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.50 180-man 14 BB  A2 .50 180-man 14 BB  A2

10-28-2011 , 09:40 AM
The table is normal, not loose nor tight. Three tables left. Insta Push?

[converted_hand][hand_history]Poker Stars, $2.28 Buy-in (500/1,000 blinds, 100 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #10919092

MP1: 9,912 (9.9 bb)
MP2: 10,910 (10.9 bb)
Hero (): 14,466 (14.5 bb)
CO: 7,074 (7.1 bb)
BTN: 8,378 (8.4 bb)
SB: 13,905 (13.9 bb)
BB: 20,125 (20.1 bb)
UTG+2: 8,171 (8.2 bb)

Preflop: Hero is with 2 A
3 folds
10-28-2011 , 09:47 AM
snapshove! nh!
10-28-2011 , 09:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gembaa
snapshove! nh!
no...
10-28-2011 , 10:12 AM
Explain more...
10-28-2011 , 10:32 AM
Well sng wiz will help if you want specific numbers
Or... estimate the calling ranges, pokerstove a2o vs. those and see what equity you have.

compare that to 22, JTs, 76s, T9o, A2s, etc (let alone stronger hands, these are just examples of "lighter" hands that you can push) and maybe you will see why a2o sux
don't get me wrong, a2o is a snap shove in some spots but here there are a few guys to act behind, a few which are deeper (15bb effective). this hand just doesn't play well vs. tightish ranges.
10-29-2011 , 09:03 PM
Easy fold, A2s is a jam though
10-30-2011 , 01:38 AM
If our equity is close to being enough its a jam given the fact we have a blocker
10-30-2011 , 05:22 AM
Fold..... ur M is 14 which is very good at this level..... u dont need to shove so wide with ur stack
10-30-2011 , 07:28 AM
lol not really relevant but you mean 14bb stack, not m 14
10-31-2011 , 02:31 AM
SB and BB had a lot of dancing chips so any of the 2 will call with A7+ and any pair
10-31-2011 , 03:05 AM
Easy fold. I'd shove this on the button and fold it in the CO as well.
10-31-2011 , 06:19 AM
Yeah dosnt seem like a shove. Just fold most of the time.
10-31-2011 , 09:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OMGClayDol
Well sng wiz will help if you want specific numbers
Or... estimate the calling ranges, pokerstove a2o vs. those and see what equity you have.

compare that to 22, JTs, 76s, T9o, A2s, etc (let alone stronger hands, these are just examples of "lighter" hands that you can push) and maybe you will see why a2o sux
don't get me wrong, a2o is a snap shove in some spots but here there are a few guys to act behind, a few which are deeper (15bb effective). this hand just doesn't play well vs. tightish ranges.
What calling ranges are you putting the players behind us on? This is the main thing I'm struggling with and stoving your 22, JTs, 76s, T9o, A2s I'm having to go down to about 6% calling ranges to make A2o significantly worse than these hands. So does 6% sound about right for average players with no real shorties?
10-31-2011 , 09:39 AM
A2o is significantly worse than those hands (especially the better ones like JTs, as opposed to T9o which is mediocre but still better than A2o to prove a point) vs. any reasonably tight range including 6% as you said but also 10% (or even slightly wider)... 10% is too wide for a typical random for sure and is about the widest a reg will/should call you here too. Vs. even 10% A2o has 4.5% less equity than T9o (and even less vs. the better hands). If the reason you posted that is because you think significantly worse equity is like 5% or something then you're wrong because even 3% is pretty big, etc.
A2o has a very slightly advantage over the other hands below because it has a blocker, reducing possible combinations of hands like aa ak aq etc meaning on average opponents behind will call -very slightly- less often, so you get slightly more fold equity with this than other hands. But it's no way near significant enough to make it better than something with a few percent extra equity when called.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

215,750,304 games 0.142 secs 1,519,368,338 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 66.215% 65.89% 00.32% 142163346 695228.50 { 55+, A9s+, KQs, ATo+ }
Hand 1: 33.785% 33.46% 00.32% 72196501 695228.50 { 7h6h }


---

207,188,784 games 0.098 secs 2,114,171,265 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 67.065% 66.68% 00.39% 138146014 804289.00 { 55+, A9s+, KQs, ATo+ }
Hand 1: 32.935% 32.55% 00.39% 67434192 804289.00 { Th9d }


---

202,051,872 games 0.131 secs 1,542,380,702 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 62.513% 62.10% 00.41% 125475789 832454.50 { 55+, A9s+, KQs, ATo+ }
Hand 1: 37.487% 37.08% 00.41% 74911174 832454.50 { JhTh }


---

191,778,048 games 0.078 secs 2,458,692,923 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 71.454% 69.50% 01.95% 133294509 3738261.00 { 55+, A9s+, KQs, ATo+ }
Hand 1: 28.546% 26.60% 01.95% 51007017 3738261.00 { Ad2h }
10-31-2011 , 10:16 AM
I see where I'm going wrong. I'm using stoves 10% rather than your 10% and the results are significantly different. For example using stoves own range of 9.8% (88+, A9s+, AJ+, KTs+, KQ, QTs+,) A2o comes out at 34.9% which is hugely different to your more accurate 10% and 28.5%. Thanks for the help.
10-31-2011 , 10:19 AM
Yeah you will need to manually assign hands usually, the default slider won't be good for people's default shoving/calling ranges in almost any spot. Obviously we need to use our intuition/experience to estimate the ranges, and they generally won't be 100% perfect, but definitely (hopefully) way better than Stoves.. Here people are calling 77 way before QTs etc, although you obviously realise this from your post anyway. And 22 comes way after some hands that 22 is way better than for shoving like K3o etc
10-31-2011 , 11:08 AM
Ez fold..
10-31-2011 , 04:15 PM
Yeah fold, I would jam like ATo and A3s

      
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