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Old 11-18-2018, 06:24 PM   #51
ChicagoRy
 
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

I think you're mixing things up here. Spinlyzer wasn't inaccurate or manipulated as far as I know. The spin4play thing you're thinking of is that people literally chip dumped to him. I think that was also after Spinlyzer ceased service.
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Old 11-19-2018, 04:49 AM   #52
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

While I have no 100% proof (how can one have without having at least tens of millions of hands?) it was gossiped a lot in the community spinlyzer is not always legit cause they had connections with big stables, and sometimes masked data as per request. With the average folk of course it was kinda accurate. Thats why ppl checked themselves and said ohh its legit. if you think you come to the same conclusion, thats why they could sell that crap for years, making lots of money.

With the big winners who used solvers/were bots/ were part of stables and used any illegal stuff? We cant be sure as my guess is is not too many talented programmers are in gray or black market poker business (usually the ones with bad work/life ethics otherwise working on other projects for lot more money/status) so I would not be surprised couple of kingpins are behind most black market stuff - realtime solvers, illegal online databases etc


They basically stole data from pokerstars and sold it illegally on the internet. Thats a company i would trust especially when it comes to big winners in the highest stakes available that time lol

Did it have merit in using? Sure to see who is total fish or reg. But to get conclusions about crushers strategy lol its funny to even type.

Last edited by TRT Boss; 11-19-2018 at 04:54 AM.
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Old 11-19-2018, 05:15 AM   #53
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Idk anything about Spinlyzer, but here is the graph of 2 knows bots on Winamax on the games I played against them :





If 3 players were playing perfect GTO together in spins, they would all have a loosing red line 3handed and a breakeven redline HU.


Personnaly I started spins with a strong winning red line, but the more I know about spins the more my redline is getting breakevenish.
It depends what type of opponents you play aswell, more you play fish HU the more your redline will increase I guess.
Depends how though are your regs aswell obv.
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Old 11-19-2018, 06:40 AM   #54
valuecutting
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by WeeBey View Post
If 3 players were playing perfect GTO together in spins, they would all have a loosing red line 3handed and a breakeven redline HU.
chips are zero sum, not all 3 players can have a losing redline
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Old 11-19-2018, 07:22 AM   #55
valuecutting
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

actually i was wrong, the sb can lose redline when he folds and the bb vs btn will win it as blueline at showdown

or sb vs btn will also result in the same
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:46 PM   #56
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by valuecutting View Post
actually i was wrong, the sb can lose redline when he folds and the bb vs btn will win it as blueline at showdown

or sb vs btn will also result in the same
Any multiway pot which is HU at showdown will result in one player losing red line and the other two players red line remains untouched from it

btn raises to 100 pre, both blinds call. Blinds gii on flop, btn folds. Btn red line: -100 chips. blinds red lines: +-0

I believe this is the case, at least. I don't think the tracking software churns through HH's in an advanced enough way and divide "red-line chips" off in "blue-line pots"
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Old 11-21-2018, 12:18 AM   #57
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

10k / 222k

Last 10 days was pushing the limit of 30$.
Field good, results too
Have drop x100, lost.
Tried a lot of exploits, especially against fish on 30$.
During this marathon, the study rate increases several times, as everything can be analyze instantly in PT4 DB.

The second challenge in a row I get a very hard start.
But this time I will fight and move on.

Then plan to play 30$ to 10K EV this month.
See the results of this month's pools at 60-100$.
If the average winrates are ok, I will add 100$ again.
But in the meantime, I'm in Save Mode will quietly farm 30$.
+5K EV per 10 days very good for such a limit.

Graph of chip no longer going to post.
Therefore, only the overall picture.

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Old 11-21-2018, 12:20 AM   #58
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Checkpoints:

11.11.2018 - 4581 Games / -14300$ Net Won / -3017$ EV / 69 hours
21.11.2018 - 10100 Games / -9700$ Net Won / +4087$ EV / 144,5 Hours
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Old 11-21-2018, 06:04 AM   #59
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

51 cev playing 10 tables without hud, that's very good results I'd say. Congratz and keep on going!
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Old 11-21-2018, 12:11 PM   #60
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Amazing results at 30s, 10 tables.. gg and keep crushing !
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:41 PM   #61
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

How many spins do u need to review the database and take a conclusion about it ?
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Old 11-21-2018, 07:38 PM   #62
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by youngdaggerdick View Post
How many spins do u need to review the database and take a conclusion about it ?
I have a lot custom filters made by myself.
Like "delay turn cbet with no equity bluffs" such as KT9 board and i hold 32-42o etc.
Calldowns, bluffraises and etc.
I make notes on 10K games how is the winrate and the behavior of the graph lines.
And if I add some overbluff or overcall, then immediately tracking how it affects everything and compare with the GTO winrates that played before.

I mostly make conclusions on the basis of 5-10K games, but if i see that certain bias from the GTO immediately drops my winrate in a certain line, then abandon it.
While I can say that many regs are greatly mistaken in those or other adjustments and I'll go very far from all.

I think many regs have started using skier_5 for finding reg/fish leaks.
Using "EV Capture per decision" or simple "Relative Frequencies",
But a lot of things are not taken into account and it will be misleading.
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Old 11-22-2018, 11:49 PM   #63
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Can you show how to do the basic filters: SBvBB, BBvSB, BUvBB, BBvBU 3 handed ?

Also can you share your EV stat ? looks different about swongsim EV
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Old 11-24-2018, 08:16 PM   #64
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by youngdaggerdick View Post
Can you show how to do the basic filters: SBvBB, BBvSB, BUvBB, BBvBU 3 handed ?

Also can you share your EV stat ? looks different about swongsim EV
yo, will upload it soon
sorry for delay
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Old 11-25-2018, 02:34 AM   #65
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Do you really think the hourly would be worse playing 60's?
Can you elaborate on that ? you just imagine or you have sample to confirm that?
Would like to know your thoughts about these matters.

- NVM

Last edited by Narkwin; 11-25-2018 at 03:01 AM. Reason: -- AWNSERED ON STREAM --
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Old 11-26-2018, 03:51 AM   #66
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Narkwin View Post
Do you really think the hourly would be worse playing 60's?
Can you elaborate on that ? you just imagine or you have sample to confirm that?
Would like to know your thoughts about these matters.

- NVM
Could you share the response please? I am curious about it too.

Moreover how do you get CEV displayed on PT? I googled it and it said the CEV is same as all in Adjusted. However it displays only the total amount of chips over my sample instead of the chips I make per tournament. Did you custom created it or am I overlooking something?
Would highly appreciate your help freeqoone.

Keep up the good work and see you at the tables.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:08 AM   #67
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

30s > more games per hour > more cev > same ev $ or more than 60s and less variance
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:21 PM   #68
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by youngdaggerdick View Post
30s > more games per hour > more cev > same ev $ or more than 60s and less variance
If you don't have enough traffic to mass table them than you could at least mix em. So if you take only the hourly into consideration the edge must be significantly higher on the 30s to compensate half of the buyin. So my question was basically if the 60s are that tough that it is more profitable to play 30s.
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:18 AM   #69
FREEQONE
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by youngdaggerdick View Post
Can you show how to do the basic filters: SBvBB, BBvSB, BUvBB, BBvBU 3 handed ?

Also can you share your EV stat ? looks different about swongsim EV
yo, all filters + EV stat
(EV stat with NO JACKPOT probability, 0 of 1milly instead 1 of 1m games)

https://nofile.io/f/pSmW7PfHjCc/stats+bundle.rar

Filters with leakfinder
Presented with perfect EVBB/100 for Spin and Go 30$
You can change these numbers yourself if you wish

Last edited by FREEQONE; 11-27-2018 at 03:43 AM.
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:31 AM   #70
FREEQONE
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pl@yMoney View Post
Could you share the response please? I am curious about it too.

Moreover how do you get CEV displayed on PT? I googled it and it said the CEV is same as all in Adjusted. However it displays only the total amount of chips over my sample instead of the chips I make per tournament. Did you custom created it or am I overlooking something?
Would highly appreciate your help freeqoone.

Keep up the good work and see you at the tables.
Hi!
Explanation about my decision to play 30$ instead 60$.
This is AVG winrates of biggest russian school for Spin and Go for Nov'2018



I'm sure my results are somewhere close to these because I play 10 tables.
But now I have on 30$ about 48-50 chips/tourney

Lets calculate in SwongSim what i can expect:

60$, there is a lot less game than at 30$ or 100$, so i think it would be 65 games/hour



30$, 75 games/hour, 48 chipev



=======================

Summary:
60s : 47EV$/hr
30s: 58EV$/hr

Next one about variance.
I'm gonna play 15000 spins per month, what about variance?

60s

50% had a downswing greater than $10860
40% had a downswing greater than $11940
30% had a downswing greater than $13380
20% had a downswing greater than $15060
10% had a downswing greater than $17820
5% had a downswing greater than $20880
2.5% had a downswing greater than $24060
1% had a downswing greater than $28320

30s

50% had a downswing greater than $4170
40% had a downswing greater than $4560
30% had a downswing greater than $4980
20% had a downswing greater than $5580
10% had a downswing greater than $6660
5% had a downswing greater than $7620
2.5% had a downswing greater than $8520
1% had a downswing greater than $9420

I think it's obvious I'm risking a lot more money for no particular reason.
Therefore, it is more logical and rational to play 30$ and wait for a good moment to return to 100$
I hope this explanation is detailed enough.

Cheers
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:36 AM   #71
FREEQONE
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pl@yMoney View Post
Moreover how do you get CEV displayed on PT?
ChipEV stat.
You need to Import it in PT4 in top menu
"Configure -> Statistics -> (topline 'T-Players-Stats') then click Options -> Import"
Then you can add it anywhere, any report or infomation box in graph

https://nofile.io/f/YswZ5sXqeyy/chipEV.pt4stat

Last edited by FREEQONE; 11-27-2018 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 11-28-2018, 09:52 AM   #72
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

gl!
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Old 11-29-2018, 12:19 PM   #73
Pl@yMoney
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Quote:
Originally Posted by FREEQONE View Post
ChipEV stat.
You need to Import it in PT4 in top menu
"Configure -> Statistics -> (topline 'T-Players-Stats') then click Options -> Import"
Then you can add it anywhere, any report or infomation box in graph

https://nofile.io/f/YswZ5sXqeyy/chipEV.pt4stat
<3 Thanks for the detailed explanation and for the stat!
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Old 12-06-2018, 07:41 PM   #74
FREEQONE
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

Little update

Don't wanna talk too much.
Just a sh7tty 5k games.
I keep fighting.

I'm turning off chat during grind up to 25000 games.
I'm behind the pace (37 day 14.5k/18.5k tourn), so turning on the turbo mod.
Will add 11-12 table and grind more.

Next update 25000 games.



Checkpoints:

11.11.2018 - 4581 Games / -14300$ Net Won / -3017$ EV / 69 hours
21.11.2018 - 10100 Games / -9700$ Net Won / +4087$ EV / 144,5 Hours
07.12.2018 - 14570 Games / -12470$ Net Won / +4735$ EV / 210 Hours

Last edited by FREEQONE; 12-06-2018 at 07:51 PM.
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Old 12-06-2018, 08:45 PM   #75
FREEQONE
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Re: 222,222 Spin&Go Games: Endurance Challenge

On 30$ I tried 3 strategies and switched it in 3000-3500 games.
It turned out somehow so:



The last segment is strongly conjugated with the streak.
I think there is about 45 chipev just got to be.
UnderEV in chips also cuts the general EV.
Let's say you was eliminated in 3max AK<AJ, and the third sat fish, you flew out of the situation,
when could continue the match with 20evbb/100 against fish.
Therefore, my overall winrate has suffered from this.

In general, for myself decided that the red in the floor is not exactly my style.
Feeling with tied hands, strongly depend on strong cards and variance.
Red in 0 is a mix of GTO + exploit in obvious spots.
Red in the sky is basically a strong deviation from the GTO, constant pressure.
On 30$ people very bad play, I think I shouldn't go higher until it breaks point 50 chipev 10K games.
Therefore, I continue to work here until I find the optimal combination of a 10-12 tables and winrate.

Last edited by FREEQONE; 12-06-2018 at 08:52 PM.
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