i clearly wrote its wrong (sad, insecure etc.) to do so, read my post again, please. otherwise dont do wrong assumptions what i have said.
its blatantly wrong what you think that i said, seriously.

nevertheless, you cant tell people how to think, talk or whatever.
intolerance cant be fought with intolerance, thats ridic.
if ganstaman feels bad in these spots and is too intimidated to tell this big guy that he is wrong, he should either tolerate (not accept it), or grow a pair and open his mouth. its such an easy situation with only these choices, if you count talking to his "supervisor" to the open his mouth option.



edit: omg, i followed ganstaman into this thread after a longer discussion. now i see its the "thats what she said forum".
ganstaman is female too, right?

will have to appologize for my behaviour in OOT then.
things become a lot more clear now that i know ganstaman is female, lol.

i will post my PM i sent her in a new thread in OOT now.

facepalm.jpg on many levels. You don't seem to get it.

I'm so confused, 'straight-acting' isn't ok but 'macho' is?

Your usage of language is very confusing to me.

Because nothing makes you sounds more intelligent than saying, "Oh, it was a girl who said that? Well, never mind then, I expect girls to sound dumb."

Not at all, and I don't even think anyone suspects anything.

In my whole med school class, there was one girl who was out as bisexual, but there was a gay guy or two who was out in other classes. It wasn't really even topic of discussion except rarely.

We did have to read an article once written by a doctor who was a lesbian. She mentioned how she was initially open with her patients whenever they talked about her life (she was an outpatient internist, so she was establishing good, long term relationships with her patients). But she said that it became too much to deal with. Not that anyone did anything directly to her, but the tone changed and some of the questions she had to answer just didn't feel worth it. So she kept her answers short, pretended her wife was a husband, and tried to just move the conversation along.

There's a small chance I got the story reversed and that she really started off lying, felt bad, and then was just open and dealt with it. But I think I'm right. Not that the article was saying this was good advice, but it was a good story to launch a discussion.

I'm a male.

Is this the post that earned him his current temp-ban? for basically the reason SGT says above?

Wazz, I was not facepalming at you. It was directed at our thread's visitor.

I'm sorry if I'm not super clear; I've been trying to formulate this in another, more succinct way, but alas, I am not the greatest of explainers. I am gonna enlist the help of someone and get back to you. I know you must be eagerly waiting

I'm going to be in what I think is one of the largest classes in all of med schools, so I feel like there is at least some chance there will be others. I don't know if there is any med student org for LGBT's or anything, but I'll find out soon enough. My school seems to be pretty inclusive, so I kind of expect it.

I was googling "confronting/dealing with a homophobic co-worker" and coming up with some pretty "meh" answers. Something like, 1) tell him something you like about him 2) talk about the incident and how it makes you feel using good eye contact 3) end with good note (the ol' critique sandwich). Reinforcements welcomed

My school had one of those LGBT organizations, but I never went to any of those meetings (of course...), so I don't know how many people went to them. It might have been a piece of AMSA, actually.

If HU got temp-banned for this, his writing/English skills didn't help matters I think. He eventually alludes to the co-worker being in the wrong here. He also says if it bothers ganstaman enough, then he should speak up about it in some sort of manner.

But when crap like this happens in the workplace, it obviously can get a little messy. The "compliment/critique sandwich" is probably the best bet for direct confrontation. Going to a supervisor would be okay too, but there is a chance it would come back that you "tattled", and obv that's not very desirable either if you have a year to go with this guy.

RMC, I appreciate and respect your passionate points in PCness. These are certainly the right situations in which it's important to push PCness hard. You're right that it's similar to calling someone a N word behind their back.

You're also right to get technical with trans phobe vs. homophobe.

However you're point would be more strongly made if you didn't make similar mistakes in PCness yourself.

Hence...

You might want to replace this word with a different one.

Yeah I knew you were facepalming at him. I think I could hear the sound of friends across the pond facepalming at this guys words.

Macho is not just an adjective at all, it is a derogatory term. You can't change the meanings of words for your own convenience, you certainly can't do so because a small minority have done it before you.

Would you say that women tend to act differently than men? Is effeminate a term you would deem ok? Sexuality is a behaviour. It's not a rule, there are exceptions - me, the straight guys who act a little gay and fool most of our gaydars, the gay guys who act 'macho' - but it's still a rule of the same sort that men act in certain ways (like a man) and women act in certain ways (effeminate). It may be a weaker rule, but you wouldn't have gaydar if there weren't such a thing as 'straight-acting' and 'gay-acting'.

Has anyone ever actually done a compliment sandwich? They really sound cheesy, and I can't see it working well.

They are definitely comparable. In this specific instance that I was discussing, at least, the transphobic and homophobic comments were basically the same as each other and were stemming from the same basic thoughts in Joe.

I know that gender identity and sexual orientation are different things, but the "LGBT community" exists as one for a reason. Despite the differences, there are many similar issues with more or less the same 'enemies.'

The word you are looking for here is, masculine.

This seems like the root of our differences of opinion.

You sure?

Great, and if you think this is what I'm talking about then you need to reread my posts. I was comparing transphobia to homophobia, not transsexualism to homosexuality.

I'm almost positive HU got temp-banned for something in OOT.

Yeah...not for the posting here...although might have been tempting if I had seen it before. Do y'all want his stuff deleted, or let it stay?

On another note, met Protential & his bf the other night at the TWSS meetup. Really nice guys. My gf liked them a lot too & loved their matching shirts

So you boil sexual orientation down to a small paragraph, but you stretch out gender identity into more details, and you think this shows the latter is more complicated. One could easily just reverse the situation by copying what you wrote but substituting in the appropriate terms to demonstrate just as non-convincingly that sexual orientation is actually the more complicated of the 2.

I honestly don't think either is clearly more complicated than the other. I understand that for you, discovering you gender identity was harder than sexual orientation, but this is not universal, and I think it is blocking you from understanding just how difficult sexual orientation is for many.

We'll, allow me to clarify the situation.

"Well that's the way that I want it to stay
And I always want it to be that way for my Lola
Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola
Girls will be boys and boys will be girls
It's a mixed up muddled up shook up world except for Lola
Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

Well I left home just a week before
And I'd never ever kissed a woman before
But Lola smiled and took me by the hand
And said dear boy I'm gonna make you a man

Well I'm not the worlds most masculine man
But I know what I am and I'm glad I'm a man
And so is Lola
Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola
Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola"

That should settle it.

People forget that the Kinsey scale is not just 0 and 6, but some numbers in between. We should really have the same scale for gender. Some of us are 3/3 on the charts with a bullet.

Shauna

hugs to all
Shauna

I am being so frickin' gay at the moment. It is absurd. The move from San Francisco to The Midwest has caused gay to ooze from my pores. AH!

For those people wanting to come out, but who can't just yet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juOcp...0&feature=plcp

Just another idea.

@ Shauna

I love Lola as much as the next person, and it speaks to me more then to most, as I, like the lead singer of The Kinks, have had many 'lolas'

Despite that, I don't see how quoting it proves RMC's point over ganstamans, perhaps you could give a bit more insight as to why you feel it does.

Bottom line, IMO, is that the hetrosexual community views us all as homosexuals. Therefor to properly achieve our goals and desires towards being accepted, respected and equally treated in the larger global society, we would do better to cut in house fighting off entirely and instead stand together, in unity.

As I Bi-sexual/tri-sexual, I could make an argument that would be not only reasonable but logical, as to why it's actually harder for me as a bi-sexual/tri-sexual then it is for either you gays for trans, but I'm not going to do that, because I realize the importance of us all standing together as one LGBT community, and not having any in house bickering as to who in our community has it the hardest.

This isn't preschool, it's the real world, if we ever hope to truly achieve acceptance, respect and equality then we need to continue to stand together, strong and unified.

So please, stop the in house arguments and bickering, and let's continue to stand together, as one larger LGBT community, ok?

got temp-banned by dids.
i made an appology thread in OOT to/for ganstaman.
thought he was female, 'cause i didnt yet know what this thread-title meant but knew the forum.
afterwards i understood where i posted in here (gooogled glbt) and begged dids to delete my appology thread as quick as possible, to not accidently force ganstaman to answer to that mad thread (telling he aint female and ladida)
dids did a good job by deleting the thread and my account for 24h, thats it.

im pretty positive to be more sane very soon. 7 days drug free now, but who cares, anyway...
maybe ill even buy a grammar-book...

So I have a small group of good friends, we've all been friends since high school. Only two of them (afaik) know I'm bi, and only one I've told. An x gf of mine, after we broke up, told some of them I'm gay like five years ago or so, but I personally one of my friends via letter while he was in jail. The other one that knows, a girl that he knows and had fooled around with off and on, she contacted me on a dating site and it turned out we both knew my friend, and she was at his house talking about me and showed him my profile which said I was bi. So that's how he knows ...

So anyways, my friend that I've told, he works with another one of my friends, and those two are really my best friends you know. I have the closest relationships with them than any of our other friends. I'm in kind of a conundrum.

I feel akward around some of my friends sometimes, and idk if it's cause I'm "in the closet" or whatever. So anyway, I'm trying to figure out if I should tell my friend, or my friend tell him, or neither tell him ... or any of the other people. idk

I've been out to all my close friends - as bi - for a long time, but I only recently decided to come out properly over facebook and twitter. It felt good, like a weight off my shoulders. I had no reason to come out other than that I wanted to. Take things at your own pace, of course, but think of it like cold water at the pool. It's not as cold as you think, and the water isn't that deep. I'm always fearful of how people will react, and basically no-one ever reacts badly.

I could never tell my family though imo