ST - raised limp, calls my cbet on safe flop - Heads Up SNG and Spin and Gos -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

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ST - raised limp, calls my cbet on safe flop

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08-12-2011 , 04:15 AM

qetou

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,226

I feel like I'm losing so much in these spots. They limp/call majority of my raises and then float my cbet like 90% of time. What the hell am I supposed to do on the turn? Just give up?

Villain is unknown.

Poker Stars No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t10/t20 Blinds - 2 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Hero (BB): t570 28.50 BBs
BTN/SB: t430 21.50 BBs

Pre Flop: (t30) Hero is BB with A

BTN/SB calls t10, Hero raises to t60, BTN/SB calls t40

Flop: (t120) 9

(2 players)
Hero bets t60, BTN/SB calls t60

Turn: (t240) 7

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN/SB bets t60, Hero calls t60

River: (t360) 6

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN/SB bets t180, Hero folds

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08-12-2011 , 05:22 AM

coffeeyay

See my staking thread

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,536

Raise more pre vs the villian you describe since he limp/calls a majority of your raises.

I'd probably barrel the turn, I want him off of his low pocket pairs and we still have a boatload of equity--but it's a bit marginal because we have so much SD value. I don't think you played it poorly tbh--his riverbet is screaming value.

I'd like to know what others think though...

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08-12-2011 , 05:31 AM

Nederlander

banned

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,374

I could take the same line vs a fish, we could def bet the turn since he has a ton of floats in our range, and even tho we might beat a big part of his range there, I would rather just pick up the pot.

Def ackward spots, so yeah sometimes I barrel and sometimes not, I have no idea what the best line here is, I think it is betting the turn.

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08-12-2011 , 05:39 AM

qetou

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,226

Quote:

Raise more pre vs the villian you describe since he limp/calls a majority of your raises.

Villain is unknown.
I was talking in general - 3x raises are called more often than not and people like to float on such boards.

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08-12-2011 , 06:14 AM

coffeeyay

See my staking thread

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,536

Quote:

Originally Posted by qetou

Villain is unknown.
I was talking in general - 3x raises are called more often than not and people like to float on such boards.

well if that's what you believe the general population does at your stakes then you should consider that a read and raise bigger pre--especially when you have a premium and it's the 1st raise you make.

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08-12-2011 , 06:16 AM

TakeHerOnACruise

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,253

Quote:

Originally Posted by coffeeyay

I'd probably barrel the turn, I want him off of his low pocket pairs

You really think he's gonna limp/call with a small PP here in a super turbo? And even if he did (highly unlikely), would he fold it on that turn card which is a brick to ur raising range pre as far as he is concerned.

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08-12-2011 , 06:29 AM

coffeeyay

See my staking thread

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,536

Quote:

Originally Posted by TakeHerOnACruise

I was taking this to be a lower stakes game since villains are described as loose passive since they limp call and float. Against such a villain I would expect this behavior with a low pp--both limp/call pre, and giving it up on the turn. Obviously against someone with a clue the spot gets pretty ugly and you're right that low pp become less likely to be in his range and/or to fold.

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08-12-2011 , 06:54 AM

qetou

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,226

Quote:

This is a $15 game.
Since STs are new to me I decided to start from the bottom (started at $3.5's, trying to feel the game), and I dont think limp/calling raises w/PPs is standard even for lower stakes.

As to your suggestion to raise limps 4x vs unknown or loose players as general rule - it seems a bit exploitable to me and I was really more interested in postflop play here.

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08-12-2011 , 07:11 AM

Clever_Efreet

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 505

I generally raise more with these high Ax hands. Something like 65-70, but 60 is fine obv. Turn is an easy check and usually a call against majority. There really ain't any PP's in villain's range if you ask me.

In general it's good to remember that you get floated more if you cbet half or less. It's fine but plan future streets accordingly.

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08-12-2011 , 07:26 AM

#10

huntypro

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,371

OP I like how you played it. By the way I think the villain also played it well.

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08-12-2011 , 08:01 AM

#11

coffeeyay

See my staking thread

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,536

fair enough I'm wrong no pps I learned something thx

As for 4xing, I don't understand why you're worried about exploitability. It's a $15 game vs an unknown--first time you raise a limp if you have a big hand it's worth it to make it bigger than you standard sizing. But obviously it's not a big difference in equity in the grand scheme of things.

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08-12-2011 , 08:19 AM

#12

olistr

journeyman

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 227

I close my eyes and call , if he float a lot then bet small on turn and u just call then is easy for him to fire river like this
I start making this play and it work very well vs thinking opponents
I think rest of the hand was wp

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08-12-2011 , 09:01 AM

#13

crazyriver

old hand

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 1,732

Imo either barrel the turn or c/f (do we have odds to hit A or K? I believe we're very often behind vs this sizing and call on the flop) it depending on villain/your humour but I'm rather for c/f'ing given the dry board and his snap call. A bit higher raise pre is also nice indeed, like 70-80.

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08-12-2011 , 10:06 PM

#14

mrbambocha

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,106

Quote:

Listen to this guy!

Raise to 70-80, I prefer 70, with your non made hands and 60 with nuts/bluff.
I think an flop check can be good aswell. He wont fold undercards, 87, 76, and neither overcards, JT, QT, and that nine often hits hits range more then ours.
From my experience vilian doesnt bluff that often on these boards in 3B pots, (they usually bluff on A/K/Q/J boards trying to rep the hand that I have.)
And If he checks I rather bet turn/river.

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08-13-2011 , 03:02 AM

#15

Sol Reader

The Situation

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 9,380

Raise bigger. I don't like barrel on the turn, wtf is that range you give him. He has air or value that doesn't fold often. c/c on turn can be fine.

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08-13-2011 , 08:44 PM

#16

Mr Wray

self-banned

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,616

Limp call low pp? Thanks for making me laugh

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08-14-2011 , 10:11 PM

#17

mrbambocha

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,106

How is a push pre? I know that we will get many folds, but If we raise his limp 3.5x and he calls we're not gonna get much action if we hit and if we miss we're in a ****ty spot like this. How do you play different Ax against a limp? Which do you push/raise/check behind?

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08-15-2011 , 07:41 AM

#18

Sol Reader

The Situation

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 9,380

There's too much value in a raise to not do it. Sure it leads to annoying spots but it's more profitable.

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