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ak vs 3bet shove and 4bet shove ak vs 3bet shove and 4bet shove

08-20-2015 , 07:09 AM
hi guys i had this decision preflop on 45 man sit and go..my first opponent is loose with 30 vpip and 11 pfr,,the second has got 24 vpip and 18 pfr..i raise and both of them shove..so i went fold because i dont want to risk my hole stack between 2 players and mainly in sit and go game..i want to hear your opinions... thanks


$1.36 Buy-in (100/200 blinds, 25 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 7 Players
Hero (MP3): 3,776 (18.9 bb)
CO: 2,114 (10.6 bb)
BTN: 2,866 (14.3 bb)
SB: 4,919 (24.6 bb)
BB: 2,673 (13.4 bb)
MP1: 1,140 (5.7 bb)
MP2: 3,795 (19 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with K A
2 folds, Hero raises to 404, CO folds,BTN raises to 2,841 and is all-in,SB folds, BB calls 2,448 and is all-in, Hero folds
08-20-2015 , 10:29 AM
You should ALWAYS get in AA KK QQ JJ AK preflop when your stack is 20 or less big blinds at these stakes
08-21-2015 , 03:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofear47
You should ALWAYS get in AA KK QQ JJ AK preflop when your stack is 20 or less big blinds at these stakes
Agreed, as a new player though I find it super hard to get it in pre flop with anything but a huge pocket pair, even with less than 15 or 20 bb when I play SnGs. If I knew the numbers and knew AK was almost on par with something like JJ or 1010 (or are those pairs way ahead of AK?) then I would go in more often, I just don't know the numbers, and holding a big pair pre flop generates a lot of confidence.
08-22-2015 , 10:02 AM
Yes u should get AK in at the same frequency as JJ and higher then 1010.
08-22-2015 , 12:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Decay95
Agreed, as a new player though I find it super hard to get it in pre flop with anything but a huge pocket pair, even with less than 15 or 20 bb when I play SnGs. If I knew the numbers and knew AK was almost on par with something like JJ or 1010 (or are those pairs way ahead of AK?) then I would go in more often, I just don't know the numbers, and holding a big pair pre flop generates a lot of confidence.
In a direct matchup JJ is stronger than AK, but you are always playing against the opponents range, not picking either of two hands to go up against each other.

AK blocks half the combos of AA and KK whereas JJ/TT doesn't. It also has 3 and 6 outs against KK and QQ respectively, whereas JJ/TT has two outs. It also performs better against AQ.

Including the blockers, AKo performs as well as JJ against KK+, and does better against any range wider than that up to and including JJ+, AKs, AKo and is slightly worse against TT+, AKs, AKo with JJ pulling ahead as you widen the range. (AKs also beats those edge cases)

As for TT, AKo is only half a percent behind TT against KK+ and does better against any wider range up to and including 88+, AJs+, AQo+ (TT pulls ahead once you add 77 to their range - but it never really has a big advantage until you get really wide and start adding unpaired undercards like 87s).

It's kind of academic which hand does better against really wide ranges anyway, because you would play both hands against a really wide range. Against premiums, where you have a tricky decision, AKo is just as good if not better against those hands. AKs is even better (better even than QQ until you get as wide as JJ+, AKs+, AKo+).
08-22-2015 , 10:32 PM
Never folding
08-23-2015 , 09:20 AM
thanks guys..
08-23-2015 , 09:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
In a direct matchup JJ is stronger than AK, but you are always playing against the opponents range, not picking either of two hands to go up against each other.

AK blocks half the combos of AA and KK whereas JJ/TT doesn't. It also has 3 and 6 outs against KK and QQ respectively, whereas JJ/TT has two outs. It also performs better against AQ.

Including the blockers, AKo performs as well as JJ against KK+, and does better against any range wider than that up to and including JJ+, AKs, AKo and is slightly worse against TT+, AKs, AKo with JJ pulling ahead as you widen the range. (AKs also beats those edge cases)

As for TT, AKo is only half a percent behind TT against KK+ and does better against any wider range up to and including 88+, AJs+, AQo+ (TT pulls ahead once you add 77 to their range - but it never really has a big advantage until you get really wide and start adding unpaired undercards like 87s).

It's kind of academic which hand does better against really wide ranges anyway, because you would play both hands against a really wide range. Against premiums, where you have a tricky decision, AKo is just as good if not better against those hands. AKs is even better (better even than QQ until you get as wide as JJ+, AKs+, AKo+).
so is it call?
08-23-2015 , 09:26 AM
finally i went fold with AKo..
*** HOLE CARDS ***
*** FLOP *** [4s Qc 3d]
*** TURN *** [4s Qc 3d] [8h]
*** RIVER *** [4s Qc 3d 8h] [Td]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
BB: shows [Ac Tc] (a pair of Tens)
BTN shows [Ah Qs] (a pair of Queens)
08-23-2015 , 02:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilantas
so is it call?
Yes.

This is still FT3 right?
08-24-2015 , 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
Yes.

This is still FT3 right?
FT3 What is it? and ft2 ft5 ?
08-25-2015 , 07:59 AM
Final 3 tables - so 19-27 people left in.
08-27-2015 , 10:56 AM
thank you lektoraj

      
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