$30 turbo - middle pair in a 3bet pot - Heads Up SNG and Spin and Gos -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

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$30 turbo - middle pair in a 3bet pot

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12-12-2011 , 11:58 AM

zorzak

adept

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,193

Poker Stars, $28.78 Buy-in (10/20 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 2 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #11291352

Hero (SB): 1,530 (76.5 bb)
BB: 1,470 (73.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 7

Hero raises to 50, BB raises to 120, Hero calls 70

Flop: (240) 8

(2 players)
BB bets 240

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Third hand of the match, he folded all hands so far. Is this a fold when he pots it?

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12-12-2011 , 12:03 PM

collinstation

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 118

I'm folding, because we'll be playing a huge guessing-game if we continue here.

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12-12-2011 , 12:16 PM

zorzak

adept

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,193

yeah thats what i thought too. i felt like we are either gonna be folding on a ton of turns or end up making very marginal calls.

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12-12-2011 , 12:23 PM

Krumb Snatcha

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 3,051

Not folding....

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12-12-2011 , 12:28 PM

poenschepper

centurion

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 154

My std is to fold 87s preflop against unknown after 3 hands

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12-12-2011 , 12:30 PM

Krumb Snatcha

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 3,051

Quote:

Originally Posted by poenschepper

My std is to fold 87s preflop against unknown after 3 hands

Don't do this either.

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12-12-2011 , 12:31 PM

zorzak

adept

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,193

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krumb Snatcha

Not folding....

you dont really help anyone with your 2 word responses u know, mind explaining?

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12-12-2011 , 01:14 PM

Krumb Snatcha

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 3,051

Quote:

Originally Posted by zorzak

you dont really help anyone with your 2 word responses u know, mind explaining?

Just construct a range where this is a fold. Even if his range is (TT-AA, AKo), you can still argue you should call, depending on how he plays the turn.

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12-12-2011 , 01:20 PM

mermigi

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 248

when you call a small 3bet with 78s which better flop do you expect to see in order to not fold? (456ddd?????)
This is one of the driest flops ever and we have middle pair plus there are a ton of cards that might improve our equity on turn even if we are behind.(any 7,8,diamond,6,9).
That said ,i think calling flop and reevaluate turn is our only really option.

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12-12-2011 , 01:48 PM

#10

crazyriver

old hand

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 1,732

I totally agree with Krumb and mermigi.

This is one of the best flops in 3-bet pot for us. I guess folding is out of question.

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12-12-2011 , 05:52 PM

#11

zorzak

adept

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,193

Poker Stars, $28.78 Buy-in (10/20 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 2 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #11292252

Hero (SB): 1,530 (76.5 bb)
BB: 1,470 (73.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 7

Hero raises to 50, BB raises to 120, Hero calls 70

Flop: (240) 8

(2 players)
BB bets 240, Hero calls 240

Turn: (720) 3

(2 players)
BB bets 540

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what now?

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12-12-2011 , 06:21 PM

#12

jacopastorius

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 409

I think calling flop is right because our equity on the turn improves with many cards. On turn i think we can't go any further without reads

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12-13-2011 , 05:28 AM

#13

collinstation

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 118

Quote:

Originally Posted by mermigi

We don't call here preflop to hit a pair. We call because of our good implied odds, to make hands better than weak pairs.

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12-13-2011 , 07:01 AM

#14

chaosad

adept

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 969

I would call a "normal" cbet but a potsizebet? I think I would fold without any reads after 3 hands.
as played I wait a few seconds and then I fold on the turn.

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12-13-2011 , 08:05 AM

#15

zorzak

adept

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,193

yeah exactly i'm never folding this to a normal sized bet. but when he pots it, how often can we expect him to check on the turn. not very often in my experience. and if we are folding on such blank turns, as the 3 of spades, i dont think our flop call is good.

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12-13-2011 , 08:21 AM

#16

damanrico

journeyman

Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 287

Quote:

Originally Posted by zorzak

Sounds like you answered your own question.
When someone 3bets me in the 3rd hand I'm assuming his range is much, much wider than TT+. It just makes more sense that his range is fairly wide.
This leads me to almost always shipping the turn here, since he's repping such a narrow range. And yes, I do expect unknowns to barrel this turn with air, overs and what not, a lot. Regs on the other hand probably won't.

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12-13-2011 , 08:39 AM

#17

chaosad

adept

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 969

But it is really worth to find this out and jam on the turn?
we played only 3 hands so far and we dont have any read, so why should we risk all the stack only with 2nd pair?

Maybe I´m really weak in this spots, but most of the time he will not give up after his potbet and we cant expect an free turn and river here.

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12-13-2011 , 10:11 AM

#18

Orsulab3rt

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,306

After 3 hands 3b pot he cbet pot i fold here line is to strong for 2 pair imo
esp if i think he gonna fire on turn even hand like JQ have something like 40% equity.

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