Lol what an odd line of reasoning.

Move down from 1-2 to what?

That's a fair point. But I'm talking about 2/5-5/10 & given the context of your previous posts that you've not seen much straddling or double straddling then that would make sense, if you play 1/2 maybe it doesn't happen there, I don't know.

If you're playing 2/5+ and refuse to straddle when the whole table is, incl the whale whos enjoying the action, then you're ruining the game. It's not very hard to understand why. You're also essentially freerolling everyone else at the table who is willing to straddle and make the game more fun, then people stop putting a straddle on when other people refuse to do it. It's not as though a straddle is on all night making it much more uncomfortable, it might be a few rounds here and there to add an element of action and make it abit fun, and if you willingly don't participate then you're bad for the game imo.

I'm coming at this from a 1/2 player perspective and I'm beginning to understand your argument but it still seems quite subjective (more from the point of view of a player who plays 2/5 or 5/10 but who's bankrolled to play larger if they want). I remember turning up to play 1/2 at The Empire a few years back and there were about 4 players at the table straddling £5 every hand. I got put on that table and was "that guy" who refused to straddle. One player in particular (clearly the Alpha male who instigated the whole thing) tried to make me feel bad about this and my argument was (a) that I had turned up to play 1/2 and (b) they could turn the game into a 2/5 game if they wanted and I'd go away.

Still, if I was over-rolled for a particular stake then I think I would see straddling as "a bit of fun" as well but for the average Joe Shmoe who earns less than or equal the average wage and has little savings, it would be a bad decision to suddenly start playing in a game they are under-rolled for and foolish to do this for the benefit of "a bit of fun". In saying that, could you not put the non-straddling player on scared money and simply raise the **** out of them in relentless fashion?

I understand what you're saying and actually, I think at 1/2 it should remain as you say with no straddles unless it's the highest game in the room, and higher stakes players are playing it, for exactly the reasons you're alluding to and there's nothing else to play and they want to be playing higher. I played 1/3 at the vic recently and one evening it was playing higher than a 2/5 as it was straddled and was crazy action, and then another night it was the most nitty (coming from a nit lol) and when I tried to straddle nobody wanted to know. I don't really get the 1/3 stake, it's a deeper stacked 1/2 game when really it should be a 2/5. Very hit and miss. Should probably be removed and more 2/5's added.

Essentially lots of 1/2 players are beginners because there's no lower games and I can see them being put off playing if suddenly they are thrown into a much higher game than they anticipated. At 2/5+ this is not really the situation, its usually the highest or 2nd highest game with plenty of games lower, if a player comes to 2/5, they know full well that it's a more aggressive and higher stakes game so should really expect some more action. In a deep stacked 2/5 there's not much difference to a slightly shallower 5/10 game. The whales at mid stakes are quite well off, straddling makes it fun and usually those playing 2/5 want to play a little higher its best to accommodate it and make it fun/gambly.

This is coming from someone who plays maybe 1-2 times a week at best, plays more abroad than here in London, but has been playing a decent amount live in london recently and have been playing for nearly 20 years, I'm by no means some super reg who is there daily nor do I want to be, but I want to play mid-higher stakes and when there's fish who want to gamble - thats the reason I'm in the game anyway, so it has to be fun (and in their mind fun is gambol).

So I'm a cash game player but I've been looking into doing a tourney this Sunday for a bit of a change. It's a toss-up between The Eltham Terrace Club £110 buy-in or the Hipopodrome one at £175. (https://pokerdiscover.com/clubs/unit...on-tournaments)

The Eltham one is 27K "potential" starting stack with a 25min clock. (Whatever "potential" means here.) And the Hippo is a 10k starting stack at 15 min levels.

Of course, Eltham looks like a slower structure and much better value than the fast looking one at Hippo but I don't know if it's just that the blinds go up in exponentially larger amounts at Eltham. Has anyone done the Eltham one and can give me advice? And what does "potential" mean regarding starting stacks.

Thanks for any potential responses :-)

Screw it. Gonna stick to me cash games anyway. Shoulda known that mentioning Eltham Terrace Club was just gonna create tumbleweed.

Ngl I've played in London since 2015 and I've never heard of Eltham Terrace.

I think it may be fairly new cos I hadn't heard of it until quite recently meself. They run super-cheap MTTs like £25, £30 and £50 ones and then up to £80, £110 and £150 buy-ins with an ok structure for the price. I've been twice and it kinda reminded me of the good ol' Gutshot days. As I recall, I can't actually remember if there was an entry fee but I guess there must be otherwise I dunno how they make their money.

They run 1/2 cash games as well - and they get absolutely insane! Stacks easily get up to the thousands so if you feel like playing super-deep 1/2 it might well be worth checking out. I've only seen two or three cash game tables running but I guess there are more as the night goes on. Don't know why it doesn't get mentioned here on this forum but there ya go.

If anyone out there wants to consider another poker club that's "under-the-radar" you could do a lot worse than type "Sam Clark Poker Kingsmen Poker Club London" into YouTube and get a look into another poker club that I'm sure most people here have never heard of either.

Thanks, that was interesting I might check them out next time when I'm around town next time. Based on google their chairs look kinda sh**y but apart from that prolly fine. These neighborhood kinda clubs are often the best, my theory is it is mainly because of they have less of these two. 1) pros, 2) scummy casino characters. Not sure what's the parking situation

OK, just learnt that that the Kingmen Club may not be the greatest recommendation after all. Been checking out a few of Charlie Carrel's videos and it seems he was "scammed" (his words) out of his £1700 winnings. If you watch the last 8 minutes of his "Turning $10K Into $100K - Live Poker Cash Game Vlog - Episode 2" video, he explains how.

Weird never heard of it. Talking of 'underground' poker clubs, I was at the vic recently and heard some people talking about the Regency or something, some private place where obviously they play quite high stakes given the amounts they were discussing (one 2/5 reg saying he won like 100k at plo456 there). I recall it being an old place like 10 years ago, didnt realize some of these places exist still.

There used to also be some place in Stanmore that had loads of games from 1.2 all the way to highstakes.

I also saw Jungleman post a instagram story of somewhere called The Penthouse or something. Must be loads of these small private clubs dotted around.

Sure, I'm coming around to that conclusion as well but after watching that Charlie Carrel video I don't think I could really trust any small private club that have virtually no internet presence. I mean, their excuse for not paying out was as dodgy AF. Also, if they're not really regulated then who's to say they're not riddled with dealers manipulating the deck and feeding aces to their mates or even if the management aren't behind it. Personally, I'm sticking with the legit casinos (and I know Eltham Terrace Club is legit as well).

Yeah I watched the CC vid and yeah **** that. Alot of these games are run by not so savoury characters and outing them like he did could lead to repercussions for him, depends who is behind it. Theres apparently a game in Hampstead and another Regents Park which is close to me and would be ideal but I've been burned a few times myself (likely cheating), so it's off putting.

I'll be going to Eltham tonight I think for their Friday tournament. It's a £50 buyin but with unlimited rebuys it's not unusual to see people firing 3/4/5 bullets. I'll take two, and report back.

I've been before and it's ok, I think people are right that it has a fairly old school kinda vibe. It's pretty chaotic, they'll get 100+ players spread over two floors most likely, but when I was there before it was well run.

The alternative was Aspers but that's an earlier start and when I've been before I got there and was greeted by an hour long wait to get into the tournament. I'd be sitting down with 15-20bb which isn't worth it in my view. It's as much a logistics issue as anything else, I just can't get there early enough for it to be worthwhile.

Hey all, I travel to London every ~2 months or so and would be interested in hopping in some live cash. From reading recent posts and checking PokerAtlas and Bravo, here’s what I’ve gathered.

Main rooms:

West
- Hippodrome
- Empire
- Victoria

East
-Aspers

All spread 1/2-2/5 typically(?)

Would appreciate if anyone can weigh in on the following:

- Money exchange: I have Euro and CAD, can I change at the cage to buy in? If so, how’s the rate?

- Atmosphere: favorite room/vibe? Would be nice to play with a Vegas feel (Aria/Wynn/Bel)

- Game consistency/availability: where’s most reliable to hop in a game any given day of the week?

- Rake structure: how bad is it? Any game that’s beatable or should I know I’m just playing for lulz/entertainment.

- Game quality: I’m weighing having a fun table/good time highly here. Don’t care if there are a lot of pros but I’d prefer a social/drinking table than one filled with fishy OMC types

Much appreciated!

Yes, 2/5 doesn't run 24/7 but most nights at Hippodrome and Vic. Sometimes at Empire and Aspers. If you are coming from US expect most 1/2 games to play bigger than most US 1/2 games, so potentially like 2/5 US game.

FX: Never seen a good money exchange rate at a casino but probs still better than you'll get at an average FX shop on the day. It's a long shot but often people are looking for zero vig Euros, e.g. for EPT Prague, so you could post here.

Atmosphere: Hippodrome can be fun place. Aspers pretty miserable. Vic(toria) more of a cardroom. Empire ok.

Consistency: Hippo and Vic has games running 24/7 I believe. Hippo and Empire are literally next to each other which is helpful if you are going at e.g. 2pm when there might be only a couple of games running and therefore a slow list.

Rake: 5% up to £10 I believe. Beatable + tips are not expected in almost any pots (bar very large ones)

Game quality: Real mixed bag and incredibly table dependent / random tbh.

I've no experience in London, but generally speaking changing money in a casino is a total fish move, they will rip you apart with the rate (there are some exceptions). Use ATMs (Check with your bank) if you can't do that google where you get the best rates for cash in town. The vic (maybe) has the most consistent game, but therefore also the most regs. Empire and Hippo have the advantage that they're practically next to each other. The games are def beatable

On Poker Atlas there are rooms also listed at St. Giles and Palm Beach in London...do those still run games? 1/2, 2/5 etc.

*Apologies for the TL;DR post but I got carried away.*

The Hippo and Empire combo absolutely crushes The Vic and/or Aspers so here are their main differences...

General Vibe

Empire - Home-game / workingman's club atmosphere set in the basement with a sometimes raucus and buzzy vibe (of the good kind) but with overly bright lighting. It can sometimes get too hot. Nine tables with easy access for players.

Hippo - More upmarket feel (it's sponsored by Poker Stars) with a classy black and red colour scheme and an old theatre vibe (which it was converted from). Very pleasant tiered balcony bar next to it. Tables are too compact though with two tables having the back of seats 4, 5 and 6 literally touching each other. Very annoying for players sitting at said seats. They should use that space for one table methinks as they do have two (albeit quiet) back rooms. It can also be a bit of a squeeze to get to seats at other tables and it can also get quite hot in the summer.

Players

Empire - You will generally see players with shorter stacks here and more casual inexperienced players. My theory is that they see the "Poker" sign outside and wander in for a casual £50 - £100 pop. There are some decent regs here but most are actually quite bad to plain terrible including the short-stacked and deep-stacked variety.

Hippo - Generally deeper stacked players who know of the place through Poker Stars. Again it's all general but players do seem slightly more knowledgable of the game. There is about a 6-10 strong group of Romanian regs who play here exclusively and who are half-decent. A few do make the tables fun but most are either glued to their phones or clearly just their to have zero fun and make money. There are lots of Asian players and South Asian players here with seemingly little grasp of the fundamentals.

Promos

Empire - This is where The Empire reigns supreme (but not always in a good way). For one they have the 56s promo where showing the winning hand with 56s will win you a "Rake-Free" card which (surprise surpise) gives you rake free poker. Just make sure the dealer is aware that you have it. However, there can only be one on the table so anyone else who wins it thereafter will take it off you. On the negative side they have the cash-race promo which only benefits the 50 regs who qualify for it. Here £1 is taken from every pot that is £20 or over and put aside as prize-money for those 50 regs; they play for this in a monthly tourny (every first Sunday of the month). Personally, I prefer taking the £1 for a bad-beat jackpot which (although unlikely) is at least good for ALL players.

Hippo - No promos.

Hands Per Hour

The Empire - The Empire have shuffling machines giving you an extra half a dozen or so hands per hour. This is the trade-off: Do you pay the extra £1 (for every £20+ pot) for a faster hand-rate or put up with less hands-per-hour paying no extra. Let's face it: I think I prefer paying that extra £3 or so per hour to get significantly more hands in.

Hippo - At The Hippo you're waiting for the dealer to do the ol' "Wash / riffle / riffle / box / riffle / cut" which clearly takes longer than the "Take out of machine / cut" procedure at The Empire. Of course it depends how fast the dealer is plus the players' decision making process but this is clearly an important difference worth noting.

Food & Drink

The Empire - Mainly Chinese food of varying quality. Service can also be a bit hit and miss. Non-alcaholic beverages are free and there is a machine you can go to for coca-cola, coffee, tea, cappuchiino etc (10 sec walk from the tables) where you press a button to get ya drink. Much quicker btw.

Hippo - This seems to cater mainly to the meat-eaters who like their burgers and steak. Service can also be hit or miss. Non-alcaholic beverages are free but the annoying thing is there is no machine like at The Empire where you can help yourself. You HAVE to order drinks from the waiters and they seem to be busy and often forget.

------------------------

That's it. I hope this gives a full picture of the atmosphere. Please feel free to weigh in to correct me on anything or add anything I've missed.

Thank SnowedIn, FWWM and especially Dr Futtock for the incredibly detailed response. More than I could have hoped for and valuable for anyone visiting London!

One more bit of info: I called Hippo yesterday to ask about their FX. Turns out it’s a bit different than your typically exchange shop, you can only exchange to buy into a game and you must be a member of their free loyalty club. That said, the rate they offered was surprisingly reasonably - as of yesterday €100 buys £84 which was pretty much market.

You have the option to buy your currency back at the point of cashing out. I’m not sure if you must purchase it back before they’ll pay you in GBP. They’ll exchange most all major currencies as well.


Regardless, thanks again. I’ll plan to swing by the Hippo tomorrow and if it sucks, it’s great to have Empire as a backup.

There's a currency exchange place across the road from the vic called Sterling FX which has decent rates compared to most other places, if you do it over the counter there and then it's worse but you can order currency a couple days using their website and its as close to spot as you'll get, but obviously not spot.

No. Palm Beach was amazing back in the day but only had a few tables or 5/10+. Was by far my favourite place to place in London, the food, games and location were the nuts. They even had nightly or few times a week 300-500£ turbo mtts, which were done by like 2am and decent money up top.

Is it common for GUKPT to have the grand final in Dec right now and the first stop of next year's schedule in London in January? I see it listed online but the two events at the venue are a few weeks apart only...

Yep happens every year that it starts (Jan/early Feb) and ends (late Nov / Dec) in London.