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Old 12-27-2010, 11:44 AM   #2576
JONATHANM
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Stop trying to juice pots for cryin' out loud, you degen, action junkie gambooolers!!

Forgive me if I offend any one , but when it comes down to it , I really could care less anyway (no offense ). I'm a laid back fellow by nature. Live poker is a perfect match for my disposition. A session of live poker is a long, arduous test of patience. I do not consider poker an "action" game. Craps is an "action" game.

Maybe you action junkie gamblers should consider craps to fulfill your insatiable appetite for said action, and let the card players play cards. Or just stay home and 20 table online while texting and playing your kiddie video games and talking to your girlfriend and eating your drive-thru big mac and blah blah blah. Do whatever you people that can't hold their attention for more than 2 seconds do. Just please stop trying to impose your action fever on card players. Find other gambling action junkies and start a " put $1 in for this, $1 in for that ,$6 in for that and $5 in if your male, $2 if your female..." table.

Live poker is a tedious and boring game of patience, patience pays off in profit. You "moneymaker effect" 20 somethings and degen action junkie gambooolers need to stop trying to change it.You could always get your BR up and play w/ the big boys at 50/100+ if you need to be mesmerized by a huge pile of chips in the pot all the time.

That said....I think 2-10 stud, $2 BI,no ante, no time is a great game. What drives the action you ask? Poker players that know how to play stud. I see no problems making drop w/ a 2-10 spread. With the right players , you'll have $40-$60 pots more often than one would think imo. I ask that you seriously consider this stud format Ari. At least just give it a shot for a couple months, can't hurt. Maybe try a 10% up to $7-8 rake (if law will allow), this could offset the short drops., you know, with all the "nits" that will be playing .

...Sorry.. had to vent

Last edited by JONATHANM; 12-27-2010 at 12:03 PM.
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Old 12-27-2010, 12:18 PM   #2577
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

maybe this 2/4 discussion should perhaps be moved to its own thread since it's morphed into a separate debate that is not quite on topic.

in any case, anybody else here get stranded at PARX last night? I was on my way home up I-95 North and decided that the storm was too bad to continue driving so I made it to PARX to try to wait it out. Despite only 5-6 tables going, the games were surprisingly lively and fun. I was fully expecting the tables to be just nits and degens, grinding it out and waiting out the storm. Instead, my table was crazy action and fun, thanks to one reg named Bob who was always in there raising with any two. I eventually left to brave to roads at around 11 because I thought I would need to go to work the next day. I guess I could have just stayed cause this morning I couldn't even get out the driveway.

My only complaint about the room atm is that I wish that they would turn the heat up a bit. It's pretty frigid in there.
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Old 12-27-2010, 12:48 PM   #2578
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by Chaosti View Post

My only complaint about the room atm is that I wish that they would turn the heat up a bit. It's pretty frigid in there.
casinos are always cold for a reason...you say awake longer in the cold = play longer...it's easier to make yourself warm (with clothes) than to cool yourself down if you're too hot...for a big room of potentially smelly men I think cold >>> warm
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:16 PM   #2579
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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casinos are always cold for a reason...you say awake longer in the cold = play longer...it's easier to make yourself warm (with clothes) than to cool yourself down if you're too hot...for a big room of potentially smelly men I think cold >>> warm
Absolutely. Unless women start playing it should stay that way.
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:19 PM   #2580
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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yesssir. 9 handed all day errrryday.

It's glorious
Really? I'd much rather play ten handed if for no other reason than one to two are always walking. Did they fix the third man walking rule to allow five minute breaks?

I think most players feel the same about 9 vs 10 or every room would play nine handed. Nine handed is a much better deal for the room since less players per table, equals more tables, equals more raked hands, equals more profit for the room. I hope nine handed tables don't catch on everywhere if Parx is able to make it a successful transition. A slam dunk profit decision for every poker room manager. If I were managing a room and could get away with it, I'd do it too.
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:40 PM   #2581
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Maybe starting out with 9 handed tables 2 or 3 players won't feel the need to be constantly walking around as much as opposed to 10 handed tables.

After the play a hand walkers come back to a broken table a couple of times, maybe they will stay in their seats if somebody else is already on the aimless stroll.

That way you will be playing primarily 8 handed at a 9 seat table, instead of 7 handed at a 10 seat table.
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Old 12-27-2010, 02:11 PM   #2582
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Maybe starting out with 9 handed tables 2 or 3 players won't feel the need to be constantly walking around as much as opposed to 10 handed tables.

After the play a hand walkers come back to a broken table a couple of times, maybe they will stay in their seats if somebody else is already on the aimless stroll.

That way you will be playing primarily 8 handed at a 9 seat table, instead of 7 handed at a 10 seat table.
You may be right. But, again what I worry about is every manager at every room going to nine handed games. More rake for the room when they have open tables to spread more games.
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Old 12-27-2010, 02:32 PM   #2583
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Apparently you fellows just started reading this thread and neglected to use the search feature 2+2 has placed at the top of the screen?

The 9 v. 10 handed issue was discussed, at length, 10 or so pages ago.Search is your friend.

- The Caddie Grinch
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:04 PM   #2584
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by JohnCash View Post
In a healthy poker economy, casual players enter a 4/8 game with their 200 or 300.

They might get lucky, they might win, they might lose a little. It feeds the better players, who then are able to move up. This feeds the 8/16, which in turn feeds the 10/20 game.

Casual players are going to enter the lowest limit no matter what. If a room offers unbeatable 2/4, the rake black hole, then they play that. They don't win. The regular players of 2/4 don't win. No one moves up. 4/8 feeds on itself and dies. 8/16 never runs. 10/20 has a slowly shrinking pool of regs, and 2/4 continues to suck all the money.

All the limit games die, until instead of some 4/8 games, a 8/16, and a healthy 10/20 game -- all you end up with a single 2/4 game filled with losing regs that a occasional casual player enters because there is nothing else, and a 10/20 game that hardly ever runs.
Thanks for elaborating more on this. And after reading this and some of the other posts, I now have a better understanding on why 2/4 games strangle the other limit games.

I don't ever play 2/4 but would occasionally sit at a 4/8 waiting for a more appealing game to open. I would never be for a game that tends hurt others, and I certainly don't wanna see the 4/8 or 8/16 disappear.

The fact that the Borgata runs multiple 2/4 games but has a limit hole before the 10/20 and the talk about Delaware Park phasing out 4/8 limit in favor of 2/4 is rather sad.

I wouldn't want to see this happen to Parx.
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:42 PM   #2585
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Anyone know how many / what games are running at Parx now (post snow-in)?
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:44 PM   #2586
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by zorked View Post
Anyone know how many / what games are running at Parx now (post snow-in)?
http://i.parxcasino.com/gamereport.php
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:47 PM   #2587
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by zorked View Post
Anyone know how many / what games are running at Parx now (post snow-in)?
poker section of the parx casino website has a continuous live game report that seems pretty accurate. as of right now, it says five 1/2 NL and three 2/5 NL tables.
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:50 PM   #2588
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by JONATHANM View Post
Apparently you fellows just started reading this thread and neglected to use the search feature 2+2 has placed at the top of the screen?

The 9 v. 10 handed issue was discussed, at length, 10 or so pages ago.Search is your friend.

- The Caddie Grinch
I read this thread most days and play at Parx once in a while. What I must have missed is if the third man walking rule was fixed yet, because I still don't know. Since it's all over this thread, maybe you can direct me. They didn't start playing nine handed until 12/22 (page 165 and an entire week ago) so it's not like it's all old news except to you. Why discuss/ask anything? It's all been said and asked somewhwere. Why so condescending? It's not like everything you write is so new.
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Old 12-27-2010, 04:12 PM   #2589
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JONATHANM View Post
Stop trying to juice pots for cryin' out loud, you degen, action junkie gambooolers!!

Forgive me if I offend any one , but when it comes down to it , I really could care less anyway (no offense ). I'm a laid back fellow by nature. Live poker is a perfect match for my disposition. A session of live poker is a long, arduous test of patience. I do not consider poker an "action" game. Craps is an "action" game.

Maybe you action junkie gamblers should consider craps to fulfill your insatiable appetite for said action, and let the card players play cards. Or just stay home and 20 table online while texting and playing your kiddie video games and talking to your girlfriend and eating your drive-thru big mac and blah blah blah. Do whatever you people that can't hold their attention for more than 2 seconds do. Just please stop trying to impose your action fever on card players. Find other gambling action junkies and start a " put $1 in for this, $1 in for that ,$6 in for that and $5 in if your male, $2 if your female..." table.

Live poker is a tedious and boring game of patience, patience pays off in profit. You "moneymaker effect" 20 somethings and degen action junkie gambooolers need to stop trying to change it.You could always get your BR up and play w/ the big boys at 50/100+ if you need to be mesmerized by a huge pile of chips in the pot all the time.

That said....I think 2-10 stud, $2 BI,no ante, no time is a great game. What drives the action you ask? Poker players that know how to play stud. I see no problems making drop w/ a 2-10 spread. With the right players , you'll have $40-$60 pots more often than one would think imo. I ask that you seriously consider this stud format Ari. At least just give it a shot for a couple months, can't hurt. Maybe try a 10% up to $7-8 rake (if law will allow), this could offset the short drops., you know, with all the "nits" that will be playing .

...Sorry.. had to vent
Action pays off in profits as well. More so than the slow, patient, approach. It also increases variance, so buyer beware.

Poker, like everything else, evolves. Heck, the original rules called for only 2 rounds of betting and one drawing round (the original 5 card draw - check an 1840's Hoyle). No stud, no Omaha, no Hold 'em. Want to go back to that? I wouldn't.

Learn to adjust. Poker is more than just playing cards, as I've been slowly but surely learning. A lot more. True poker often ignores the cards. Yes, a good cardplayer can win at poker, but not nearly as much as a good poker player will. Action, gambooling, call it whatever you want to. But winning big pots means more long term profit than winning small pots.

Lee
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Old 12-27-2010, 05:20 PM   #2590
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by layemdown View Post
Why so condescending?
Sometimes I sound that way...sorry, I was grinching.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovesantiques View Post
1) Action pays off in profits as well. More so than the slow, patient, approach.

2) Learn to adjust.
1) True. Just tired of people saying/implying stud is a weak game full of nits and old people (mostly the moneymaker effect A.D.H.D. generation), and lacks action. " Add antes to juice it up and ill play ".....BS. A 2-10 spread stud game will provide plenty of action given a proper mix of players. Why would an action junkie care anyway? Just play something else. That's what NLHE and other games are for.

2) I do adjust. Point here is, stop trying to whine your way into getting what you want in a chips flying , pissing contest. Aggression is good, reckless is....well reckless.....and annoying imo. If there is going to be an action game , there's going to be an action game. If there isn't, there isn't, deal with it. Stud isn't NLHE , it's stud.
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Old 12-27-2010, 05:33 PM   #2591
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by highlite15 View Post

I prefer this one :

http://www.taeyeonkim.com/parx/timeline.php


King of Prussia in tha house!! Any low limit home games highlite?
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Old 12-27-2010, 05:44 PM   #2592
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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King of Prussia in tha house!!
Hey King of Prussia:
Whatever happened to the plans for a casino there?
And where exactly was it to be located?
Thanks.
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Old 12-27-2010, 05:53 PM   #2593
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Hey King of Prussia:
Whatever happened to the plans for a casino there?
And where exactly was it to be located?
Thanks.
It was supposed to be at the Valley Forge Convention Center. PA approved a license for there, but it's being challenged by Parx on the grounds that it will hurt Parx's business too much.
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Old 12-27-2010, 05:56 PM   #2594
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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It was supposed to be at the Valley Forge Convention Center. PA approved a license for there, but it's being challenged by Parx on the grounds that it will hurt Parx's business too much.
Is that in the building behind the old round Sheraton Valley Forge?
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Old 12-27-2010, 06:00 PM   #2595
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Is that in the building behind the old round Sheraton Valley Forge?
Yes. It's a rather outdated building that would need some serious renovation, IMO.
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Old 12-27-2010, 06:02 PM   #2596
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Originally Posted by Jim215 View Post
Hey King of Prussia:
Whatever happened to the plans for a casino there?
And where exactly was it to be located?
Thanks.

Last I heard (which was the 1st time I heard, a month ago or so), it is supposed to be at the valley forge convention center. They are in the middle of a battle w/ the locals similar to the battle the casino proposed in Limerick had w/ locals.

I'm not in KOP the OP i was replying to is.


[edit] the Parx thing i didnt hear. I could be wrong w/ the locals thing.
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Old 12-27-2010, 06:16 PM   #2597
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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Then go play the nickel slots.
I wouldn't play 2/4 or the slots with your money.My point was ....well you just made it.
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Old 12-27-2010, 08:57 PM   #2598
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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It was supposed to be at the Valley Forge Convention Center. PA approved a license for there, but it's being challenged by Parx on the grounds that it will hurt Parx's business too much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONATHANM View Post
They are in the middle of a battle w/ the locals similar to the battle the casino proposed in Limerick had w/ locals.

The "Parx challenge" versions is new. The version I heard first, WAYYYYYYY back when they first were approved for their license and didn't exercise it, was that:

a) they were waiting for table game approval

b) they wanted to apply for table game approval

c) they were hoping the whole 'boutique' license designation could be changed (as, I thought I remember rumor'ing, the requirements were that only hotel guests could play there).

I think I remember some noise about local opposition, mostly around presumed traffic problems (which would have been valid complaints- it's pretty bad there now during rush hours).
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Old 12-27-2010, 11:00 PM   #2599
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

Legislator wants to postpone casino license
Gaming Control Board to get at least two new members by mid-January
Sunday, December 26, 2010
By Tom Barnes, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
HARRISBURG -- Four competitors, including Nemacolin Woodlands and a convention center near Gettysburg, hope to learn Jan. 6 whether they have won a lucrative license that will let them add slot machines and table games.

But the gaming contestants may have to wait a lot longer if one legislator gets his way.

Rep. Curt Schroder, R-Montgomery, who has criticized the seven-member Gaming Control Board in the past, thinks the regulators should put off their upcoming decision on who gets the state's second (and final) resort casino license, because at least two new members may join the board by mid-January.

Mr. Schroder wrote to gaming board Chairman Greg Fajt, asking for a delay on the license until "after the new legislative appointments are made."

An award made by officials who are " 'on the way out the door,' and left entirely to the subsequent appointees to implement, does not serve the public interest," he said.

Mr. Schroder's request carries clout because Republicans won control of the House in November. The GOP already controls the Senate and the next governor, Tom Corbett, is a Republican.

However, some people fear that deferring the license decision could delay construction of the new resort casino for months. That would delay the influx of funds for property tax reduction and the 1,000 or so new jobs that a casino would bring.

Nemacolin, in Fayette County, and the proposed Mason-Dixon casino near Gettysburg are competing against a resort in the Poconos in northeast Pennsylvania and a Holiday Inn west of Harrisburg.

Gaming board members Ken McCabe and Jeff Coy have served since the board was created by law in 2004. Their terms end Jan. 18, and since they've served the maximum six years, they can't be reappointed. But they will continue on the board until their legislative sponsor selects a replacement. It's not clear if that will happen by Jan. 18.

Two other board members also have terms expiring then, but they could be reappointed because they haven't served the maximum. Raymond Angeli, president of Lackawanna College in Scranton, was chosen by former Senate Democratic leader Bob Mellow; Gary Sojka, former president of Bucknell University in Lewisburg, was chosen by House Republican leader (and new speaker) Sam Smith.

The new Senate Democratic leader, Jay Costa of Forest Hills, will decide if Mr. Angeli stays or goes. Mr. Smith will decide on Mr. Sojka.

The other three board members, whose terms aren't up yet, were named by outgoing Gov. Ed Rendell. Chairman Fajt of Mt. Lebanon is a lawyer and former Rendell aide; the others are Philadelphia attorney Ken Trujillo and James Ginty, a businessman/lawyer from Philadelphia. Mr. Fajt's term is up in July.

Doug Harbach, a gaming board spokesman, said the board had hoped to make a decision by "early 2011" but couldn't say if it will come at the Jan. 6 meeting. Jeff Nobers, a Nemacolin spokesman, said he hopes the license will be awarded Jan. 6. David LaTorre, a spokesman for Mason-Dixon, said, "Our focus continues to be on Jan. 6."

Even if the license is awarded at that time, however, construction of the new gambling hall could still be delayed -- perhaps for months -- if one or more of the losers goes to court.

The first resort casino license was awarded over a year ago to the Valley Forge Convention Center, west of Philadelphia, but nothing has been built yet because of a lawsuit filed by Parx Casino, located not too far away in Bucks County.

The award of the second resort casino license has become a pitched battle. The Nemacolin resort, which is owned by influential businessman/politician Joe Hardy, founder of 84 Lumber, already has a number of hotel and recreational attractions and would like to add gambling. The Nemacolin casino would be located in what is now the Wild Side, a family entertainment arcade.

However, officials at The Meadows racetrack/casino in Washington County, about 60 miles away, have voiced objections, fearing a Nemacolin casino might take away its customers.

And the idea of putting a casino just south of the Gettysburg battlefield has generated great controversy, with many Civil War advocates and historians claiming that putting a gambling palace so close to "hallowed ground" would besmirch the famous Civil War site.

But backers have mounted a counterattack, saying Adams County needs the jobs that a casino would bring and new revenue to stop future property tax increases in the home township and county.

Mr. LaTorre claims the state's geography favors an Adams County casino, because Eastern Pennsylvania already has six casinos, including a new one in Philadelphia. There's also another stand-alone casino license reserved for Philadelphia, plus the resort casino that's planned for Valley Forge, if the lawsuit is settled.

Western Pennsylvania has three casinos -- The Meadows, The Rivers in Pittsburgh and Presque Isle Downs in Erie -- with another racetrack/casino proposed for Lawrence County. And northern West Virginia has two casinos just over the Pennsylvania border.

By contrast, Central Pennsylvania has only one casino, the Penn National racetrack/casino 20 miles east of Harrisburg.

The proposed casino near Gettysburg would be run by Penn National, which operates numerous casinos around the country as well as the one near Harrisburg. Mason-Dixon officials have raised questions about the finances of the company that Nemacolin has picked to run its casino, Missouri-based Isle of Capri Casinos.

Mr. LaTorre questions whether Isle can come up with the $175 million that it would need to build both the Nemacolin casino (at $50 million) and a $125 million casino planned for Cape Girardeau, Mo. He said statements that an Isle official made to the gaming board in November indicate financing problems, but Isle officials dispute that.

Mr. LaTorre said, "It appears the Nemacolin/Isle financing plan relies on cushions and precise timing from cash flow they don't own and from a casino they haven't built."

In comparison, he asserted, Mason-Dixon's financing plan "is fully funded ... with existing cash on Penn National's strong balance sheet from day one."

But Tom Hickey, an Isle of Capri spokesman, and Mr. Nobers, the Nemacolin spokesman, reply that Isle will have the cash on hand and the borrowing ability to do both projects. They said Isle of Capri already has resources from 15 existing casinos and has adequate credit.

The gaming board is certain to scrutinize all four bidders, because in 2006 it gave a casino license to a Philadelphia group called Foxwoods, which wasted four years in an unsuccessful search for financing and has now had its license revoked. That has caused embarrassment to the board.

Tom Barnes: tbarnes@post-gazette.com or 717-787-4254.


First published on December 26, 2010 at 12:00 am


Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10360/1113413-454.stm
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:13 AM   #2600
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Re: PARX Poker Thread

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By Tom Barnes, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
BAH! What would a west-sider know about a VF location, except what he's heard second- and third-hand?!?

The best scuttlebutt is always local!
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