Just want to say I am LOVING the new promotions.
I know Horseshoe will never have the $100,000 bad beat jackpots live does, but I am almost happier having:

1. Orioles Lucky seat draws for runs in an inning and home runs
2. Spin the wheel for flopping quads or better (now even more interesting with the splash pot based on the wheel spin)
3. High hands every 20 minutes.

Smaller jackpots, but much much greater chance of winning.

I know some people will complain about something (this is 2+2 atfer all) but just in case any poker admins or managers are checking here... Keep up the good work!

Ladies and Gentlemen--you will notice a whole bunch of missing posts. I deleted the original post by Uhaul about the $850 incident and then all the follow up responses. While other peoples responses were fine, many quoted the deleted posts, so I decided to delete them all. So those who responded should not feel there is a problem with those responses.

I have PMd Uhaul about the problem with the posts. They mainly relate to violating our privacy guidelines and unsubstantiated extremely negative accusations.

That's fine and all, but it seems like a huge portion of the criticism of the Horseshoe gets deleted from this thread. There have been rulings I've seen that are completely insane backed up by the shift that I haven't even bothered to post because everything seems to get deleted.

I agree that UHaul's posts were a little unhelpful, but I can substantiate that the 850 incident happened how he said.

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I may have missed it, but I didn't see what their reasoning was for taking the 850 back. Was he legitimately not supposed to receive it? What was the nature of the mispayment? Details would've transformed his ranting into something more useful.

I'll make this one comment here, and then if anyone wants to continue the discussion, please feel free to bring it up in the LCP moderation thread.

The posts were deleted for two reasons. One was that two posts specifically violated the LCP guidelines on privacy. If anyone is unclear on that policy, please read the LCP guidelines thread in the sticky on the top page of the forum. In addition, rather than critcizing the ruling, he included personal attacks and demeaning descriptions of the employees.

Second, the $850 accusation may or may not have occurred as he stated. He admits it's hearsay, and his post did not provide sufficient detail for other users to make any sort of judgement about the likelihood that the incident occurred as he described. I asked for additional info but he did not post it. Since internet postings remain on the net forever, we must use caution in allowing seemingly very unusual incidents and harsh accusations to remain without clarification.

I'm not aware of any ruling type posts being deleted just for criticizing a floor decision. In fact, most of the main forum is about criticizing rulings. But there is a difference between criticizing a ruling and personally attacking employees with insults and demeaning descriptions. That's not allowed in LCP.

So that's it; as I said, if anyone wants to discuss this further, please post in the LCP moderation discussion thread.

Everything I said was absolutely true

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Geez, can one of the people who stated they know exactly what happened provide details on what happened? I am genuinely interested, but it's like talking to a toddler.

Here's the story as told to me. I didn't witness it and it wasn't me, but the same story was told to many folks at Maryland Live.

Player is given 850 for the tournament leaderboard by a shift. A day or two later he is playing a daily tournament, and a different shift comes and tells him that he shouldn't have gotten the money, that the other shift had made a mistake, and they needed it back. He couldn't give them the 850 right then, and at least wanted to get some additional information before he handed it over. They told him he couldn't play out the tournament without returning the money, and wouldn't let him unregister either.

It's unclear what the mistake was, since the shift involved never said. The player who was effected said that he was surprised he had won the prize though, so I would guess that he wasn't first on the leaderboard.

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I wonder if the guy actually told the floor to GFY when he was told he had to pay back the money, as the original post stated. If so, that might explain a less than sympathetic response from management.

If the guy truly didn't earn the prize, and it was awarded by mistake, then I can see the casino wanting the money back. It was an employee error, like when the cage over pays you. But I know there are those who feel that since casinos make a lot of money, then they should always have to eat their mistakes. I'm just not one of those.

This guy was said to be a solid reg in that room. I'm a reg at my room. I couldn't imagine if the floors, that I have known for years, came up to me and said, "sorry browser, but we made a mistake and we need that 850 back" that I would ever say GFY and expect to ever play in that room again. I also couldn't see myself screwing the people I see everyday over a mistake. How could anyone think you could do that and still be allowed to play?

I agree that it seems like an unhelpful response. I'm not sure when that got said in the course of trying to resolve things. That said, I think that for prizes like this where the floor signs off on the prize specifically, there is an additional onus on the room.

What do you think about not letting him play the tournament? Is it reasonable to expect a player to have almost a thousand dollars you gave them by mistake?

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I agree the part of pulling the guy from the tournament doesn't make any sense at all. Especially if he's a reg. I don't see how the floor would expect him to have 850 on him. But again, I think it may relate to how it went down. If the guy said GFY I'm not paying it back, then I could see them yanking him from the tournament (I'd probably yank him from the room if I were a floor and he said that). But if the guy was reasonable and just said "I don't have that on me now" then it's really wrong for the floor to yank him from the tourney.

I think there's a big difference between a cage overpay and a shift paying out promotional money. They are two entirely different pots of money, one, and two, with the cage overpay, generally the guest knows they are getting one over on the casino. In this case, the guest was given the money, tipped employees, etc. then the next day confronted in the middle of a tournament at the table in front of everyone else at the table and told that he couldn't finish the tournament, he couldn't unregister, he had to immediately produce the money or leave. I think it's unreasonable to expect a person to have that money on them. It's not like he knew he was being paid incorrectly. Promotional money should be used to keep players in the room, not to alienate them. And even if they were going to take the money back, it seems like it could have been handled more discreetly and professionally.

This is what I was getting at. Sorry if I don't always articulate clearly.

I do think it had to do with the tourney leaderboard

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I think if he was not to receive the tournament board money, then he most likely knew that he shouldn't have received the money. If I'm not mistaken, they only pay the top 5 people with the most points at the end of the month. Hard to feign ignorance while accepting the money.

Definitely agree that pulling him from the tourney and essentially kicking him out is uncalled for, unless of course he made a scene.

Scene or not, I can't think of a worse way to handle it

Yesterday guy was waiting with quads for at least 5 minutes for next high hand to start.
Not sure how legal to sit with hand doing nothing that long.

Like, he was stalling for 5 mins mid-hand?

UGH.... On the one hand, that really sucks to be at that table.
On the other hand, I would feel like a jerk if I called clock on the guy and he could have won $500 in 25 minutes...
Not sure how I would handle that one. I might try to extend a hand myself if I have quads and a straight flush was counting down towards a win.

But I think if no player calls clock, the floor/dealers might let it slide. They know whats going on, but if the other players are OK with it and it doesn't get out of hand, why would they force the issue?

If it's literally 5 minutes, I'm saying something. I think somewhere between 1:30 and 3:00 is the line where it becomes too much. 5 minutes is a long ass time to be just sitting there. And if the floor found out, I think the dealer would get in a lot of trouble.

At some point, you have to follow the rules somewhat. The rules state that the period is 20 minutes, and the highest hand in each period wins. His hand is not the highest in that 20 min period. To stall 5 minutes for the next period is too much.

There was a long thread about just this situation recently in the main forum. It got a bit heated, so I'd ask not to get into discussing it here and repeating that. If someone knows what thread I'm talking about can you link it? (On my phone)

here's the link:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27...imate-1528362/

Most high hand rules state that you cannot do this. Not sure if the rules at the shoe explicitly forbid this or not.

If we want to get technical, here is the only rule that may apply.

Any communication between players that may constitute an etiquette violation or collusion is banned.

Don't know whether sitting there for 5 minutes with an uncontrolled grin on your face is considered "communication", but I think it definitely violates etiquette.

So does check raising.

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The $850 was originally awarded for a drawing, the source told me. Not a leaderboard.

What?