taking half the money collected from the BBJ and put that into the normal jackpot then the other half be used for daily or weekly giveaways. I know this is going to result in the BBJ being smaller but it hasn't been that big for awhile anyways and people are gonna like that they have a better chance of winning with the seat giveaways/high hands etc. When Sands had the $2500 seat giveaways and the $500 high hands the place was a zoo. You start giving out $500-$1k multiple times a day during the week and maybe bigger giveaways on Friday/Sat or a freeroll of some sort I guarantee numbers will increase.

I also think Sands is running too many tournaments during the week, run 1 or 2 a week with a guarantee on them. The more you run them the quicker the player pool will get smaller cause of rake being high and most players not even being profitable. Also I assume Sands is probably making less off them per hour than they would opening a cash table and dealers hate dealing them anyways. Sands should also try and run more big advertised tournament series. The last Deepstacks seemed to go pretty well having a $200 $100k guaranteed and a $1500. Obviously it doesnt have to be a big long series with lots of events but I think copying what Parx is doing with their Bigstax would be a good idea. Of course just make sure the tournaments dont conflict with any other series in the area. One last thing, please find a way to get wifi in the room, I'm sure this has been brought up a bunch in this thread already but its kind of absurd that we don't have it.

Very good points.

I think you bring up many good and valid points. However assy mixed games account for 10-15% of Parxs table count on many days. Lots of the player pool for such games migrated to Parx. When I see them and ask them why they don't come to sands anymore their answer is always because they can't count on a game going. I am sure sands would live to boost their daily table counts by 10-15%.

1. How does any of this help bring in 5-5 players?

2. I assume most 5-5 players also play in the 10-25 NL no BBJ game. Why should the rest of the players support play from players that don't want to pay into the promotion pool?

There are way more potential players who have the bankroll to play the lower limit games. Davey needs to find ways to attract those players.

This. I'd knock 60 mins off my trip to Parx plus tolls if Sands ran a mix variant like the 6/12 OE. Game, limit, collection is just about perfect for me (and obviously for a chunk of folks considering its popularity in Bensalem).

The suggestions I made were not just to help bring in just 5/5 players, but all stakes. I only used that stake in my example cause I found it unusual we couldn't get a game going till 6pm on a Sat. I don't see why it matters that 10/25 doesn't pay for a BBJ either, and most 5/5 players definitely don't play 10/25.

I know your the mixed game guy here and personally I never play them so I don't really care about them. I don't have any suggestions on how to get mixed games going and you cant really give out promos for people sitting in those games cause of no BBJ drop and as you said players migrating to Parx etc, I don't think player pools for them is gonna increase at Sands anytime soon. Seems like the mixed games that are getting off at Sands are games where most people are losing to the rake anyways.

the reason I migrated to parx from sands for a few reasons.

1. cashing in and cashing out is so much quicker at parx. you have a cage right there vs the 1 "poker" cashier at sands. Last time I gave them 2k to buy chips at sands, they asked if i'm just changing money or need the chips. I was playing 2/5 while waiting for the 5/10, so yes, i need the damn chips.

2. at sands, it's located in the middle of all the slots, random screaming and hollering. It's just alot more peaceful to play at parx.

3. 9 handed tables are so much better than 10.

another reasons is the waitlist for sands are all call-ins. the 5/10 had 10 names of the list. apparently i was the only one in the room.

I give sands credit for lowering rake on Omaha - BigO. That's the one thing they really can do. I agree that it wouldn't be fair to offer promos funded out of the drop for those games.

They could go to a time structure like Parx for those games. I think that's the best way to try to bring players in. Would it work? I don't know. But might be worth a shot.

+1

only the 10/25 game is allowed to phone ahead.

The 5/10 doesn't always go right away because:

a) some of the names have been on there since noon, and the game gets called at 7pm+ when the list fills up
b) most of the players, at least a lot of the regulars, stay at the 2/5 and 5/5 until they know the game fills up and is a go
c) a lot of the regulars first wana check out the field, and then make a final decision.

WHY the HELL do people play at ten handed tables at Sands. The max should be nine handed.

The possibility of a casino license being granted to a facility in Orange County NY is growing. That would be more convenient for many players in NJ, and about the same for players in NYC.

This does not bode well for the Sands poker room.

Really great ideas.

People love those splash pot and high hands. One high hand promotion night after i just sat down I raised to $16 at 1-2 and all the six limpers folded. The guy next to me tells me if i had a good hand I made a mistake because of the high hand promo. He and others were clearly there for that promo.

Also great ideas on the tournaments. Fewer and more of a buzz (guarantees) is what would work. I love the long structures but can't do it every week and realize most people can't. Maybe taking $2 and adding a BBJ for tournaments would be good also.

The good news is that none of these are new ideas and they are all available for free on the websites of competitors. I would assign someone to look at every poker website poker room in Los Angeles where you have 7-8 poker rooms all trying for the same limited player pool. They get very creative.

Lastly when it comes to tournaments I would please ask that the Sands do a little extra work to facilitate final table deals. No one wants to have to sit down somewhere and hope that a group of strangers is honest to split up a large sum of money. Especially when first place may have tax consequences and 2nd place may not. If the players agree on a deal just divide it up accordingly at the cage. I know you are allowed to do it because Mohegan Sun does it all the time. Yes it would be a little extra work, but yes it is pretty standard anywhere I have played regularly.

Thanks for listening to all the players suggestions.

Lack of promotional event to bring in rec players to replenish their diminishing players pool is hurting the game at the Sand.

Sand offer $50 splash pot versus $500 high hand no qualifier, no need to go to showdown @ Parx.

Their Friday & Saturday Tournament are a joke. Why play there when I can to Sunday $80 tourney @ Parx.

The Sunday tournament at the Sands which I love is going down hill too. The last time they Guarantee it a $10K 160+ player came out for that event, and they haven't manage to get that number above 50 ever since. I know peoples said it's due to wsop circuit in Philly, and Big Stax, but those were just excuse. Bottom line, the Sands is not fighting hard enough to bring in players.

Every other poker room in pa have some sort of series going into summer to run except sands. Harrah's is running a $15K guarantee Memorial weekend. Sands won't have another series of poker tournament until August when everyone come back from Vegas busto and exhaust from wsop event. They are now having to fight for players against Parx, Borgata, and Foxwood event coming into the fall we all now where the players are going.

Also the quality of the dealers at the Sands is going downhill since a bunch of the good one left to work at Maryland Live and that does effect the quality of the game too.

Other poster here mention that they need to guarantee their tournament to attract more rec players. I think that's a good idea. I think they should move the $100 + $100 bounty to Saturday and put a guarantee of $15-20K will bring more players out.