Since everyone else has a BBJ, it could be a competitive advantage to not have one. I prefer high hand jackpots, or aces cracked, or progressive royal flush jackpots, stuff like that. Something easier to hit so that it gets hit more frequently and is therefore more likely to keep that money in the poker economy.

Good stuff Mat! 2 years ago, I played in a Florida room where they had individual progressive hands. Each quad hand, royal flush, 4 diff combinations of str8 flush, all had a progressive jackpot. Not sure how they started the fund, but most of the hands prize pot were over $3000 each.... I think a royal was worth over $8000, quad 8's were $5000.... 2222 was low, like 1500.... Each day each hand would grow until hit. Not sure what the reset was but it was good promotion. Pretty sure they had some high hand sessions as well. I liked it.

All you need is a little upgrade in chairs, tables, tvs etc. the games were always the best at rockingham. The food/health is whatever. Personally I think it's lol to have treadmills there. No serious fitness person is gonna do there working out there and the slobs aren't either. Same with a "diet" plan. People aren't going to a poker room for that. I'm all for healthy options and always left the rock to go out the few months I played there basically full time.

Bottom line you are gonna do okay because you are the closest room for many people. are there full time pros in NH? Well I never felt outmatched at 2/5 once in my time there and found the majority of players very poor. There are a handful of solid regs and a few that maybe we're "pros". Sometimes the games got to boring with the same ten players playing and just pushing money back and forth and there aren't many massive fish. But like I said I never felt outmatched at the tables there (not saying I was the best just I was never put in spots i couldn't handle.

Tw/tr I found at 2/5 there were times I knew I as clearly outmatched. I partly attritube that to there being a bigger game in the room 5/10.

As far as bad beat I saw a large chunk of the Rec players follow the bad beat around and leave rock when other bun got big. The average folk wants that big win possible and I think they actually might like talking about it more

Hey Puck, Looking forward to a room opening in the Salem area to replace the Rock which was the dirtiest most disgusting room I have ever had the displeasure of playing in. I will surely be there as soon as you open.

I appreciate your attempt at forward thinking but as I'm sure you know in business the best solution for success is to keep it simple and give the masses what they desire... sometimes developers get caught up doing a project the way THEY like and not the way that the majority of your demographic wants things... this is a sure fire recipe for disaster and I implore you to give your demographic what they want NOT what you want or envision. Don't force on them what you want them to be or attempt to turn them into something they are not and will NEVER be.

In regard to the exercise and food ideas you have. I agree with the input from the others predicting that exercise equipment will become glorified coat racks. I don't see myself spending much time in a room when I have to sit next to a dude who has just banged out a sweaty 3 mile jaunt on the treadmill... most of these curmudgeons smell before they come to the poker room I can't imagine their stank after they take a jog... and they will never shower afterwards as I'm sure that many of them shower less than once a week and you aren't changing their grooming habits anytime soon. Even if you could get them to work out and shower it would be counter productive to your room as you'd have a stack of his chips on the table and an empty seat for an hour or so while said player was working out/showering, it just makes zero sense. I'm not sure if you have seen the type of life degens that regularly frequent the NH charity rooms but I'm willing to bet my stack that almost all of them do not exercise, do not care about a healthy lifestyle, and only are going to ingest into their body things that taste good and by saying "things that taste good" I'm talking about things that are not necessarily nutritionally sound but rather things that entertain the taste buds.

It seems to me in reading between the lines in your posts regarding your menu/kitchen facility that its more about money and completing your build out as cheaply as possible than it is about giving people what they want. It's obvious that there will be no fryolators or grille because you don't want to spend the money on the infrastructure that is needed for those things. I'm aware of the cost associated with an ansel/hood systems in a build out but if you want to be the "premier NH poker room" as you stated then these expenses and items are a necessary evil to give your customers what they want, especially a grille which in my eyes is just as or more important than a fryolator. I was surprised at the no grille decision as if you are concerned about healthy-good food then a grille is a must have item... I'm referring to a char-grill not a flat top. It seems to me that you are going to have a salad/sandwich unit as the major part of your kitchen to achieve your goal of spending as little as possible in your build while selling it as "we are going to be 100% healthy." I totally get trying to save greenbacks in your build out but IMHO this line of thinking in this area would be a huge miscalculation and would hurt your business/customers experience.

To me the things that you need to be focusing on that almost all of your customers would appreciate is:

Automatic shufflers to speed the game up
USB/charging ports at every table/seat
Good quality comfortable chairs
Built in cup holders (they are also great for squaring up players at the table)
Lots of quality TV's that are strategically placed throughout the room
A fast strong wifi signal
Quality dealers
A well lit and safe parking lot
A well stocked bar with decent prices
Tasty food (see above )
Some type of comp/reward/frequent player system to reward your regulars

To me these things are far more important than exercise equipment and a limited menu in trying to make your room the "premiere NH poker room". I hope this post wasn't too long winded but I am rooting for your room to be a raging success and felt compelled to throw in my two cents. Good luck and hope to be giving you business soon.

+1, Great Post.

Like any business, it might cost a lot more to provide these things, but they'll pay for themselves. If you take the cost of the treadmills and focus on the poker playing experience, it's a much better use of start up funds IMO. Your #1 goal is to get people in the door, stay, and play/generate as much take as possible. A treadmill is NEVER getting me through the door, In fact, it might deter me (see smelly player comments above). If the place really thrives, you could consider some sort of health angle as a 1-off or supplement to the poker business. But the ability to get more hands in per hour, be comfortable, charge my phone, get drunk and eat good food will make me come back 10x as often.

It seems to me in reading between the lines in your posts regarding your menu/kitchen facility that its more about money and completing your build out as cheaply as possible....

This is a grossly bad read..... We are high end proven developers and builders, we NEVER do cheap build outs ....

We will be considering everything including solid input found here. I like the grill idea; but to be dead honest.... We been 99% focused on the poker aspect, from a Players aspect. The food and other items are ideas which are not really my highest priority. And trust me, food is a very high priority in my life.

I love the Borgata room, but think the TV viewing is awful there. Solid TV and sports are very high on the list to get perfect

Here's my list:

1. Dealers keep their own tips

2. No BBJ. The rake is high enough as it is.

3. Workout machines w/o showers is a non-starter.

4. Good food. Doesn't matter what, as long as it's quality grub.

5. A PLO game where it's not a high/high-lo rotation. If the old guys want to play PLO8, make it a dedicated game. Those crusty old nits scare aware the gamblers that want to play PLO. I can't tell you how many times a new face sits down at the Rock and realizes it's half high-lo and goes back to hold'em.

6. Straddles are 5 and 10 not 4 and 8, wtf hampton.

7. Dealers that run the game, instead of staring off into space while the guy who's turn it is has no idea we're waiting on him.

[QUOTE=MontyBurns;50392796]Here's my list:

1. Dealers keep their own tips. Like


2. No BBJ. The rake is high enough as it is. Up for debate

3. Workout machines w/o showers is a non-starter. Agree

4. Good food. Doesn't matter what, as long as it's quality grub. Agree

5. A PLO game where it's not a high/high-lo rotation. If the old guys want to play PLO8, make it a dedicated game. Those crusty old nits scare aware the gamblers that want to play PLO. I can't tell you how many times a new face sits down at the Rock and realizes it's half high-lo and goes back to hold'em.

This is very odd. I love O8, but PLO and hi-lo is gross. Not sure why they do this

6. Straddles are 5 and 10 not 4 and 8, wtf hampton. Agree

7. Dealers that run the game, instead of staring off into space while the guy who's turn it is has no idea we're waiting on...... Agree

I haven't set foot in NH in years, so this info might be obsolete...but when I did, the tab!e games max bet was so small, a TG dealer couldn't possibly live on his toke box. Pooling with poker dealers was a necessary subsidy to retain skilled TG dealers (and why this poker dealer quickly fled NH).

Again, I have no clue what today's environment is.

Your infinity is obsolete. NL arrived over a year ago

It's sad that with all the information in my long winded post that this is all you absorbed... If you don't think that any of the items I listed at the end should be a top priority then I'm afraid your room is destined to become just another "also ran" in the world of charity card rooms. Sorry to have stuck my nose in trying to give you ways to separate your room from the pack and maximize your customers experience. I wish you the best of luck and hope you make the right decisions as I'd love a top notch card room in the area. Cheers

ATM, your killing me. I liked most all of your information at the end, it just makes me shake my head when you make such large assumptions of cheapening up the build-out, and now "destined to become just another also ran".......

.....because I'm not a fan of a fryolator, french fries and chicken fingers? even though I eat them

As a poker player I travel all over the country playing in all the rooms, and as a developer, I've built more than 20 food, bakery and bar businesses..

....... as I stated, almost all of our time "in" the building has been spent formulating the poker room and a minority of time on the other stuff.

I keep saying I like the Borgata room......... that's what you need to envision I'm planning, except with better TV's. The food stuff will take care of itself as well as other incidental items....

Great tables, cup holders, auto shufflers, phone charging ports..... is that part clear ?

What does poker adopting NL have to do with TG dealers getting tipped very little due to the betting caps on those games?

** last July the state adopted no limit.

There are no betting limits in the 1/2 and 2/4 game.

the main table in the 2/4 game and on the weekends in the second 2/4 game, play deeper than 5/10 at Foxwoods....

Ok it's clear you missed his entire point. Table game dealers make garbage for tips due to the low max bet, so it's necessary to pool them with poker dealers or else you'll never retain good TG dealers. That's what he was saying.

Yup,,,, missed the TG part. That could be figured out. The TG people at casinos don't pool with poker dealers, I'm sure we can work it out

Puck you're also killing me... jk Please re-read what I wrote... I did't say that your room was going to be an "also ran". What I said was that if you didn't prioritize any of the points that I made then you'd be no different than whats already out there which would make you the same as all the others aka: "also ran". . I said this because these are things that are lacking in the other NH poker rooms and your posts before I responded were all about treadmills and nutritionists. I was only trying to help by giving you some ideas that seemed to make other card rooms that I've visited around the country more enjoyable.

Im not a fryolator fan either but most are and as I said before: Don't worry about what you like, be concerned with what the majority of your customers will want.

Building 20 commercialbuildins has no bearing on whether you or not you have the knowledge, experience, and skill to run a successful card room. Running a business successfully is a different animal from the actual pounding of nails to get it constructed. I'm not saying you can't conquer it but just saying its two totally separate skill sets

I actually thought these items would make your room "pop!!!":
Automatic shufflers
USB/charging ports
Good quality chairs
Built in cup holders
Lots of TV's
A fast strong wifi signal
Quality dealers
A well lit and safe parking lot
A well stocked bar with decent prices
Tasty food
Some type of comp/reward/frequent player system to reward your regulars


Bottom line you are going to do things how you see fit so I'll stop giving advice. I was just trying to offer some free common sense advice from my experience to help make your room successful and more enjoyable when I visited

Also fyi: Not sure how long its been since you've been to a NH card room but the 2/4 NL games now have a capped buy in so they no longer run deeper than a 5/10 NL game at Foxwoods. You may have been right when they first starting spreading NL in NH but thats no longer the case. I'd say 2/4 NL in Nh runs like 2/5 in Foxwoods.

All that being said I still am wishing you the best and hope you make the right decisions to make your room stand out from the rest... you seem to have a great opportunity to build something fantastic here.

I'm with ya, and hear you...

Im at NH room every week..... As well as Foxwoods.....

Puckster, if you can speak about it, where will this room be located? I know you said Salem, NH, but can you give an exact or approximate location?

Puckster, wish you all the best and I will def be checking out your room when it opens.

I can't at this time.... Slowly visiting abbuters and reviewing our plans as part of the permitting cycle..... not good when your neighbors find out about it by reading about it in the paper. People always appreciate it when you touch base with them in person; even those that could be opposed.

So far, all positive feedback, no issues ...

Thank you, our goal is to earn our players patronage; nothing is a given.

Good points from Mr ATM and Monty.

I also care about:
-Direct lighting above each table (its pretty bad when you don't know if you have the 4 of spades or the 4 of clubs)
-PLO games should be 9 max, and no bad beat rake/jackpot. Leave that for the holdem or limit players if you must, and with NLHE, restrict it to 1/2 games.
-Raising buy-in limits for PLO would also be huge plus (yes, it might take an act of congress, but PLO 1/2 limits should equate to NLHE 2/4, PLO 2/4 should be increased, but lets start with 1/2). Then, there will be more demand for PLO, and PLO high only. Or better yet, get a 2/2/5 (bring-in) with a $500 buy-in.

I don't care about exercise equipment, since I am not staying overnight.

sorry to announce: The exercise idea was dealt the death blow by the Board of Health today.....

the kitchen was approved for a grill and the operating staff have won a char grilling style cooking unit.

As far as lighting goes..... I think Mohegan sun has the best lighting of all... looks like halogen lights hitting right on the table... I love it and the electrical engineer has been given the task of premium lighting (helps I can't see cards, so lighting is important for me...

Details behind BoH shooting it down? Why would they be against it?