Same here, and same situation in regards to Fridays. There is no longer any incentive for me to keep my gold card. I've already earned gold status again so I'll be keeping an eye on my points after the New Year to see if I have a shot at making Platinum, but as of right now I don't have the incentive to make a trip down there every 10 days like I used to.

Did FW do away with choice benefits? I no longer see any 3x pts a month for my gold card starting in Nov.

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I'd suggest reading the past few pages of a thread prior to posting. Easy answers are in here.

This. They changed how they do it, it's all explained in recent posts.

Lol! This was gotten to be nothing but repeating and critiquing other posters.


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So....I entered my 3rd tourney this year at the 'woods yesterday. I entered a $120 Satellite back in March for a $600 seat in the FPC. Won a seat and played the $600 event and went pretty deep. Finally got down there again yesterday to play the "big" $60 9am tourney expecting like 25 runners.
I got there real late and entered with like 16bbs of play. I was shocked when I realized they had 72 runners! Awesome! It's pretty much a turbo after like 5 levels but glad to see that many players!




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So playing 1-2 today and I get in a hand. Hero has 8-9 off I was in small blind 5 people limp in. Flop comes out 9-7-10 - 2 spades. Checks around to the 3 seat who makes in $15 we have folds, hero calls $15. Turn J of spades. Hero checks, seat 3 makes it $20 hero calls. River a 5 of spade. Hero checks, 3 seat checks, hero shows the straight.

3 seat folds face down the cards hit the fold pile but are still visible. THEN goes to the dealer oh wait.. I have a spade. Dealer says that the cards are mucked and he loses, others at the table also tell him he loses. Seat 3 says “I’ve never had that happen at any other casino”.

A few hands play out the dealer leaves he calls over another floor and the floor says that the dealer was wrong. To which other at the table say that they’ve never seen anything like that. So now he’s full of himself.

Anyone know what the real rule should be.

Thanks!

Any hand that hits the muck should be automatically dead no matter what. The staff there is notorious for contracting calls. This one seems easy.

Opps- meant contradicting calls!

Tell that full of himself player he’s wrong and to pay some f’n attention. It’s poker and we’re all adults. So he expects us to babysit his hands and start digging through the muck for him? Regardless of whatever foxwoods official ruling is- he’s wrong- he mentions hes never had that happen at other casinos- how often has he done this? Can we just be responsible for our own actions?

If he has a problem with this- he should choose to fold all of his hands up

Personally, though I know this would never be the rule, I think any hand that is folded with obvious intention should be held as a fold.

Clearly identifiable? If so, they're, I do believe, live in many rooms

In most rooms they are live, I'm not certain about Foxwoods. The magical muck doesn't exist in many places, but many people believe that this is rule. This comes up in many situations in the main forum, and it's always the same debate over and over.

Im pretty sure it’s also the case for foxwoods.
I just don’t understand why there is so much leeway for this situation. Its subjective and can only cause confusion.

If I face a bet on the turn heads up and decide to fold, can I change my mind and say “oh, I just realized I should have called, good thing you can still tell which cards were mine!”

Showdown is different.

But why should it be? What if the turn bet is an all in?

What happens is, no player truly folds his hand at showdown, the dealer does. Some fold your hands faster than others. Some dealers immediately pull your cards into the muck, some don’t right away. The dealer shouldn’t have any effect on the decision. But those rules don’t make any showdown fold really count unless the dealer just cant tell which are your cards or deals the next hand

Go to the CCP forum and search the term "magic", you'll see countless threads involving this topic (when touching the muck kills your hand, it is often referred to as a magic muck)

I haven't checked this recently, but the rule at FW for years has been that untabled hands which touch the (magical) muck are dead, even if identifiable.
This is actually one of the rules on which the floors have seemed to agree, so if the floor in this instance said the dealer was wrong, it's possible that it wasn't explained correctly.

Unless that rule is written somewhere, there’s no way to settle it. I believe there is a written tournament rule that leans toward “no magic muck”
I do believe this is the intended rule.

But, my question is wouldnt it be better to have a more clear rule declaring a fold and making it count. Why does poker need this messy showdown rule? Makes little sense

I think players should have access to the rules of the games they offer.
I asked a few years ago if they had a rule book and if the players could see it.
The answer was “yes we do” and “no, you can’t”
Part of what put me off about foxwoods staff
Hopefully things have changed. I’ll try to ask again

i don't understand how the gaming commission which seems so nitty about so many things allows the rules of a game to be kept secret from the players of said game

It is done to protect themselves. A certain action by a player may be interpreted differently every time and the room would be held liable for the floor to make what the "book" says when the action isn't necessarily defined by the book (did chips cross line? was it forward motion? was verbal announced at appropriate time? etc etc).

If rulebooks were floating around the room they would be liable for literally every floor ruling. We all want consistency and correct rulings you simply cannot operate a room in this manner and while I agree that magical muck rulings should be widely known throughout the room holding a supervisor's decision as final eliminates the liability a room would face on many other decisions. It really is common sense from a business viewpoint.

Mohegan sun offers a copy of a rule book if asked

Maybe they should be liable for the calls they make. Its their job and peoples money are on the line.
Just because something makes “sense from a business viewpoint” doesn’t mean its right to do. Price fixing and monopolies also make sense from a business point of view but we dont allow it. (Technically anyway)
But what makes sense from a fair point of view?

It's also online on their website

Slow pony, was going to mention they had their rule book online and have done so for years.

While it is fun to attribute a deep motive to Foxwoods not allows the patrons to see the rule book, it is more likely that there isn't "book" to look at. A number of rooms will have a memo dating from some distant past with a couple of other memos modifying it combined with a few unwritten "common" knowledge additions. They're more likely embarrassed by the state of the rules to share it with anyone.

Mohegan Sun Poker Rule Book

Honestly, they can have their "rule book" but at the end of the day, these are the only rules in that book that truly have any teeth.

1. In all disputes in which a ruling, interpretation, clarification or intervention is required, the decision of the Poker Supervisor shall be final.

2. If an incorrect rule interpretation or decision by an employee is made in good faith, the establishment has no liability.