This is incorrect. The -0.1785258bb's include the blinds. The absolute/overall EV is thus: -0,5 - 0.1785258 = -0,6785258 BB. So your stack after you go ai is (on average) 0,68 BB lower than your stack before you began the hand. If you fold your will only be 0,5 BB lower. So folding is the best option.

Actually it is 38,1 % calling range and equity of 35.365 which gives EV of 0,1153.

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can anybody tell me where I am wrong whith my calc using pro tools??
nash say is ev+ 9bb 97o, here I have -2.1

did the calc and T7o is a profitable shove vs the calling range you give it, so it looks like ppt is wrong. it looks like it did a monte carlo equity calculation w/ 600k trials. can u tell it to exhaustively enumerate all boards instead?

My understanding (here comes Mers again) is that Nash is a complete system so looking at individual hands isn't the correct way to look at it. If you put in the entire Nash shoving range at 9bbs and the calling range at 9bbs you get something pretty close to EV neutral.

I don't think this is correct
when we fold EV is -0.5
when we push , we push 8.5BB and this end up 0.04bb EV+

and 9bb range by nash is 40% 531 hands , with removed one T7 hand

sorry but I dont uderstand what u mean by this "can u tell it to exhaustively enumerate all boards instead?"

but there is no other option in ppt to calc EV , so should I not use ppt???????
cos I was confused more times when I made manual EV calc and never get same number then ppt shove equity tool

You can't have -EV hands in a Nash range. You could unilaterally improve by folding them, which means it would not be a Nash equilibrium.

it calculated the preflop all-in equity of T7o vs the BB range by "randomly" generating 600k 5-card boards and looking at on what fraction of them T7o was the winner (whether it looked at all or just one hand from villains range on each board i dunno). this is faster and less accurate than looking at all possible 5-card boards.

in pokerstove its easy to select "Monte Carlo" vs "Enumerate All". i dunno about PPT -- ive never used it.

for ppl who arent convinced by definitions and proofs, this issue has been debated extensively w/ equity calculations and all earlier in the thread.

No debate necessary - it makes perfect sense to me after Nichlemn explained it.

Is the link to the chubukov chart broken, or is just me?

Can anybody post it if so?

it's broken

i would like the chubukov chart as well

I'm a bit late, but w/e.

You put the numbers wrong: A,KK-22,KQ-K4,QJ-Q8,JT-J9,Kx3x-Kx2x,Qx7x-Qx6x,Jx8x,Tx9x-Tx8x isn't the opponents range - it's his CALLING RANGE.
You are shoving into a 100% range.

Here's one from 2p2 (credited to Bunzablood)
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/18...bukov-1084249/

Bump to stop archiving

bump bump

can Antes be ignored if we are HU in a big mtt?

or does it significantly change our range? (i dunno antes are kinda small when HU, so pls answer^^)

i don't play mtt or hu with antes but imo should go something like:
[ ( big blind + small blind + antes ) / 3 ] * 2 = x
then... smaller stack / x = eff. stacks in bbs
from there you should act accordingly

was a little curious about this so i looked into it. 10BB effective shove/fold game w/ 1/4BB antes has solution

SB shove: 22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q2s+,J2s+,T3s+,95s+,84s+,74s+,63s+,5 3s+,43s,A2o+,K2o+,Q3o+,J7o+,T7o+,97o+,86o+,76o, some of 65o (~66%)

BB call: 22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q3s+,J7s+,T7s+,98s,A2o+,K2o+,Q7o+,J8 o+,T9o, some of Q6o, (~47%)

compare w/ normal blinds shove/fold at 10BB effective: SB shoves ~58% and BB calls ~37%

so, lets see how kasparovskis approximation works out...

[ ( big blind + small blind + antes ) / 3 ] * 2 = 4/3...

so basically, he thinks that SB posting 0.75BB and BB posting 1.25BB is more or less like SB posting 0.666BB and BB posting 1.333BB.

so, the game at 7.5bb effective has equilibrium at

sb shove ~64%, bb call ~47%

so hey, better than i would have thought, and probably even better w/ smaller antes.

Thanks, nice content!

Hi, i wanna know if this last chart is in bb´s or in small blinds?



And a last cuestion.

Nash gives you the way to push when you have some efective stack. And no matter what do your opponent, he can only be ev0 with you. If he calls always with AA, he will lose or be ev0 because he will loose a lot with all his folds.

Ok thats good.

But I dont understand whats the diferent with chubukov. I mean. Chubukov gives you the stack max where if you are under it you can push this and and never be wrong..... even if he knows your hand.

So whats difference? I´ve read all pages but i dont see a final answer.

Thanks

Chubukov gives your best shovefold strategy if villain knows your hand. Nash gives your best strategy if he knows your range

... and assuming Villain uses that info correctly, of course.

But even if doesn't know, it would never be ev-. Obvious could be more ev+ strategies but it couldn't be ev-