I was thinking it's time we have a thread dedicated to the most popular casino in the San Francisco Bay Area. What I really like about Bay is how clean and well-lit the poker floor is, compared to some others in the area. What annoys me the most is San Jose's $200 max bet rule, which means that true NL can't be played and we have the spread-limit structure instead.

To start off with some gossip, I've heard that the $10-200 has stopped running regularly now with some of the regulars having moved to garden city. Can someone confirm/deny? Any particular reason why?

Bay 101 is too well-lit and clean compared to Garden City.

Bay 101 has the absolute worst chairs in the world. Like sitting on marble slabs.

Garden City has great plush chairs, like sitting on a cloud.

When you grind everyday, it makes a difference.

The action at Bay 101 is pretty good, lots of fish, and Bay can keep a game going 24/7 unlike GC which can not.

Overall, my feelings are mixed at Bay101. Management has some serious ego problems. They do what they do because it's what they do and you will get the most condescending look in the world if you give a positive suggestion.

But they are the big fish in the area and with no real rivals, they have no pressure to be the best. They are perfectly content to be what they are regardless of player comments.

On a scale of 1 - 10, I think Bay is a 7.5. There are a few things they could do to raise the bar so they'd be a solid 9. But there is no real incentive for them to. THey have a lock down on the local market and no real competition to fear.

Keep this thread going and I will pass along your concerns, Thanks

Is there room for improvement? Of course. Are any of the other cardrooms within 50 miles run as well? Nope.

I saw a dealer there once have a heart attack and later found out he passed away. I took that as a bad omen and never wanted to play there again.

Interesting question.

Comparing Garden City to Bay 101 is a bunch of pros and cons that go back and forth.

Garden City was first to do the computerized boards, and they have a lot of stuff automated where the dealers can just push a button for servers and open seats so + 1 for GC.

Bay101 has more players and can keep games going 24/7 so definitely +1 for Bay.

GC has better tournament structure so +1

Bay tourney structure (blinds vs stacks) way too fast -1

Bay has more turnout for their tourneys to +1

Bay has stronger/better floor people and dealers so +1

GC lets players buy in for up to $500 for 5-200 spread (vs. Bay $300 cap) which makes for better games so +1

GC chairs are 1000% more comfortable than Bays so +1

Bay chairs are like sitting on granite slabs after 4 hrs, -1

Both have automated shuffle machines +1

Bay101 advertises more and thus gets more customers so +1

GC new food is too pricey so -1

Bay food is pretty good for the price so +1

Bay 101 has a bet line which helps cut down on angle shots so +1

GC floor has inconsistent rulings so -1

Bay has WPT so HUGE +1

GC has buster bet Black Jack +1

Both GC and Bay boards people take good care of regulars so +1 for both

GC more likely to try new things (black jack tourneys, sit-n-gos, etc) +1

Bay has 30% more poker tables than GC so +1

Both have great Plasma TV set ups +1

Bay has deli/cafe/bar lounge which is nice to sit, eat, and wait +1


anyways, that is how I see the two. Bay does come out on top. But not by a landslide.

Luckily, for some reason GC seems adamant about NOT advertising for whatever reason. Plus, I think there is a city ordinance limiting size/expansion. So Bay really has nothing to fear from GC really. In fact, there are many players at Bay who don't even know where GC is and it is only 10 minutes down Interstate LOL

Yeah...for the bread and butter games, bay has more variety no doubt. Esp for higher stakes medium limit games. GC seems to have grabbed the $10-200 game though and seems to at least get interest going for 6-12 hi-lo.

this. Recently the structure at GC got even better with 10000$ stacks on wednesdays and 20 minute levels, very good for a $150 buyin game. Cory, the tournament director has done an excellent job managing these and promoting them. Also they start at 11:20pm rather than 12:45am, which is a big + for those of us who have real jobs. I wish they would start earlier though.

very true. Kit and Ben are my favorite...very helpful and accommodating with table change requests.

And they have wireless !!

Yeah, Bay has a 10,000 chip tourney as well, but they start you off at 100-100 blinds then jump to 100-200 then 200-400 so in actuality it is WORSE than when they used to give you 4,000 chips and start at 25-50. LOL, amazing how many players don't see that...

Difference is, Bay needs the tables for cash games, so they bend you over with the tournament structure to get it over with ASAP.

This is a nitch that GC just fails to capitalize on because they don't advertise their tourneys. Talking to them, they repeatedly will say, "We don't like advertising and depend on word of mouth"

which is just silly. GC can establish themselves as the premier place for tourneys which would fill the casino and bleed into their cash games but I guess they have a limited advertising budget as i've lived in the Bay area for 3 years and have NEVER seen a GC commercial, ad in any of the magazines, or heard a radio ad.

Computerized boards are not the nuts. If the list is so long that you fall off of it, you don't know where you stand without pestering the brush.

I've spent 4 hours+ in both and didn't notice a difference.

No. The line doesn't play. Forward motion is the rule.

?? Bay 101 has approx 22 poker tables at any given time. GC had a lot more than 16 the last time I was there.

Satellites for the 2k prelim event.

A. The house does not make that much on tournaments.
B. The dealers at GC essentially make nothing ($8 a 40min down is a great tournament for them) dealing tournaments
C. A large percentage of tournament players leave after they are knocked out. They do not feed the cash games.
D. The house is more interested in the Asian Games anyway.

I hear ya!

Speaking of which, have you made your complete list public yet? I see the tournament roster is partially filled.

Just about

So far added for 2010

Annette Obrestad
Tom Dwan
Elky
Jason Mercier
Eric Baldwin
Yevgeniy Timoshenko

It simply just shows willingness to improve and modernize. They were a good six months ahead of Bay in this.

I don't know what to say to this. GC new black chairs have DOUBLE the padding of the red chairs (they have the same red chairs as Bay for their Asian games). Put them side by side and do the Pepsi challenge. It's not even close. Ask anyone who plays there regularly.

Even though the line doesn't officially play, it does HELP alleviate confusion and players do use the line. I wish the house was more stringent in enforcing the line, but the line does cut down on angle shots. Much better than having no line at all IMO.

Perhaps I'm baised since I play 5-200 and 10-200 spread when i'm in the area.

Normally, GC has two 5-200 tables going. On peak hours, they will have 3 tables going (if the 3/6 LHE and 6/12 LHE haven't consumed all the tables)

Bay 101, has four to five 5-200 tables going pretty much all the time. And every so often they will have six tables going.

Both run one 10-200 spread, but it's hard to get on since they only have one table and players constantly rebuy in.

but even if i'm wrong and its not 30% then its 20%. And if you factor in FULL TABLES during the week and after 9pm, then my 30% would definitely hold since many GC games break a lot more readily then Bay games during the week and more people come into Bay

My likes/dislikes:

Bay 101: so much better service from chip runners and food-service people. At GC, I've been told to go get my own chips :-\ Things move much faster at Bay.

Bay 101: the tables are better than GC. The tables at GC are lighter, flimsy and unstable. My chip stacks keep shaking and falling over. Yuck. But the best tables in the bay area IMO are at California Grand's new renovated room in Pacheco/Concord (yay footrests).

GC: I like the $500 max buy-in for the 5-200 SL game. At Bay 101 the max is 300, which is better than the 200 that it used to be in March 2009, but still, it sucks to have to sit down with only 60BB.

Bay 101: Parking lot that looks much safer than GC. They even have security patrolling the lot and it's better lit.

GC: Better air conditioning. I'm often FREEZING at Bay 101 especially if sitting on the tables facing the draft coming in from sliding doors at the main entrance. They do give you a ridiculous looking white paper "jacket" if you ask, but I would never leave home without a warm jacket any month of the year.

ORLY? I play 100 hours a month and I still have to wait for an hour at the bottom of the list at times and they don't accept phone signups for the 5-200 SL game :-\

A few months ago I was passing through San Jose and stopped by Bay101 for a quick look at what's up. I talked to my man Bernie and he told me the Bay raised the rake to 7 dollars on the 10-200 game. That's unbelievable lol.

I played and proped for year's at the Garden, the spread games were always way juicier there than at 101. But like anywhere, it just depends on where the live Whales happen to be playing at.

Enforcing the line? As I said, it doesn't play! There's nothing to enforce. "It is only a decoration." And that's a quote from a senior floor.

There is NO betting line at Bay 101.

I haven't been in GC in nearly 8 mos, but they never had "a lot more than 16 poker tables", especially in the evenings, when they broke poker games (which were spread on Asian Games tables) to spread the more lucrative Asian Games. Maybe things have changed.

FFS, there is a physical line on the table. Yes, it may be decoration, but that decoration still reduces angle shots as the majority of players do use the line.

Compare to GC where there is no line. You get 5 times the angle shots as to what constitents forward motion vs non-forward motion.

Perception is often reality, and the perception at Bay101 with the betting line is that it is an official betting line and many players consciously and subconsciously adhere to that perception (even though the house does not enforce it)

Next time you are at Bay, watch what percentage of bets actually cross the line. I'd argue that easily 95% of the bets (discounting verbal calls and all ins) cross the line which cuts down on 'misunderstandings' and angle shots.

So my point which I hope is clear is that the BAY bet line via perception cuts down on angle shots since the majority of players use the line.

You obviously aren't tipping the right people

Sure, sometimes they are limited with what they can do for you, but if you are a reg, they are more likely to lock your seat for you and take a moment to track you down by calling the deli/bar and or asking around. If you aren't reg, they call your name 3 times then move on.

No, things haven't changed.

FFS quit spreading bull****.

You keep saying there is a betting line. There is NOT. You can say that people ignorant of the rules, including yourself, THINK there is a betting line, and consider that a "pro" for the cardroom. But I would not assume that everyone that makes a bet there in a normal fashion is an uninformed as you are.

I tried using small words and simple descriptions, but unfortunately, you were unable to grasp those concepts.

Now, I will try hand gestures and pictures, perhaps that will work better



If this doesn't work, then I'm afriad your intellect is too low for effective communication. And for the record, I amended my statement to say that there is a decorative line on every table that players refer to and treat as 'the bet line'. And it was my point that this decorative line (note I used the phrase decorative line in the quote you try to twist and refute) cuts down on angle shooting since players consciously and subconsciously treat it as the bet line.

I will be back in San Jose in a couple of weeks, if this thread is still kicking around, I'll take more pictures and post. Though i'm not sure if the walnut rattling around inside that skull of yours will still grasp the point i'm making.

Feel free to try to twist this so you can spout more stupidity

They don't use Cal Side tables for poker anymore, they use poker tables now. They moved games around...3 Card Poker on the Mezzanine by the back entrance, BlackJack on the Mezzanine by the bar. 3-6 games have their own area by the grab and go where the 3 Card tables used to be.

They don't break poker to spread Cal GAmes anymore, there are enough tables on the main floor for poker.