The Oaks is rather more than a century old; it makes sense that it uses old rules.

Bay 101 and M8trix in San Jose also don't follow the half-bet rule (only complete or call). I wonder if this is a northern California rule?

Oaks also has a house rule that (I think) prevents new players from posting in between a kill and the button if the kill would otherwise be a blind.

New players no longer have to post to get their first hand at the Oaks. You're thinking about the situation where a player has missed his big blind and now he wants to "buy the button" by posting both his big blind and his small blind at the same time.

If someone has the kill in Omaha (which is the only game I know of at the Oaks that uses a kill button) and if that player is in either one of the blind positions, then the player who missed his big blind cannot buy the button.

Why not? Because it's advantageous to post the kill from one of the blind positions. I was going to have to post a blind this hand anyway; now I have an Econo-Kill—a kill that costs me only one or two additional chips. If your buying the button takes away my Econo-Kill, that harms me. So the Oaks won't let you do it; instead, you have to wait until the next hand and post both blinds that you missed from one position behind the button rather than one position in front of it.

This situation does not come up often, and not all dealers and floor supervisors know what the rule is off the top of their head. But the Oaks rule book has 2 pages of Omaha-specific rules, and it's in there.

Any chance we can get management to run a 5-5-10 (or equivalent) on select days? I've been asking here and there and it seems there's a large list of interested players, but there's also a fear that running the bigger game will kill the 2-3-5.

I heard the fear stems from this happening to the 30-60 when they temporarily replaced it with the 40-80.

I think this is a bit odd however, as the player pool for 2-3-5 is much larger, and in this case they wouldnt be replacing 2-3-5 with 5-10, but rather offering it in conjunction.

I've been playing at the oaks frequently but the lack of higher stake nl games is a bit of a bummer. Hopefully we can get something going. I also feel like a bigger game is inevitable, as inflation/rake/wages increase.

They may need city approval for a game that big.

The 30-60/40-80 thing is a red herring. That is one game with a smallish set of regular players. The player pool for NL is rather larger these days.

You say you have been asking. Have you asked John Tibbetts, the owner? What does he say?

As of 22 January, the Oaks has been offering $1 (on the button) - $2 - $3 No-Limit Texas-Style(*) Hold'em. $100 minimum, $500 maximum buy-in. Drop in a full game is $5+$1 (just like in the 2-3-5). I didn't look closely to see what the drop is for short games, but I would guess it is the same as for the larger game.

Concurrently the minimum buy-in in the 2-3-5 game has been raised from $100 to $200.

The 1-1-2 has the same structure as ever.

I was in the club tonight (Thursday, 30 January), and they had at least two tables each of all three games going. I spent most of the evening in a 1-2-3 game that started shortly after I arrived. The games went strong, and the players were weak.

This is good news especially for the players for whom the 1-1-2 is just a bit small but who find the 2-3-5 game tough to play when the winner straddle is on and the game becomes effectively a 5-10 game.

The increased minimum buy-in for the 2-3-5 game is also good news, because it makes the problem of shortstackers rather less drastic. With 40bb they actually have to play two or more streets.


(*) Does anyone else miss Boomer?

When will the oaks reopen??

>>>(*) Does anyone else miss Boomer?

Did Nate pass away? I hope not. Boomer is a friendly guy, and I like him.

I don't play at Oaks often these days, but in the 90s I was a regular at the 6/12 hold em game.

Does anybody know if Doc is still with us? He was a regular player, a friend and fellow Deadhead. Guessing he'd be around 70 by now. I heard he was ill about a year or 2 ago. Haven't been in touch.

Hoping for good news about Doc and Boomer.

I rather think that this will be up to the Alameda County Public Health Department, which shows no sign of lifting the shelter-in-place order any time soon. (Yes, I know about their social bubble advice.)

I don't know anything about Boomer's health, all I know is that he hasn't been in evidence in the year and a half before covid that I had returned to playing at the Oaks.

I haven't seen Doc in that time, either. I have heard nothing about his status.

Do you know DMS? He might be from after your time, a tough reg at the top LHE and lowball levels, and (so far as I can tell) a decent, likeable guy. He is coping with apparently terminal cancer, although the last I saw (early in the year, before covid) he looked at least tolerably healthy.

Mods, apologies if I am skirting the no-names rules.

I may know DMS by face, like many poker players who I may recognize but not know their name. It is also possible that you and I would recognize each other at a poker table if we had played together in the past. I'm not planning on going to a live poker room for a while, but eventually I always find myself back at The Oaks.

Presumably, when Gov. Newsom allows it.

Hoping Oaks will open soon. i'm sick of getting eaten up by the rake at Graton.

La county is talking about end of September to reopen card rooms. Hopefully the Bay Area counties don’t override the state guidelines on poker.

I’ve only played oaks one time, and live in Marin now. I thought drop all around the Bay Area is the same.

PokerAtlas says that the drop in Graton's 2-5 NL game is $4/hand. It doesn't say whether or not there is a jackpot drop as well.

The Oaks' 2-3-5 game has/had a drop of $5+$1. If Graton has a $1 jackpot drop, then they are in fact cheaper than the Oaks. If they have a $2 jackpot drop, then the two are esentially the same.

(I will duck the question of whether dollar for dollar a jackpot/promotion drop is better for players than a pure rake.)

Pretty sure that’s outdated. When I was the over the weekend NL games were 1-1-3 and 2-3-5. Dealers were pulling $5 for the rake and mentioned promo drop too.

What is the drop then in CA? Didn't know it was standardized

Confirmed it's 4+1 on flop. Another promo $1 on river.

It's not standardized statewide. Individual cities may or may not have standards. Also, Graton is an Indian casino and might have different standards than CA cardrooms.

I hear the Oaks is open! What's the story? 8 handed with plexiglass?

I went to the Oaks yesterday (Friday) afternoon and played for some five hours. I played mostly $1-$2-$3 NLHE, although while waiting for my seat in that game I played a few hands of 6-12 limit holdem.

Games are eight-handed, with plexiglass barriers between players. Masks covering the nose and mouth are required for everyone in the club. Neither eating nor drinking is allowed at the table, although players can bring food into the restaurant area to eat there. The Oaks Corner hofbrau is closed.

Players coming in through the main entrance are required to pass a contact-free temperature test before entering.

The club is operating at 25% capacity, per Alameda County restrictions on indoor commercial activity, so before going there I estimated that they had capacity for some 75 players at a time, or 8 tables. While I was there I was aware of six tables in use, and plenty of players waiting for seats as the day wore on.

Games going were 3-6 and 6-12 limit holdem and 1-2-3 ($100 to $500 buy-in) and 2-3-5 ($200 to $1000 buy-in) no-limit holdem. The Oaks' website claims they also spread 6-12 (w/kill to 8-16) Omaha/8 and higher-stakes limit holdem, but I saw no evidence, and I think they would have been hard-pressed to open a table.

Gameplay is 24/7. At peak hours, I would expect that wait times for seats are going to be quite long. Fortunately, you now can sign up for lists by phone or through the website.

Thank you for the update!

I spoke to the weekday afternoon shift manager at the Oaks, currently running at 25% capacity, about what he thought things would look like after Tuesday, 6/15, when California is largely dropping its covid restrictions.

He said that he thought a few more tables would be open, but they really didn't know what they would be able to do, and wouldn't until Thursday, when, supposedly, Cal-OSHA is releasing employee safety guidelines.

Will be visiting this week.. how are the waits on a wed night? Can we call in? Will be playing the 2/3/5.. does that play between a 2/5 and 5/10? Will have a few buyins with me.

Evening waits have been long. I recommend calling in at least an hour before you expect to get there. Call-ins get two hours grace period before they are dropped from the list. Check in with the brush at the board when you get there.

2-3-5 is essentially the same as 2-5, with the extra blind boosting the pot a little bit (except that with the $5+$1 drop, that boost is taken away again if you see a flop).

BUT

Straddling to $10 is allowed from any position, including the button and either blind. UTG as first preference for straddling, with priority going down moving clockwise around the table, with the small blind having last priority. Preflop action begins to the left of the straddle, and the straddler gets to act after everyone else (but before raises get fully resolved).

Often the players agree to a "winner straddle," where the winner of the pot, even if it is just taking the blinds down, straddles the next hand. This effectively makes the game 2-3-5-10, with the added wrinkle that the $10 blind is in a random position relative to the button. This can call for adjustments to strategy that are less than obvious. It is equivalent to playing the game with a "rock."

Good luck to you!

Since California and Alameda County appear to be removing capacity restrictions tomorrow, they'll probably be able to increase the number of tables. This could also increase the demand, so it's hard to tell how it would affect wait times.