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Originally Posted by Nefirmative
I agree that it may be slightly misleading but they're not lying. You're randomly matched with people who join at the same time as you, the software simply sequences the times in which people using it join. Technically pokerstars is telling the truth.
In Australia where I live we have just had a gaming scandal in the greyhound racing industry. Many tens of trainers were secretly filmed by media using cats and possums and other live animals as live bait to train their greyhounds. This is illegal.
The Gaming Regulator has been sacked despite claiming they had no knowledge of live-baiting and not being involved in live baiting. The fact is that the regulator failed to properly ensure live baiting was not occurring. Government and the public took the view that the Gaming regulator staff quietly looked the other way.
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So gaming integrity whether in greyhound racing or poker must not only be done it must be seen to be done.
The problem with allowing third party group-based seating scripts to register is that it creates the appearance of "looking the other way." It delegates what really needs to be directly and wholly under Pokerstars control (seating) to a third party. Now if SpinWiz merely automated basic functionality that an individual could do manually I'd think that fine. But I think coordinating many individuals is not something that can realistically be done manually so it crosses a line.
You say Pokerstars lobby may be misleading but they are not lying yet I've seen email responses from support that confirm that seating is random in Spin&Go's. That is a lie by omission. It gives the appearance of truth and legalistically it is the truth but it fails to answer the player's question by omitting either deliberately or out of ignorance that seating is not random due to the action of third party software. Like the Australian greyhound racing regulator it deliberately looks the other way.
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Pokerstars is also fully aware of all of spinwiz's features and applications, it would be naive to think otherwise.
I prefer to think Pokerstars thinks Spinwiz has certain basic functions and is unaware of the group-based manipulation of the seating process.
Either way I refuse to play Spin&Go's with the lobby as it is now.
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There's a fine line on what is acceptably misleading. I for one think it's pretty gross that the $5 Spins with the Million dollar jackpot were diamond coloured in the lobby despite the fact that they had a significantly higher rake.
Rake should probably be more transparent in a properly regulated environment. For example, on the lobby page before registering.
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Do you also think pokerstars should advertise the fact that people use HUDs? If so, to what extent? People unaware of 3rd party software are likely to be scared by it. Until you have experience with and fully understand the advantages and applications of 3rd party software it's easy to misunderstand (not you personally, you as in people in general).
Pokerstars is currently reviewing proposed changes to third party software in other games such as HUDs.
I think all players should be told about the existence of HUDs but I don't know how best to do that. Maybe when a player first creates a signon there should be some sort of welcome pack where they are informed about various things like poker school online or maybe pokerstars should allow 3rd party software to advertise in "News" popups. I don't know.
Personally, I am indifferent whether HUDs are banned or not. I use one extensively for cash games but I can play really well without it, too as I sometimes do for a change to shake off the cobwebs.
Pokerstars sponsors Pokerstars school online and any players who watch videos there or watch twitch streams by Pokerstars team online pros will see HUDs and have them explained to them. For example, Nanonoko promotes and uses a free HUD called something like Jivaro on his streams. He freely answers viewers questions about HUDs. Primo doesn't use a HUD on his streams but I have heard him answer questions about them and about push/call charts. Primo openly uses SpinWiz on his streams.
Last edited by TimTamBiscuit; 06-26-2015 at 02:28 AM.