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Very interesting high level hand 5-10nl Very interesting high level hand 5-10nl

09-10-2015 , 02:25 AM
Hero is very solid/lag depending on table conditions and tricky and villain knows this and also is very solid but very much on the tight side yet thinks at an extremely high level( we know this from previous talks) Effective stacks villain starts hand with $2400ish and hero has him covered (5-10nl) hand in question.

Hero opens with a9ss in the cut off to $25... button( super super tight prop player who only 3bets 3-5% hands and never vs the good players only vs the weaker players and vs short stacks He calls ($600 stack) villain completes from the bb. Flop Aj2rainbow hero makes standard cbet of $30( I would cbet this board 85%of the time but only around 40%of time when prop calls preflop. Prop thinks 2 seconds and calls. Villain raises to $225( somewhat on the large size imo) I decide to call in case he is squeezing prop then folds after few seconds( almost never has a jack here(only k/q/j suited ) and also kqand k10suited.turn is an ace( villain may or may not notice but I do Notice that prop grimaces slightly at the ace when it peels.while he's reaching for chips to make bet. Villain bets $350 and shoots me a look I again call river is a 7 board now reads aj2a7 villain bets $575 on river. Hero should....

Last edited by GnomePoop; 09-10-2015 at 02:43 AM.
09-10-2015 , 03:04 AM
Call, if you trust your read that the "prop" player folded the case ACE... and you believe that villain does not get out of line with bluff's very often during a hand.

(you left out the flop 'check-raise' from villian in BB)

If the villian's set on the flop turned a boat, well then, that is the price you pay for playing Ace Rag this way just because you found yourself in a short-handed game and happened to turn Trips with a Rag kicker.

Instincts tell me that villain may have flopped a set and the river value bet completes the story. Very player type dependent = easy call or good fold.

I like your observations and descriptions and you may be getting to the point where you are losing your attachment to money and that is a good thing.

Most likely reveal:
Prop aka ultra snug nit holding: AQ, one-pair no good... fold
Villain from BB: setmined and hit and takes you to value town

Last edited by zeppy; 09-10-2015 at 03:15 AM.
09-10-2015 , 03:14 AM
I think all 3 options here are actually applicable vs this player in this hand. And extremely close...
09-10-2015 , 03:15 AM
that was hard to read but hero calling flops multiway isn't super bueno
09-10-2015 , 03:21 AM
^^^^^^^

Yea typed via iPhone sorry. I called because of the fact it's far to easy to squeeze in this spot( as well as his large raise size that's not typical with this player)but for the most part I agree with you.
09-10-2015 , 04:14 PM
I fold the flop to villain's ch/r

Last edited by Lilu7; 09-10-2015 at 04:27 PM.
09-10-2015 , 08:04 PM
Yes, probably for sure but since we didn't, what would you do on the river?
09-10-2015 , 09:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GnomePoop
Yes, probably for sure but since we didn't, what would you do on the river?
Fold
09-11-2015 , 06:08 PM
this is a pretty strong line from villain, i would assume the turn pairing for villain is a bad turn barrel, i would put villain on jj 22 /ak aq aj etc . Your call call here looks really strong and should at least indicate ax+. Him trying to bluff you off ax makes no sense and seems to be a suicidal bluff imo
09-12-2015 , 04:50 AM
I folded but actually think turning my hand into a bluff was a close choice here and might've actually worked. After hand the old nit confirmed the second I mucked that he had a10ss. Villain is type of player capable of turning a jack into a bluff yet at the same time of course pocket2s and pocket jacks can be in his range as well, but I think vs my wide opening range he 3bets jj preflop and most likely had pocket 2s or a jack he's turning into a bluff which is why I think shoving the river vs him is +Ev
09-12-2015 , 05:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GnomePoop
but I think vs my wide opening range he 3bets jj preflop and most likely had pocket 2s or a jack he's turning into a bluff which is why I think shoving the river vs him is +Ev
Makes absolutely zero sense, specially since he is never bet/folding a full house on the river having 3:1 on a call (even if it is a bluff catcher).
09-12-2015 , 03:09 PM
I thInk he can easily fold pocket 2s to me as mentioned this player is very very tight and also thinks about poker on a very high level but yes ultimately most all people can't fold full houses which is why I decided to fold, guess I wish he was 400bb deep at least to start hand with
09-19-2015 , 09:50 AM
As played, I dont think you really can do anything but call... V's range is capped here right?
09-21-2015 , 05:58 PM
fold flop, ez game
09-22-2015 , 04:15 PM
Shoot him a look then click it back to $1150. It's the highest level of playing you can do here.
09-25-2015 , 10:22 PM
fold flop,

also I don't think river is that that close - we should call considering he will knowingly x/r 2x and Jx with a tight player who flats your cbet.

Idk maybe he had it, but the way i see it is you cbet a high % of the time on this texture - the semipro player who called is constantly trying to avoid playing big pots against you two

So with you sandwiched, even the top of your range which is like AK is in a sticky spot, and when he assumes BU is very Ax heavy, we basically cut our sets by a tonne.


With him assuming your continuing range is something like AK, AJ, sets, and him knowing BU blocks them a good %, I can't imagine him not squeezing with 2x and Jx.



Also I think you're not giving the right information or not thinking in the right direction -
If he is very high level thinker - he will expect you to turn your Ax into bluffs some % of the time. He's not gonna fold a full house especially given the odds knowing your valuerange is something like AJ, A7s.

basically 2 combos that got there OTR
09-27-2015 , 10:52 AM
Fold Flop, Fold River...

The way I look at it, is if prop player is mad when the 2nd Ace hits, that leads me to believe villain has a set...
09-27-2015 , 11:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pologuy64
Fold Flop, Fold River...

The way I look at it, is if prop player is mad when the 2nd Ace hits, that leads me to believe villain has a set...
But, if Villain notices that, doesn't it make bluffing more attractive for him?
09-28-2015 , 04:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boobsicles
But, if Villain notices that, doesn't it make bluffing more attractive for him?
This was my thought exactly, I guess in hindsight I don't have to get myself in these spots, much better spots to get involved in, just felt like a bluff squeeze and as played I felt that all 3 options on the river were actually close. Taking safe route in this spot, after I call I flop cr though and a turn bet just didn't sit well with me.
09-28-2015 , 04:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boobsicles
fold flop,

also I don't think river is that that close - we should call considering he will knowingly x/r 2x and Jx with a tight player who flats your cbet.

Idk maybe he had it, but the way i see it is you cbet a high % of the time on this texture - the semipro player who called is constantly trying to avoid playing big pots against you two

So with you sandwiched, even the top of your range which is like AK is in a sticky spot, and when he assumes BU is very Ax heavy, we basically cut our sets by a tonne.


With him assuming your continuing range is something like AK, AJ, sets, and him knowing BU blocks them a good %, I can't imagine him not squeezing with 2x and Jx.



Also I think you're not giving the right information or not thinking in the right direction -
If he is very high level thinker - he will expect you to turn your Ax into bluffs some % of the time. He's not gonna fold a full house especially given the odds knowing your valuerange is something like AJ, A7s.

basically 2 combos that got there OTR
Pocket jacks as well( in case his blocker bluff was with 2x) yea the whole dynamic of the hand was interesting and at the end of the day I think letting him have these types of pots is fine , I think after the hand though he will be less likely to get out of line with me in the future though and that's not a bad deal
09-28-2015 , 04:21 AM
^^ I dont think you realize that everyone is more focused on your flop call. River is sort of just meh we're here now and cant fold, so its not that bad.

Flop definitely just mucking is far better
10-01-2015 , 12:56 AM
+1 fold flop
10-01-2015 , 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boobsicles
^^ I dont think you realize that everyone is more focused on your flop call. River is sort of just meh we're here now and cant fold, so its not that bad.

Flop definitely just mucking is far better
Yea for sure ty everyone for the feedback

      
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