Very few players are making >$60/h at spin 'n go's. Almost no-one is making $100/h.

(After factoring in effective rake & what they pay stables/ EV insurance.)

I'd say out of the regular pool at 100's, the high majority is playing at <30$/h.

True.

Isn’t freeqz making more than 30$/hr on 30s? I find it hard to believe anyone on 100s makes $30/hr longterm. If so they should move down already. They will probably make similar or better hourly.

a big reason why i quit was i put in some calculations to see what kind of w/r you would need to make 40-50/hr and you needed an insane wr at 60s/100 to maintain that after splitting with backers.. just wasn't worth it

What hourlys are possible @mtts online ?

anyone making $30/hr playing 100s should not be playing these stakes

@youngdagger https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/1...ments-1700025/

By your 30s graph and your personal experience about exploits. Do you think positive red line is better for lower stakes ?

And did you try blue line positive and red positive but not as much as blue line style ?

You did good in the first challenge with this style.

I tested a lot of different styles.
Even this one at 100s



It is all worst than GTO.
At low stakes all depends on your skills.
There is no point to focus on redline, because a lot of players not firing with polarized ranges.
Much easier play with positive redline at 60-100s because you can calldown regs with high frequency.
At 30- it will be rather bad idea.
I have repeatedly said that the best players play with negative redline, some in a strong falling.
And I barely know the regulars with good results who has it strong positive redline.
This is not an indicator of problems in the game.
Maybe I'm wrong.
When I played GTO my redline was in - or around 0.
I can put it back in the sky and it's not bet bet bet in every pot.
But I'm tired of experimenting and wandering in the dark forest.
I don't want to come up with anything else when you can just open the solver and see how to play the hand.
And I don't care what the redline is after that.

What was the redline if you just filtered it for 3handed play in the above graph sample?

I meant this graph: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/c...a8252ade80.png

You have more chipev in the first segment "redline positive" and worst chipev in the last segment redline negative, thats why im asking.

Its weird, you said redline positive is worst at 30s - :s

I dont really care about redline or blueline, but this graph makes me curious about redline style in lower stakes. Can you explain why this style works for you in 30s and blueline sick positive was the worst ?

Winamax


I think one should be careful with adopting a "style". Playing sound poker and exploiting available freqs will lead to different graph compositions depending on the playerpool. For example here is my graph from 25s on winamax. On stars my redline is breakeven since the playerpool is way different and more aggressive.

Stars

I mean, it's a bad idea to calldown wide at 30s-.
I think positive redline is ok and looks sexy.
But where did I end up trying to play exploit?
Somewhere at the bottom.
I'll be there to collect my shattered teeth on the lowstakes.

What chance was to get a such bad run, if I did not deviate from the GTO, but rather pumped it and became tougher?
I think the odds are about 1% or less.
It really annoys me now.
This is a question of a long-term approach.
A player who studies 24/7 GTO and 24/7 exploit.
The first have more more more good chances to rise stakes and crush game.

But I do not claim that the exploit itself does not work.
I think it is solely in me, in my approaches, tools, and abilities.
Maybe somewhere on a fundamental level I'm wrong and everything collapses.
Or 10 tables act as a barrier to unlocking the potential of the exploit.

40 CEV, 4 tabling, excluding top 3 JP's, 70/30 split, makes $30/h

I think this is reasonably in line with the situation most regulars (especially those swinging between 60s and 100s are in). Fwiw, i do think 100's are beatable, and I could believe some people are crushing them for >$60/h, but at eg 60 CEV 2 tabling, you don't get there.

Sorry for the derail, but i think this is fairly interesting, and some people completely overestimate what's possible on midstakes spins.

Hey freeq.

You said, instantGTO is your favorite study tool now.

How similar to GTODB is ? Can you upload your hands and find leaks and population tendencies like GTODB and exploits ? or its more like pure GTO soft

Its is perfect for HH review.
You end your session/work day, export hands where you invest more than 100-150 chips and upload into InstaGTO.
And software tell you how bad EV/FD(frequency) you played compare with GTO.

Pretty useful GTO trainer, you create situation like Limp-skip cbet-oop probe and play only this one against InstaGTO
But it is still not similar with GTODB.
You cannot find leaks and tendencies.

Hi, how to buy GTODB software, i search it on google but the website is down

the service is terminated

skier sold it to a small private group of players. its not public anymore.

waoh this is breaking news to my eyes
additional info ?
at least gtodb calcs werent top notch

Update:

I'm so FAAAAAAAAR below the pace.
Probably there will be 1-2 more tries to REANIMATION 222K challenge.

Plan:
1. Grind 30s till 50K overall EV
2. Reach pace 777-1500 spins per day
3. Achieve new records 25-30-35-40K games per month
4. Not losing my mind.
5. Study the new GTO solutions ~2000 boards and regularly do it.
Also review hands in InstaGTO once or twice a week.

Today challenge results:



Checkpoints:

11.11.2018 - 4581 Games / -14300$ Net Won / -3017$ EV / 69 hours
21.11.2018 - 10100 Games / -9700$ Net Won / +4087$ EV / 144,5 Hours
07.12.2018 - 14570 Games / -12470$ Net Won / +4735$ EV / 210 Hours
09.01.2019 - 20471 Games / +7760$ Net Won / +12800$ EV / ~320 Hours
12.03.2019 - 30000 Games / +1702$ Net Won / +14263$ EV / Hours counting is not possible anymore, PT4 loading so f7cking hard

Next update 1 April.

Streams ON in 1-2 days.

And with recent PokerStars changes need to memorize Nash Chart.
If someone miss this one, it is prohibited since 4 March.
Obviously most of regs don't care about it and continue to play with it.

I analyzed what i can to do and there is some key points
Divided them into yellow and red zones.
Yellow-those that are rarely used, or played on GTO charts.
Red-the most used.

We have a matrix of 13x13 = 169 values
In the push the same values 20bb+ = 82
In the call chart = 41
I discount the yellow zone and counted the number of unique red combos
Total 57 push + 108 calls = 165.
In general, it is not so difficult to remember 165 numbers.
But need a regularity and constantly to repeat
(possible errors +-3 combos)

How are your results at 30s playing GTO vs all ?


gl gl