Minraising oop, you give the BB great odds to flat almost any two in position, yet i still see a large majority of people minraising from SB in spin n gos. Has there been a disussion somewhere over the benefits of 3x-ing, 2.5x-ing and 2x-ing from the SB?

TBH I think the biggest discussion is between minraising and limping. You are generally opening a value-heavy range, so people calling you wide isn't a problem, however getting shoved over and having to fold more chips sucks, and now you have two people who can shove over you instead of just one in a HUSNG.

iirc Primo 3x's though, or at least he used to. I think he streams or streamed, so if you want to find an argument for 3xing maybe start there?

i watched his streams but he hasnt streamed for half a year now or close to that.
You mean people minraise valueheavy at around 10bb i assume from sb cause at like 25bb, you definitely see a bunch of light minraises often.

Well even deep you're minraising a stronger range than you would in position. It may have some weaker hands but the reason to raise is generally going to be because you want value. That is unless you think BB is overfolding, but if he's overfolding then clearly minraising junk strictly beats raising bigger

Primo and Simpledude advise opening the SB w/ a 3x in their spins pack and talk a bit about reasons and adjustments. Other guys putting out content seem very adamant that a MR is correct.

So its 2 people vs everyone else. Seems like minraising should be the obvious answer then, though sometimes the majority can have it wrong aswell.

So it turns out at the deeper stacks (let's say something around 20-25bb) 3xing is preferred by GTO solutions to 2xing. There's a lot of reasons for this, likely one of the major ones is actually something no one mentioned--SPR. Since we're OOP, we generally benefit a bit by removing how much money can go into the pot on later streets (since we're at a strategic disadvantage there), and one way to do this is to build a bigger pot pre. To avoid over committing money pre-flop while OOP we simply use a fairly strong range and use limping on top of it. Another reason is that IP's strategy benefits a ton from calling a lot (since they can play later streets) and not raising that much, and so by 3xing we can get more value than by using smaller sizes (again this benefits a fairly strong range).

All that being said, even in the GTO models minraising and other sizes (including 4x and 2.5x) end up very close in EV with most hands. On top of that, a GTO strategy that is restricted to only open shoves, 3xes, limps and folds will end up very similar in EV as one that replaces 3x with 2x. Even a shove/limp/fold strategy will perform similarly. It's worth noting that when the strategy allows limping, most hands end up indifferent between limping and 3x (or 2x) as well.

In the end this tells us that EVs run close. This means that the best decisions will depend strongly on population tendencies, reads, and our own abilities post-flop so there's lots of room to deviate and profit from where we think villains will make the most mistakes. Personally, I've found that minraising works extremely well versus the population for a number of reasons and I haven't been as impressed with 3xing vs most players. There's some room where something like 2.25x might be even better though, and there's a lot of room where a strategy that uses a variety of sizings can be extremely strong vs the population.

In the end it's a very complex subject with a lot of closeness, and I strongly believe that sizing choice isn't nearly as important as the ranges you use with each sizing. What I mean by that is if you only min-raise and your buddy uses 3x instead, your opening range and your buddies should be quite different--but in the end if you guys are both using good ranges with your preferred size your final EVs will likely be very similar.

Hope that gives you some more things to think about!

Good Good Good reading!

Thank you for taking the time for such a thorough explanation.
I assume the difference in ranges is that you should be minraising if you wanna play a looser range from sb and 3x if you have a tighter range?

If you're only 3xing, then yeah exactly. If you're limping then your 3x range will be stronger and more polar than a minr range in a minr + limp strategy. A 3x range will also use fewer suited hands due to SPR issues.